Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #33

[gitana1]

It was so hard to write this so you could understand. I used their words, let me try to paraphrase. There are different ways to drain the tanks. In order to protect the evidence from harm, they said they probably brought in a pumping truck, and completely removed all the oil out of of the tank into the truck. That would take 8 hours. Of course, C.W. didn’t have a truck to drain the oil into, so in order to drain the oil, he could use the pump between the 2 tanks and empty one into the other. Then he would have to unscrew the 64 bolts on the rectangular Manway, then place the child in tank. Then he’d have to screw the 64 bolts back on again. This would take well over an hour to accomplish. Because the girls were in 2 separate tanks, CW would have had to do it twice. Now we’re talking over 2 hours. For that reason, the expert believes C.W. didn’t have enough time to do that, so he had to have used the 8” holes at the tops of the tanks, and in order to fit the girls in such a small opening, he would have had to contort their bodies, @MassGuy @Tigerlily75

It's very sad.

How do they know all this?

 

[UnicornShoe]

I can tell you that. I write knitting patterns. 16 to 18 inches circumference. That is just average.
That is for a four year old. Average only.

If diameter is 8", then circumference would be 25.12 inches I believe? So large enough for the heads to go through easily. But the rest of the body? It's a stretch. Then again, remember "Baby Jessica" from the '80's? She was a toddler and fell into an 8" diameter well hole. So I would guess it's possible. https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/baby-jessica-rescued-from-a-well-as-the-world-watches

 

[gitana1]

Plus didn't they say both tanks were relatively full?? So he wouldn't have been able to drain one into the other even if he had time, which we know he didn't. So he almost certainly would have had to use the top opening...

So one method would solidify premeditation but the other would certainly show utter depravity of soul.

Just imagine. Jamming the bodies of your own flesh and blood babies into an opening to hide them. Is that what the footprint on the bag was about? And the request for his foot prints? Were there marks from him using his body weight to jam them through a hole?

I can't. This is horrible. I really hope it's not true.

 

[FlossyMay]

LOl - low-rent rendezvous. But we also have OW co-worker to consider and if she is someone he set his sights on as his new target, he may have decided to step it up to woo her and he may have sprung for someplace like Applebees - lol. A dinner and beverages for two plus tip would be around $40. If he did this 7 nights a week for 5 weeks, that would be $1,400. That's before alcoholic beverages, and any gifts or flowers he might have bought her.

In addition, I'm not familiar with how these meet up apps work (and I never intend to become familiar with them, either!), but is there a fee to join? That would be hard to explain to a wife who was paying the bills and looking at debit and credit card statements, IMO.

Dang, cheating is expensive. Yes, there are many free dating apps.

 

[katydid23]

If diameter is 8", then circumference would be 25.12 inches I believe? So large enough for the heads to go through easily. But the rest of the body? It's a stretch. Then again, remember "Baby Jessica" from the '80's? She was a toddler and fell into an 8" diameter well hole. So I would guess it's possible. https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/baby-jessica-rescued-from-a-well-as-the-world-watches

Right. But I think baby Jessica was only about 18 months old. These girls were 3 and 4.

 

[roteone]

[UOTE="kkdj, post: 14430076, member: 87292"]The more I learn about the case the more I think it was premeditated.[/QUOTE]
I'm with you, I indicated way back I didn't think it was, but have changed my mind somewhat.
I messed up my quote.

 

[gitana1]

Just a minute though. The affidavit said he's charged with "tampering with a deceased human body". If he did do as people are saying i.e. forcing the kids in the oil tank then would the charge not be "mutilation of a corpse"?

No. That would be the same charge:

2016 Colorado Revised Statutes :: Title 18 - :: Criminal Code :: Article 8 - :: Offenses - Governmental Operations :: Part 6 - :: Offenses Relating to Judicial and Other Proceedings :: § 18-8-610.5. Tampering with a deceased human body

 

[MsBetsy]

That doesn't make sense. The statement that he or she knew from the beginning is not vague. It appears to mean he or she was aware of the affair from it's inception.

The later modification of that statement to "I knew when everyone else did." is what's vague. Who is everyone else? If he or she meant the public, then that's a complete contradiction from the first post.

So which is correct?

I thought it said SW knew from the beginning. Maybe I read it wrong...... never mind. Just went back and read it and it says SW knew before her trip.

 

[The Saint]

This is why the DA is asking to the court to keep them private until trial, IMO.

Also what injury may have happened to Nico, besides the strangulation - fist punch, or kick to SWs womb. I'm sure Nico had a traumatic, horrible death too. He would have been flooded with SW's cortisol and then cut off from his life supply when she died.

 

[gitana1]

Those charges, we have to remember, were brought right after the locations were found. So I can completely seeing them perhaps adding such charges on now that the bodies have been completely analyzed, as well as the oil tanks themselves. I think based on his own confession, they know he for a fact tampered with the bodies because he admitted to relocating them and disposing of them. This bit about the tanks and the 8 inch openings, if in fact true, can certainly be a basis for such a charge, if CO does have one with that wording (I can def research this; I'm in CA so I am only familiar with our criminal laws).

ETA: Completely see***

It's the same exact charge:

Universal Citation: CO Rev Stat § 18-8-610.5 (2016)
(1) A person commits tampering with a deceased human body if, believing that an official proceeding is pending, in progress, or about to be instituted and acting without legal right or authority, the person willfully destroys, mutilates, conceals, removes, or alters a human body, part of a human body, or human remains with intent to impair its or their appearance or availability in the official proceedings.

 

[cailleach]

If diameter is 8", then circumference would be 25.12 inches I believe? So large enough for the heads to go through easily. But the rest of the body? It's a stretch. Then again, remember "Baby Jessica" from the '80's? She was a toddler and fell into an 8" diameter well hole. So I would guess it's possible. https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/baby-jessica-rescued-from-a-well-as-the-world-watches

Baby Jessica was 18 months old, not three and four years old.

 

[The Saint]

I agree. An as aside, the other day there was discussion about who handled the finances in the family - CW or SW. My thoughts are that CW was in control of the money because he needed to be to hide his extra-marital activity from SW. In the months before this all happened, SW seemed confused and was questioning a couple of friends about whether CW could be having an affair and then it seem she talked talked herself out of that idea.

JMO, if SW was the one who handled the finances, she would have known that money was missing and he would not have been able to account for it. She would have figured out what was going on with him much sooner. Affairs cost money.

My opinion is he kept SW in the dark for as long as he could.

I think SW was in control of the family dfinances. She managed (or co-managed 4 tire rim shop locations in NC at age 22).

 

[roteone]

Also what injury may have happened to Nico, besides the strangulation - fist punch, or kick to SWs womb. I'm sure Nico had a traumatic, horrible death too. He would have been flooded with SW's cortisol and then cut off from his life supply when she died.

When I read that I cannot even comprehend his brain.

 

[Johnny1181]

Usually, we are able to see ALL of our VI's posts anytime we want. Usually we can click on somene's name, go to their profile page, and then

delete dupe

maybe they got tired and disgusted, perhaps overwhelmed and tired of watching their dear murdered friend and her babies being diagnosed, accused, judged, and blamed

Maybe they pictured their beloved friend who was buried in shallow dirt strangled with her beloved son Nico, and her baby girls who she devoted her life to dumped in oil... being dug up and accused by the man she loved of being responsible and the horror she would have felt at that. Then came to a random website and read people validating just that.

Based on loving and honest SM posts.

And decided to change their account, leave, and live to shine like Shanann instead.

imo

 

[UnicornShoe]

Baby Jessica was 18 months old, not three and four years old.

I know. It's just easier to imagine that he slid them in easily, rather than doing whatever he must have done to make them fit

 

[katydid23]

so the good news ies that the defense lost their motion to keep the handprints and all that out of the states reach. Too bad....

 

[katydid23]

maybe they got tired and disgusted, perhaps overwhelmed and tired of watching their dear murdered friend and her babies being diagnosed, accused, judged, and blamed

Maybe they pictured their beloved friend who was buried in shallow dirt strangled with her beloved son Nico, and her baby girls who she devoted her life to dumped in oil... being dug up and accused by the man she loved of being responsible and the horror she would have felt at that. Then came to a random website and read people validating just that.

And decided to change their account, leave, and live to shine like Shanann instead.

imo

I doubt that's what happened..

 

[The Saint]

Shaman often refers to taking the kids to school. We know that Bella was actually supposed to start kindergarten a week or so from that fateful Sunday/Monday... and with Cece one year younger... what kind of school. With shanann as a SAHM were the kids in daycare anyway?

Bella was about to start kindergarten at a private school. I'm not clear about the plans for CeCe --- what daycare and what days + hours.

 

[Johnny1181]

I doubt that's what happened..

Oh I'm certain that's what happened.

 

[gitana1]

Great point @Allabouttrial
There appears to be a distinction between the two definitions:


Mutilation of corpse is a wrong of willfully, recklessly, wantonly, unlawfully, or negligently dismembering or disfiguring by cutting, scratching, or mishandling the body of a dead person. It is an offense of dissecting or dismembering, without authority, the dead body of a person.


A person commits tampering with a deceased human body if, believing that an official proceeding is pending, in progress, or about to be instituted and acting without legal right or authority, the person willfully destroys, mutilates, conceals, removes, or alters a human body, part of a human body, or human remains with intent to impair its or their appearance or availability in the official proceedings.”

Could you provid a cite please.

I found no law in Colorado called "mutiliation of a corpse".

I did, however, find your exact wording of "mutilation of a corpse" in an online legal dictionary site.

But that's not actual law. It's just a legal website definition. It has nothing to do with Colorado law, which you did correctly cite in your second quote.
Mutilation of Corpse Law and Legal Definition | USLegal, Inc.

If I am misinformed provide a cite.