Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #36

[bonjoviblonde]

So if a VI seemed closer to SW you would take that more at value or equal value?

I wouldn't take it as more value necessarily but I would probably be more apt to believe what, for example, a friend of SW says as opposed to say CW's mother or a sibling. I would also say that in regards to a friend of CW opposed to say SW's mother. Of course family members are biased and that's totally fine and expected. I'm not saying anyone is a family member and VI's are anonymous as they should be. I think for most people it's just harder to judge people's words when they don't know who people are no matter what "side" of the story they are on.

ETA: Also wanted to add that it's not just about believing a VI. They have their own impression of a person they know and how well they know them and how deep their feelings for them go. They also may not only go by what they've observed but also what they've been told in regards to another person, which may or may not always be the truth. The bottom line is that we here can choose who and what to believe and we don't all have to agree, just be respectful.

 

[Deleted member 230544]

I will ask him when I see him.

<modsnip - do not tag the member whose post you are quoting> Thanks

 

[human]

I am not a licensed attorney to speak to that, but I would think that a strong defense would be highly concerned about public perception and a potential jury pool to come from it. I believe, correct me if I am wrong, that criminal defense attorneys in high profile cases where MSM is not promoting anything defending their client would be remiss in their duties (though not legally remiss) to not try and put out a more favorable perception of their client if they can. Attorneys?

Everyone with a positive would be dismissed then by the prosecution?

 

[Ilovemy3boys]

If you are referring to @Trinket78, I believe she had stated she knew both CW & SW.

It’s true she knew both, but she takes CW’s side and doesn’t seem so much a SHANANN fan.

 

[mtnlites]

@BabyButterfly It appears to me that it has become too easy to declare bankruptcy these days.

It really isn't. It's expensive, public, time consuming, embarassing, and CAN be denied. Just because you file doesn't mean it will be accepted. However, once it's finished, it can be a relief-especially if you've spent years trying to work things out with your debtors.

Source: going through chapter 7 right now.

 

[Marli61]

We were talking about if they had divorced. Before he murdered her.

Gotcha thanks!

 

[Shekkiec]

Watching AB - FBI

Where are you getting the $397,000 figure? I have $392,709. ? Also, I just tried to pull up the taxes and it looks like the server is down, but I looked at them back in Thread #3 and remember them being somewhere around $3,000 - $3,500 vs. $4,000, which would also make the monthly payment less.
MOO

In all fairness the interest rate could vary up to 10% as well . When I did my figures I included link so anyone else could figure as well. I did mortgages for over 12 years . It is my experience most use FHA to have a small down payment and the credit score rating can be substantially lower some loans require up to 720 as a score. In the long run unless you put 20% down they cost more. We also know HOA fees and insurance for property can be added to this figure which I did not. I did account they paid the MIP upfront and closing cost both of those if not paid can make payment more. It may have been when financed they both made more money since she had a hospital job she retired from to work LeVel orbperhsps LeVel made more for her I am not sure.

 

[Amonet]

I think it is symbolic of the contempt he felt for them.

I think it's symbolic that he literally wanted them out of sight and out of mind.

NB that's referring to AB show talking about possible symbolism in the tank 'burials'.

 

[gitana1]

If you are referring to @Trinket78, I believe she had stated she knew both CW & SW.

Knowing and being close with are two different things. I am not asking so please no yells that I'm trying to ID someone but rhetorically, was the VI friends with her or did they live in CO and have close contact? If not, people who were friends and saw her with more frequency may know her better.

And depending on relationships, people can be biased in favor or against someone. We don't know because we don't know the relationships.

 

[NuttMegg]

Gotcha thanks!

There was a lot of discussion as to how hard or easy it would have been for her to get insurance had she divorced him. IMO the consensus was that it would not have been hard to get ACA in Colorado, and the price would depend on her income. And that the kids would have legally been able to continue on CW's insurance. That might be if he had welcomed that idea. Or they might be eligible for Medicaid.

 

[Shekkiec]

In all fairness the interest rate could vary up to 10% as well . When I did my figures I included link so anyone else could figure as well. I did mortgages for over 12 years . It is my experience most use FHA to have a small down payment and the credit score rating can be substantially lower some loans require up to 720 as a score. In the long run unless you put 20% down they cost more. We also know HOA fees and insurance for property can be added to this figure which I did not. I did account they paid the MIP upfront and closing cost both of those if not paid can make payment more. It may have been when financed they both made more money since she had a hospital job she retired from to work LeVel orbperhsps LeVel made more for her I am not sure.

Regardless it is a mortgage payment I would not want moo

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you for confirming the timing. This was the first thing I’ve seen that convinced me of their financial distress. What I didn’t see were any notices of Public Sale. Perhaps they were abiding by the plan they worked out in Court for awhile. People are saying their payment was near 3000. Part of that could be their repayment plans in settling their debts.

You are not required to pay back anything if you file chapter 7. The 3000 was their regular mortgage payment, as I understood it. Imo

 

[human]

EWW

AB just said that CW as well as Shanann’s family, may have to speak on the phone during the telephone probate hearing, to deal with their assets.

Edited to clarify that it’s not CW’s family, but he himself.

The life insurance company itself will not let him profit. He has admitted to killing her.

They do their own investigations. It will be interesting if he wants to fight the family on it

 

[Best of What's Around]

@BabyButterfly It would be of interest to know what specifically lead your hubby to make the observation that CW was gay as it seems to be a sticking point in this case as to motive.

Respectfully, it has been said it was a simple personal impression by someone who does not know CW. We all know this does not equal evidence of sexual orientation, so I do not see how picking this apart goes to motive. IMO

 

[MsBetsy]

Equal. Unless they were one sided, in which case I might be inclined to believe that there was more in play. If they say positive things about one, and are limited in their negativity towards the other, that strikes me as far more believable than the alternative.

Either way, they don't change my view here, as I focus on what I know to be true, as opposed to personal observations.

Also considering it is just one person it does not hold much weight for me. Imo

 

[human]

No. Shanann’s prolific Facebook postings are being used against her. He conveniently has no visible social media footprint to analyze.

I imagine they will be or have been retrieved by LE.

His twitter postings were boring. Sports, mainly

 

[MassGuy]

The life insurance company itself will not let him profit. He has admitted to killing her.

They do their own investigations. It will be interesting if he wants to fight the family on it

It's not like he doesn't have bigger fish to fry.

 

[gitana1]

@gitana1 Granted it will take due process and time to get to this point but the Slayer Rules states the following:


While convicting someone of the crime of murder requires proof beyond a reasonable doubt, the slayer rule applies to civil law, not criminal law, so it is only necessary to prove the wrongful killing by a preponderance of the evidence, as in a wrongful death claim. This means that even a slayer who is acquitted of the murder in criminal court can still be divested of the inheritance by the civil court administering the estate.

Slayer rule - Wikipedia

Oh that's right! That came into play with the Sheila Mack case!

So the slayer rule will be invoked during the probate proceedings and a determination as to whether there is a preponderance of the evidence as to the killing will take place in probate court and be a part from the criminal determination. Hmmm.

I wonder. CW will have to invoke. Will that be grounds to suspend probate proceedings until after the criminal case concludes or does it mean that info that the state otherwise can't discuss prior to trial can come out in public probate proceedings?

Let's see what happens.

 

[katydid23]

If you are referring to @Trinket78, I believe she had stated she knew both CW & SW.

True. But she also knew about CW and his AP, from the start. So that makes me think she was much closer to CW than to SW. So I have to think that her opinions concerning SW might be a bit biased, in favor of CW.

 

[MerryB]

You are not required to pay back anything if you file chapter 7. The 3000 was their regular mortgage payment, as I understood it. Imo

Right. I do not understand how they would’ve reaffirmed this debt (the mortgage) with less than $1000 in their checking accounts.