Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #37

[riolove77]

This article also states all those interviewed had no indication of anything like this happening. I feel the interviews which were after he killed his wife were deceitful bc we know he lied . The interviews were strange to hear for us so those knowing him had to sense something different as well imo. We do not know how that information was gained by Thayers . Perhaps it was she who asked C.W. “are you having financial problems?” (Example question is in quotes this is not a quote from AT) and that is a snipped sentence from hours of conversation between them not a yay I’m selling the House moment imo

I mean it's basically a given that the Thayers and no one else saw this coming, when his own wife clearly didn't even see it coming...the point is, he spoke to them on Monday, the day his family was "missing" (aka murdered) about selling the home. In what context would that be okay when your friends are scrambling to find your wife and kids, and you're on your phone and eating pizza and sleeping through the night? It's just a stretch at this point to try and say his actions are being taken out of context. The context of the big picture has plenty of evidence, and it is within that context that all of these other details fall.

 

[Layla123]

Yes, quite pointless to ask questions of a proven liar. You might as well go question your sidewalk. What would you hope to gain? I guess you could ask, "Pizza or a burger for your last meal?"
MOO

If I could ask CW one question, I would ask him, “Tell me exactly what happened from the moment after you noticed Shanann strangling CeCe until the moment you drove away from the oil field on your way to work.” I know he’d be lying, but I still want to hear this story he wants everyone to believe.

 

[Amandaaa]

There is a lot of SM to peruse, I just don't see it supporting anything but their somewhat normal young parents' life, in debt, with kids, show happy faces for the camera. I can't believe the defense would present the "theories" that child abuse should be investigated because the kids were having fun on a water slide, because SW told CW to move around or do things during filming, that somehow using a lot of doctors is ominous behavior. I see the SM as benefitting the prosecution, if used much at all. The defense doesn't want the jury to see those cute little kids acting like kids and singing happy songs to him. Of course, who am I.

Agreed. People are picking apart both sides but overall, I just see a young married couple with little kids. The usual ups and downs, marital/parenting gripes and maybe a bit of over-sharing... but overall nothing really relevant to either side.

SM absolutely *can* have an enormous impact on cases - I just don’t see it here.

 

[JudgeJudi]

@NuttMegg

“He is a coward. I wish he had committed suicide”.

I don’t. He’s destroyed the lives of his wife and unborn baby plus his two little girls. He’s shattered the lives of not only SW’s family but also that of his own family, all of whom will have to live with what he’s done forever. He needs to pay dearly for his cruel and evil acts and that means imprisonment for the rest of his life, and I hope it’s a very long one.

 

[Madison418]

That sounds more like it!

Yeah, I feel like he was freaking out knowing he was about to get caught and wanted to get there before them

 

[gitana1]

MY posts? I don’t believe I’ve ever said any of those things.

I'm asking your opinion. I think it is helpful for all the attorneys to clarify their positions because there have been a few posters suggesting or appearing to believe that's what was going on.

Your opinion is respected here. I think it would be valuable for everyone to hear what you think.

 

[ZsaZsa]

In regard to autopsies I find it

Perhaps it was shock? panic? Perhaps he felt no one would believe him bc he had killed his wife. Perhaps he thought people will think I annihilated my whole family. I can not fathom how this unfolded between this beautiful couple. I do not see any preplan by either of them for this to happen. I feel imo moo moo she had a lot to lose as well by him leaving and Imo I would think defense would present that. The prosecution imo may say she threatened him bc of separation I don’t know. But imo the bedding could have been used/stripped to carry them in. Carrying them downstairs perhaps the separste sheet was thrown away as a reaction because it was laying on the floor and dropped or slipped away . I am not sure but he made no attempt to conceal or hide any evidence . Ex. Had the sheet been in the back of a basement closet in a tub with her purse , phone etc it would imo further show planning an alibi. Imo SW was well loved and extremely active on social media as well as with friends. Had the visit from NUA not happened he knew others were trying to contact her imo and would find it suspicious moo. He wasn’t rehearsed nor did he make it look as if she may have left him imo I believe he in panic mentioned her going to a friend’s bc there was no other reason they would not be there and it popped into his head. He imo knew it was suspicious. He knew he had killed his wife. He may have felt he had to engage in interviews and what would seem normal bc he didn’t feel normal after killing his wife, nor should he. He was immediately swept up in a whirlwind and now knew imo maybe he should have called 911 what should he do? He may have wanted to talk to his dad simply to make sure his dad heard it from him first imo we don’t know. Do we know how many interviews he had with police or the length of last interview?do we know if he went willingly?

Well he wasn't able to hide any evidence inside the home later that day because LE arrived there before he did. When he left that morning with the bodies he was hardly expecting to have LE on the doorstep within a few hours. IMO he thought he had all the time in the world to hide evidence.
He did hide the greatest evidence of his crimes. Three bodies.

 

[riolove77]

Question for our legal experts @gitana1 @Amandaaa @riolove77 @Mrspratcher and anyone else who is here:
I have seen a few posters suggest that the defense will claim that the THRIVE patches may have caused side effects that lead to CW and SW to both go homicidal at the same time. Is this really a viable suggestion the defense could use? I'm wondering, specifically, if defense could legally claim that during a trail without facing lawsuits from the LeVel company over making such a malicious claim about the product? They would have to prove that claim with experts right? Or can they randomly mention it in the opening/closing arguments without any evidence?

Side note: From what I have seen of the ingredients it is mostly caffeine and vitamins. So I doubt, IMO, that they will be able to claim it made anyone homicidal. But forget for a moment that the claim "my coffee made me do it" is a little ridiculous, if a defense lawyer claimed his client's Specific Brand Coffee was to blame (I.E. "My daily latte from Starbucks made me do it") wouldn't that open them up to lawsuits from the company? This is just something I wonder about evey time I see someone say THRIVE will be blamed. TIA for any insight you all can give.

Great question. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised. IIRC, there was a case of a husband last year who killed his wife "in his sleep" and blamed it on a specific brand of cough syrup, remember? The syrup company came out to deny that their product was unsafe or had ever caused anyone to commit murder, but I don't know that they took legal action against him. Then again, I am also unsure that case has gone to trial yet and whether the defense will use it, but I digress.

I wouldn't put it past the defense to use anything in this case, because they are up against SO much. It's kind of like the Anthony case. Those defense attorneys were ruthless, going so far as to accuse GA of molesting his granddaughter and being involved in the murder and coverup, all of which they had no evidence for. But perhaps that, or any other ridiculous thing they threw out during that trial, provided enough reasonable doubt for that jury (if you can call them that), since they did ultimately acquit her of EVERYTHING. So here, with the obviously ridiculous claim that CW is making (and I want to reiterate that I highly doubt he came up with this claim on his own...), the defense will do everything in their power to cast reasonable doubt. Obviously it's hard to say at this point what they might or might not do, but believe me, some crazy things come out in these trials...

 

[mickey2942]

Seriously, the defense can present a story that CW was abused, demeaned, that SW killed the children. That Thrive patches made him crazy, the elevation made him do it...whatever they want to say to present a vigorous defense. In the end, who hid three bodies, and lied?

 

[NuttMegg]

Question for our legal experts @gitana1 @Amandaaa @riolove77 @Mrspratcher and anyone else who is here:
I have seen a few posters suggest that the defense will claim that the THRIVE patches may have caused side effects that lead to CW and SW to both go homicidal at the same time. Is this really a viable suggestion the defense could use? I'm wondering, specifically, if defense could legally claim that during a trial without facing lawsuits from the LeVel company over making such a malicious claim about the product? They would have to prove that claim with experts right? Or can they randomly mention it in the opening/closing arguments without any evidence?

Side note: From what I have seen of the ingredients it is mostly caffeine and vitamins. So I doubt, IMO, that they will be able to claim it made anyone homicidal. But forget for a moment that the claim "my coffee made me do it" is a little ridiculous, if a defense lawyer claimed his client's Specific Brand Coffee was to blame (I.E. "My daily latte from Starbucks made me do it") wouldn't that open them up to lawsuits from the company? This is just something I wonder about evey time I see someone say THRIVE will be blamed. TIA for any insight you all can give.

Ask Oprah about knocking a meat diet on TV. And that wasn't even a specific brand name. I think you have a very good point, but am not one of the lawyers you address.

 

[kkdj]

Why would an adult strangle a child to murder them instead of suffocating them? The fact that CW said he strangled SW to death and that he saw her in the act of strangling one of the girls, (I believe he is lying) with the other already blue tells me he killed them all. All were done by the same MOD and it was the same person doing it...CW.

 

[Layla123]

Maybe he was speeding thru red lights, but if so, it was because he knew his goose was getting cooked and he wasn't ready.

I think the reason he said he sped through red lights was so everyone would think he was frightened and concerned. I imagine his inner dialogue was, “Oh, that was a good one.”

 

[Amandaaa]

I'm asking your opinion. I think it is helpful for all the attorneys to clarify their positions because there have been a few posters suggesting or appearing to believe that's what was going on.

Your opinion is respected here. I think it would be valuable for everyone to hear what you think.

Ah, sorry. I misunderstood.

As I said, I find it odd... is it possible it’s a delay tactic? Sure, it’s possible - but it would only be an extremely short delay... maybe there was something unexpected and they wanted a little extra time to button something up or research a little more. But that’s just a possibility, not necessarily my opinion of what happened. I do NOT think it was anything nefarious or that the prosecution would ever intentionally try to withhold something critical from the defense. I have never seen that happen before and have no reason to believe it would happen here.

 

[PommyMommy]

This case is going to get crazy with lack of info being released. I've seen a few articles in the last 24 hrs saying prosecution doesn't want reports released because they are horrendous I have seen reports that there is no DNA linking cw to children's murder .basically just people reporting their views. I think this is going to be a long case with alot of surprises

I have seen the same and it's plain ole shoddy journalism, sensationalism, click-bait or whatever you want to call it. Nowhere is the prosecution quoted as saying any of that, but people out there with a more-than-obvious agenda to defend a baby killer will still create a bunch of drama about it when one only needs to read the document.

MOO

 

[Best of What's Around]

In regard to autopsies I find it

Perhaps it was shock? panic? Perhaps he felt no one would believe him bc he had killed his wife. Perhaps he thought people will think I annihilated my whole family. I can not fathom how this unfolded between this beautiful couple. I do not see any preplan by either of them for this to happen. I feel imo moo moo she had a lot to lose as well by him leaving and Imo I would think defense would present that. The prosecution imo may say she threatened him bc of separation I don’t know. But imo the bedding could have been used/stripped to carry them in. Carrying them downstairs perhaps the separste sheet was thrown away as a reaction because it was laying on the floor and dropped or slipped away . I am not sure but he made no attempt to conceal or hide any evidence . Ex. Had the sheet been in the back of a basement closet in a tub with her purse , phone etc it would imo further show planning an alibi. Imo SW was well loved and extremely active on social media as well as with friends. Had the visit from NUA not happened he knew others were trying to contact her imo and would find it suspicious moo. He wasn’t rehearsed nor did he make it look as if she may have left him imo I believe he in panic mentioned her going to a friend’s bc there was no other reason they would not be there and it popped into his head. He imo knew it was suspicious. He knew he had killed his wife. He may have felt he had to engage in interviews and what would seem normal bc he didn’t feel normal after killing his wife, nor should he. He was immediately swept up in a whirlwind and now knew imo maybe he should have called 911 what should he do? He may have wanted to talk to his dad simply to make sure his dad heard it from him first imo we don’t know. Do we know how many interviews he had with police or the length of last interview?do we know if he went willingly?

BBM...point by point:
it was shock - he was in shock yet launched into a detailed plan that took tons of mental/physical energy and focus to hide the bodies and call his dead ex wife almost immediately acc to his own confession
no one would believe him - do we have a case where someone innocent hid and destroyed on purpose the only real evidence of their purported innocence?
he made no attempt to conceal or hide any evidence - to the contrary, he hid, concealed, and knowingly tried to DESTROY the only real evidence that could exonerate him if he were innocent - the bodies.
He wasn’t rehearsed - he repeated the same exact lines multiple times through multiple interviews and seem flustered when he had to deviate from those lines.
make it look as if she may have left him - he said in all 3 media interviews she may have left with the kids and told NUA and police they were separating
He imo knew it was suspicious - have to 100% agree with you here.
he should have called 911 what should he do - any loving father would have called 911 to save children before thinking of themselves and any POSSIBLE chance that LE would not believe him.

 

[Deleted member 182072]

Not sure if this has been posted yet:
Autopsy reports complete for Chris Watts' wife Shanann and daughters | Daily Mail Online

"There is a possibility that there may not be enough DNA evidence to secure a conviction in the murder of the two young girls, based on the fact that the bodies of Celeste and Bella had been submerged in an oil tank for three days before they were discovered by police."​

It makes me wonder again what CW was thinking when he put them in those oil tanks. But I seriously doubt he would have thought ahead to put their DNA under her nails (if there is any) and that he knew the oil might eliminate the evidence of him killing the girls. Surely his original plan wouldn't have been to be convicted of murdering his wife and tampering with their bodies even if he people bought his absurd "she did it" defense.

We do know that his plan A was to tell people that his pregnant wife took their girls and just left everything behind since he told both NUA and LE about a marital separation the day they went missing to float the idea she just left him. IMO JMO MOO

 

[Shekkiec]

His actions did not in any way resemble someone who is in shock or in a panic. He was able to think of a very good way to ensure the bodies were not easy to find. He didn't just toss them somewhere without any planning. He had the door locked in such a way that even someone with a key could not enter. He backed the truck up in the garage. He didn't rush out in a hurry. He may have hidden the cell phone. He must have been careful to not let anyone see him at the dump site, as no-one did. And last, as pointed out many times, strangulation takes time, and is not indicative of someone in a rage, or panic. Everything about his actions show that he was in control at all times, from the time of the murder through the time of the cover up. Imo

Imo I use the garage to enter my home most of the time . I also latch my door at night as a security measure I only release the latch when I am going for a walk with my puppy , getting the mail or expecting company If he did not expect NUA why latch it? I find it more evidence of concern from her friend bc it appeared SW had not started her day. This latch may have been a nightly routine not a preplanned effort by him imo, he backed up the truck into the garage yes why not throw her purse in there he needed to make sure that wasn’t seen right ?, I don’t know if he hid the cell phone in a couch bc imo I would have destroyed it , taken battery out not hid between cushions of sofa but we hopefully will hear how it got there, the dump site was a work area he had access to and he may have left directly after it happened in panic, strangulation does not always take time. We do not know if cause of death was from a neck break during strangulation or aphixiation all of this moo moo

 

[human]

If this means anything, there are many different marriage/premarriage/troubled marriage courses out there. A bit different in content but his presentation is pretty much "cliff notes" version of some of those courses. Which leads me to wonder if they (or SW and 1st husband) took a premarital course and used it for his presentation. Also, that would tie into if SW wrote it why she knew the material too.

Did they get married in a Catholic ceremony? I think premarital counseling is required.

 

[Gardener1850]

Great question. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised. IIRC, there was a case of a husband last year who killed his wife "in his sleep" and blamed it on a specific brand of cough syrup, remember? The syrup company came out to deny that their product was unsafe or had ever caused anyone to commit murder, but I don't know that they took legal action against him. Then again, I am also unsure that case has gone to trial yet and whether the defense will use it, but I digress.

I wouldn't put it past the defense to use anything in this case, because they are up against SO much. It's kind of like the Anthony case. Those defense attorneys were ruthless, going so far as to accuse GA of molesting his granddaughter and being involved in the murder and coverup, all of which they had no evidence for. But perhaps that, or any other ridiculous thing they threw out during that trial, provided enough reasonable doubt for that jury (if you can call them that), since they did ultimately acquit her of EVERYTHING. So here, with the obviously ridiculous claim that CW is making (and I want to reiterate that I highly doubt he came up with this claim on his own...), the defense will do everything in their power to cast reasonable doubt. Obviously it's hard to say at this point what they might or might not do, but believe me, some crazy things come out in these trials...

Thank you for your response Riolove. I do remember reading about that cough syrup case now that you mention it, but I couldn't tell you the brand of cough syrup. Seems really out there as a defense, IMO. But I guess we shouldn't put anything past the defense.

 

[gitana1]

Question for our legal experts @gitana1 @Amandaaa @riolove77 @Mrspratcher and anyone else who is here:
I have seen a few posters suggest that the defense will claim that the THRIVE patches may have caused side effects that lead to CW and SW to both go homicidal at the same time. Is this really a viable suggestion the defense could use? I'm wondering, specifically, if defense could legally claim that during a trial without facing lawsuits from the LeVel company over making such a malicious claim about the product? They would have to prove that claim with experts right? Or can they randomly mention it in the opening/closing arguments without any evidence?

Side note: From what I have seen of the ingredients it is mostly caffeine and vitamins. So I doubt, IMO, that they will be able to claim it made anyone homicidal. But forget for a moment that the claim "my coffee made me do it" is a little ridiculous, if a defense lawyer claimed his client's Specific Brand Coffee was to blame (I.E. "My daily latte from Starbucks made me do it") wouldn't that open them up to lawsuits from the company? This is just something I wonder about evey time I see someone say THRIVE will be blamed. TIA for any insight you all can give.

Sleeplessness and dehydration are the main ways people who AREN'T schizophrenic, become psychotic.

They can surely try to make such allegations via just touching on it opening statements (you cant being up in closing anything that hasn't been introduced into evidence) or via experts and they should not be liable in a civil lawsuit for such a theory.