Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #44

[bonjoviblonde]

If there is evidence in the autopsy reports that SW rather than CW murdered the children the air pretty much deflates from that "heinous" balloon. JMO

You don't think the jury will think his disposal method (or that he disposed of them at all) heinous. I do. Do you?

 

[Charlot123]

I think SW became homicidal that night because she learned her husband was leaving her for another woman and SW's "perfect" life was over. JMO

Put yourself in her shoes without assuming that she was some kind of a nut.

What goes through a person's head?

She is pregnant and has lupus. She needs health insurance and CW is the provider. So she needs to find another 9-5 job, ASAP. What about her business?

The house. Probably, sell it. The market is good.

Could she afford a divorce lawyer?

Who could help her out?

Someone needed to babysit the kids.

I think she'd think exactly like all of us would.

 

[mrjitty]

What we have to keep in mind is that if SW were suicidal and sought to kill her kids and commit suicide, she would have not concealed any of this.

So the police would have the evidence of it.

 

[Best of What's Around]

The irony is that by moving the bodies, he removed the evidence of her guilt

This makes no sense.

In such cases, the spouse normally colludes in this way to protect the other spouse.

Exactly. He tampered with and destroyed the very evidence he claims would exonerate him because he was afraid no one would believe him. And he showed no remorse, devastation, grief, etc, while simultaneously enacting a plan which included texting/calling his dead wife so everyone would think they were missing. It's almost as if he were the guilty party.

 

[mrjitty]

I have the feeling a lot of these discussions will become redundant when the prosecution opens its case and we get the feel for the full weight of evidence.

I also highly doubt the prosecution will go for any plea deal which does not include guilt for all 4 murders.

They already have him on 2 of them. There is no reason to take a plea for less than murder on the other 2

 

[katydid23]

Statistics are irrelevant to a jury. Marilyn Lemak had no police calls, DCF visits or involuntary committals. Neither did Susan Smith, who drowned her children because her boyfriend didn't want kids. JMO

Let's compare Susan Smith's childhood to SWs:


Susan Smith rarely had a stable home life growing up. Her father committed suicide when she was six years old, and Smith herself attempted suicide at age 13. Her mother then married Beverly Russell, a member of the local chapter of the Christian Coalition, who was later revealed to have molestedSmith when she was a teenager. One newspaper claimed that sexual relations between them had continued until six months before the murders.[5]

After graduating from high school in 1989, Smith made a second attempt to end her own life.[6] She married David Smith, and they had two sons. The relationship was rocky due to mutual allegations of infidelity, and they separated several times.[7]

 

[mrjitty]

Put yourself in her shoes without assuming that she was some kind of a nut.

What goes through a person's head?

She is pregnant and has lupus. She needs health insurance and CW is the provider. So she needs to find another 9-5 job, ASAP. What about her business?

The house. Probably, sell it. The market is good.

Could she afford a divorce lawyer?

Who could help her out?

Someone needed to babysit the kids.

I think she'd think exactly like all of us would.

My understanding from what I have read in the previous threads is she was earning OK from her current job?

And CW would of course have to pay maintenance and support his family.

 

[MassGuy]

My understanding from what I have read in the previous threads is she was earning OK from her current job?

And CW would of course have to pay maintenance and support his family.

This part is debatable. There was a previous bankruptcy, and we aren’t quite sure how much she was making.

Usually in family annihilator cases, there is some sort of financial struggle. I think that might have been in play here as well.

 

[mrjitty]

Exactly. He tampered with and destroyed the very evidence he claims would exonerate him because he was afraid no one would believe him. And he showed no remorse, devastation, grief, etc, while simultaneously enacting a plan which included texting/calling his dead wife so everyone would think they were missing. It's almost as if he were the guilty party.

Agreed.

If he killed his beloved wife in a rage and had just lost both his kids we would have seen in suffering tremendous grief.

 

[Best of What's Around]

My understanding from what I have read in the previous threads is she was earning OK from her current job?

And CW would of course have to pay maintenance and support his family.

Yes, and she had a very supportive family back in NC who would have welcomed her back with open arms if need be IMO.

 

[Best of What's Around]

Agreed.

If he killed his beloved wife in a rage and had just lost both his kids we would have seen in suffering tremendous grief.

Yes, but that is not what has been reported by those closest to him in the days following. Nor is it evident IMO in his 3 media interviews. If you have not seen them, I highly recommend going to youtube - they are brief and they are telling.

 

[bonjoviblonde]

I have the feeling a lot of these discussions will become redundant when the prosecution opens its case and we get the feel for the full weight of evidence.

I also highly doubt the prosecution will go for any plea deal which does not include guilt for all 4 murders.

They already have him on 2 of them. There is no reason to take a plea for less than murder on the other 2

I agree. It's also seems like at trial some people are expecting to hear all of this top secret terrible information about SW and just ignoring the fact that CW is the one on trial and we will be seeing and hearing a truckload of information on this monster. I hope his supporters are prepared for that, because if they are ignoring the facts and evidence of what we know so far, they are sure to be in for a world of hurt when it all comes out.

 

[katydid23]

I doubt the shirt or the ambushing of CW with a camera in his face will be irrelevant at trial.

A friend knows only what SW told her and by that time, SW may have known about the AP. JMO

Why would a video of the pregnancy announcement even be admitted into evidence?



IF SW only found out about the AP that night, it would be a very impulsive and brutal to immediately kill her children, in response. Wouldn't we expect to see a pattern of that kind of emotional, violent behavior, if she did react in that way?

 

[Best of What's Around]

Agreed.

If he killed his beloved wife in a rage and had just lost both his kids we would have seen in suffering tremendous grief.

One wonders how after experiencing a Herculean Greek tragedy of events, he could IMMEDIATELY (per the time line) move into full cover up mode to dispose of the bodies, text/call dead wife, and show up for work on time. No one reported a tear shed during the next few days nor any evidence of grief. Some of us see tremendous evidence of guilt already in the public realm for this case.

 

[mrjitty]

Yes, but that is not what has been reported by those closest to him in the days following. Nor is it evident IMO in his 3 media interviews. If you have not seen them, I highly recommend going to youtube - they are brief and they are telling.

Yes - i saw them - that is why I was agreeing with you.

There is no sign of grief in those interviews.

 

[katydid23]

We don't know what CW did or did not do. I think he may have tried CPR and had no luck and that's why he didn't call 911. Even if EMS responded, that long without oxygenated blood to the brain would certainly mean brain death. CW knew police would not believe his story and he was right. JMO

WHEN could he have tried CPR? If we take his version of events, he couldn't have tried to save them. He said he was in a rage, and ran and strangled his wife.

How long does it take to strangle a grown woman by hand? >>>>5 to 7 minutes, if not more.......

So he didn't even begin to try CPR until it was too late. [ IF he even bothered to try]

 

[Charlot123]

My understanding from what I have read in the previous threads is she was earning OK from her current job?

And CW would of course have to pay maintenance and support his family.

I don't know how much she was making in reality, but she was pregnant and needed healthcare, and I bet insurance came from CW's job. So, things would have changed.

My point is, someone posted that on hearing about the divorce, SW turned homicidal. I totally disagree with it. Most people on hearing about the divorce don't feel homicidal. Especially towards kids. Rather, they start thinking about providing normal life for these very kids as a single parent. And SW had a very serious problem, pregnancy. 15 weeks. Prenatal health care. Insurance. My guess is, she'd get neither homicidal nor suicidal. Saddened and practical, I think.

 

[katydid23]

I didn't say CW thought of himself before saving the lives of his children. That's your assumption and opinion and we will agree to disagree. JMO

Well, in his own words, he thought of himself first. He said he didn't call 911 because no one would believe him.

So he literally thought of himself first, before saving the lives of his children.

EMTs have oxygen tanks, and defibulators, and the knowledge and experience necessary to revive an unconscious child. He didn't even give them that chance.

 

[mrjitty]

I don't know how much she was making in reality, but she was pregnant and needed healthcare, and I bet insurance came from CW's job. So, things would have changed.

My point is, someone posted that on hearing about the divorce, SW turned homicidal. I totally disagree with it. Most people on hearing about the divorce don't feel homicidal. Especially towards kids. Rather, they start thinking about providing normal life for these very kids as a single parent. And SW had a very serious problem, pregnancy. 15 weeks. Prenatal health care. Insurance. My guess is, she'd get neither homicidal nor suicidal. Saddened and practical, I think.

Also things would not have changed immediately

Usually he would be kicked out of the house but still have to support his family. It's not like she has to sell the house and get new healthcare on an urgent timeline.

They have months if not years to resolve these things. You don't get divorced that quickly

 

[mrjitty]

I agree. It's also seems like at trial some people are expecting to hear all of this top secret terrible information about SW and just ignoring the fact that CW is the one on trial and we will be seeing and hearing a truckload of information on this monster. I hope his supporters are prepared for that, because if they are ignoring the facts and evidence of what we know so far, they are sure to be in for a world of hurt when it all comes out.

If the defence had some dirt they would have been running it in the media already