Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #44

[LittleFleurDeLys]

I just think it messed up that he convinced her to have another baby, she got preg, he seemed happy...Yet he told a VI he asked to separate numerous times. After getting SW pregnant? Thats a total ******* IMHO

Maybe he was just a notorious liar. He lied to Shannan, he lied to his friends, maybe even to his parents, his affairs and in the end to himself. Maybe it was just the way he could easily pass through life without getting into trouble and too much effort since it just worked for him this way for a long period of time or he got so used to it that he couldn't stop it anymore.

 

[mrjitty]

I'm curious about why you think it matters if SW portrayed a perfect life on SM? CW went along with this on SM. He was in many of her videos, acting supportive, playing with kids, etc. '

If she was being a phony on SM, then so was he.

The fact that CW was having an affair was all on him. That was his decision alone and he made it behind SW's back. SW had no say in this, and she know about it, at least for a period of time. An affair is never a way to bring about a positive resolution to marital problems, as it does the exact opposite.

This is kind of what I mean about mudslinging and wild speculation

e.g defence tries to equate "being phoney on social media" to "evidence of emotional instability" to pure whataboutism and speculation "maybe the mum did it!"

It's just an enormous leap to where they need to get to

 

[molly1255]

I just think it messed up that he convinced her to have another baby, she got preg, he seemed happy...Yet he told a VI he asked to separate numerous times. After getting SW pregnant? Thats a total ******* IMHO

I think what he did to SW is beyond horrible and is without conscience. CW may have told the VI that he asked for a separation, but there's no proof that he did.

SW gets pregnant and he wants to separate almost immediately? Something is up with him. He's got a problem in his pants because he got himself in an affair, behind SW's back. I'm sure she didn't tell him it was ok with her for him to go and do this.

This also means CW was playing two women at the same time, trying to set things up so that he came out the winner and that someone was going to be the loser. SW didn't know she was being played, at least in the beginning. There is no proof that she ever knew. The AP knew he was married, with children an a pregnant wife and if she didn't understand she was being played, that's on her, IMO.

I think he wanted to waltz away unencumbered and that's exactly what he attempted to do. A separation would have cost him a lot of money and those children would have been a burden on a guy who had an AP, ot even AP's. SW was pregnant - maybe her head couldn't rapidly jump to separation as quickly as his did and maybe she couldn't accept she was married to a world-class jerk?

If he wanted a separation so badly, he never needed SW's permission to just leave. He would have legally been responsible to provide financial support for his children, and possibly financial support for SW, even with a separation. That's not what he wanted, IMO.

He wanted them all to go away, and he made sure they went away. JMO.

 

[molly1255]

This is kind of what I mean about mudslinging and wild speculation

e.g defence tries to equate "being phoney on social media" to "evidence of emotional instability" to pure whataboutism and speculation "maybe the mum did it!"

It's just an enormous leap to where they need to get to

I couldn't agree more. It's an astronomical leap to get from the assertions that are being made to getting to SW murdering her own children.

Especially when all of the evidence available points directly at CW as being the one who killed all of them and provided that evidence.

 

[mrjitty]

It will be fascinating to see the prosecution case.

I also wonder if he got himself deep into a hole he couldn't get out of.

e.g taking care of the kids alone, got mad, hurt one of them and decided to kill them all and himself - but then bottled his suicide.

 

[MyBelle]

The jury is required to first consider which circumstantial evidential points have been proven, and only then move on to factual inferences.

This is because multiple circumstantial points make certain conclusions more likely.

Hen pecking is where the defence invites the jury to indulge in wild speculation on a point by point basis.

It's a form of logical fallacy - but can be very effective when your defence consists of mudslinging.

Is there a jury in this case and I missed it?

 

[molly1255]

Maybe he was just a notorious liar. He lied to Shannan, he lied to his friends, maybe even to his parents, his affairs and in the end to himself. Maybe it was just the way he could easily pass through life without getting into trouble and too much effort since it just worked for him this way for a long period of time or he got so used to it that he couldn't stop it anymore.

I think he lied to everyone and this mode of operating. Was he ever truthful to SW. He tricked her with the pregnancy and then promptly engaged himself in an affair.

He probably made it through the last several years because SW kept him out of trouble, IMO. Look at the hideous things he did when he when he took off on his own. Multiple murders, the hideous disposals of the bodies of his babies and pregnant wife, lying to LE, lying in three separate media interviews and now he sits in jail charged with the most hideous of crimes. He wouldn't be facing those charges if the DA thought he didn't do all of those things and thought it could be proven that he did.

All JMO.

 

[mrjitty]

Is there a jury in this case and I missed it?

I referenced a likely defence strategy of henpecking the circumstantial evidence at trial.

You said you did not know what I meant by that.

I answered.

 

[mrjitty]

I think he lied to everyone and this mode of operating. Was he ever truthful to SW. He tricked her with the pregnancy and then promptly engaged himself in an affair.

He probably made it through the last several years because SW kept him out of trouble, IMO. Look at the hideous things he did when he when he took off on his own. Multiple murders, the hideous disposals of the bodies of his babies and pregnant wife, lying to LE, lying in three separate media interviews and now he sits in jail charged with the most hideous of crimes. He wouldn't be facing those charges if the DA thought he didn't do all of those things and thought it could be proven that he did.

All JMO.

Does CW really have close friends?

Everyone I read about so far seems to be her friends.

 

[RachB65]

I agree. It's also seems like at trial some people are expecting to hear all of this top secret terrible information about SW and just ignoring the fact that CW is the one on trial and we will be seeing and hearing a truckload of information on this monster. I hope his supporters are prepared for that, because if they are ignoring the facts and evidence of what we know so far, they are sure to be in for a world of hurt when it all comes out.

They will either disappear from this thread, or keep defending him til hes convicted and maybe beyond. Except the victim blaming will be against TOS. So it will back to the FB groups, i guess.

 

[bonjoviblonde]

And when did he perform CPR anyway? Before he killed SW? If so, what did he do, just push her off and she just sat there? Because we didn't see any defense wounds on CW. If he pushed her off and tried to revive CC, seems to me SW would still be raging and probably hitting and clawing at him. I would also imagine some screaming and yelling would be going on. Or did he wait and spend the 5-7 minutes choking SW and then perform CPR when it would obviously be too late? We know it's actually neither because he didn't try to save anyone. He killed them.

Why would defense wounds on CW be visible? He was dressed in interviews. Why are you assuming screaming and yelling would be heard by neighbors? That's a stretch. One doesn't need to be fully dressed to perform CPR. JMO

Well I clearly should have put IMO but I thought that was a given. Anyhoo, IMO I feel if there was a struggle or physical fight between them I do think there would be raised voices, possibly screaming and dog barking. Maybe a neighbor would hear that. Maybe not. But it’s not a stretch. The neighbors had called before on their barking dog. If he pulled SW off CC and did CPR then I would expect SW to react towards him. She had long nails. I would think he may have scratches on his face and neck. We didn’t see any but sure he could have wounds on his body from her fighting back while he was strangling her. If she was in enough rage to be killing her children, I can’t imagine her just sitting quietly after CW pulls her off CC. However like I said I don’t believe he tried CPR on the kids either before or after killing SW because he was the one who killed them in the first place. IMO JMO MOO.

I’m not sure what you mean about him being dressed to perform CPR. I didn’t say anything about him needing to be dressed.

At what point in the sequence of events that night do you think he attempted CPR? Before or after killing SW?

 

[bonjoviblonde]

They will either disappear from this thread, or keep defending him til hes convicted and maybe beyond. Except the victim blaming will be against TOS. So it will back to the FB groups, i guess.

Oh I think CW will have some lifelong supporters even after he’s convicted but you’re right, the victim bashing will be completely against TOS at that point.

 

[mrjitty]

It's interesting looking at the interview with their joint friends, where CW stayed the night - the level of deception and betrayal there

Fascinating in the greater context

 

[Nikynoo]

Does CW really have close friends?

Everyone I read about so far seems to be her friends.

Yes, he did. I think you should look through some of the VI posts by @Trinket78

 

[Nikynoo]

They will either disappear from this thread, or keep defending him til hes convicted and maybe beyond. Except the victim blaming will be against TOS. So it will back to the FB groups, i guess.

With respect @RachB65 and @bonjoviblonde , I don't see anyone here as 'CW supporters', just those that require more information and are seeking and testing what is out there already.

 

[Nikynoo]

I couldn't agree more. It's an astronomical leap to get from the assertions that are being made to getting to SW murdering her own children.

Especially when all of the evidence available points directly at CW as being the one who killed all of them and provided that evidence.

@molly1255 and @mrjitty, have you reviewed posts made by VI @Trinket78? It is clear in at least one instance, that SW has been less than truthful (Nutgate). Am happy to link to posts if this helps.

 

[mrjitty]

Yes, he did. I think you should look through some of the VI posts by @Trinket78

Thanks!

I skimmed the first 11 threads but really appreciate these tips on who to review to cut it down!

 

[bonjoviblonde]

I’m looking forward to seeing the autopsy reports but I’m not convinced it will prove much for either scenario. I would expect for both CW and SW’s DNA to possibly be on the girls faces, necks or bodies be it from choking them, clothing them, kissing them or putting them to bed. So the DNA alone wouldn’t be enough proof for me to conclude which one killed them.

If they find any drugs in SW or the girls systems I don’t think that would do it for me either because SW could have drugged herself. ( I know some think she may have tried suicide.) but CW also could have drugged her. If the girls were asleep when SW got home then I’m not sure how SW could have drugged them so maybe if they find drugs in the kids I would be more apt to thinking CW drugged them.

Size of hand bruising on the neck could be something if that can be proven.

Any signs of sexual abuse or damage to their bodies from putting them in the oil vat openings would obviously go towards CW.

 

[MsBetsy]

Is there a jury in this case and I missed it?

Which jury were you referring to in previous posts?

 

[molly1255]

It will be fascinating to see the prosecution case.

I also wonder if he got himself deep into a hole he couldn't get out of.

e.g taking care of the kids alone, got mad, hurt one of them and decided to kill them all and himself - but then bottled his suicide.

JMO, his actions (all of them) are the actions of a person who has anti-social personality disorder and is a psychopath. The fact he doesn't appear to have a criminal record is not proof that he isn't one. The fact he had a job isn't proof, either. We don't much about his past but my guess is there were signs.

Those signs can sometimes be extremely hard to spot, until after they have done something and get caught. They are capable of putting on an incredible act that can last years and fool everyone they come in contact with.

But lurking in the background is a secret life and there's extremely selfish, very unfair treatment of others and the other believes he is treating them well, because they don't know what he's doing behind their back. They don't know the level of contempt and disrespect that is hiding behind the smile. It is all done through very clever manipulation and lies and a false persona. They can be extremely believable because that person seems to be so genuine and so well-meaning and so kind.

The fact CW has demonstrated his criminal nature by murdering his pregnant wife and two little girls, moved their bodies and disposed of them like trash, and then went to work and as soon as he was contacted, his lies didn't stop. He had no respect for anyone at all. He lied to LE, to the media, and to everyone. All of this makes me believe that this may be what is going on with CW.

It is the only thing that explains everything to me. JMO.