CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #9

[CFlo]

That's the other thing. If a normal man had had to drag his homicidal wife off their children and hit her in defense of the children, when he calls 911 he's also going to scream that his wife needs medical attention as she's pregnant and he wants to make sure that baby is saved!

BINGO.

 

[Jacquie1]

RSBM

I don't know about that. I cannot see myself running to the cops. First off, I would be so embarrassed and also frightened and downright sick to my stomach. I would have to think things through for awhile. Especially if I were married, which I am. IDK if she is or not, but it's possible. I think coworkers ratted them out and then the cops went to her, but that is only my opinion.

Remember, the affidavit states in two day investigation it was revealed he was having an active affair, which he had denied previously.
I’m sure the cops spoke to her even before C.W. confessed.

 

[PommyMommy]

I think Shanann going into the children's rooms to check on them is easily possible, without her worrying about waking them.

I think a lot of children would sleep through someone walking in their room...how do parents put presents from Santa at the bottom of the bed every year if you can't tiptoe into the room without waking the child?

And, Shanann's just been away from her babies for a whole weekend. She didn't get to say goodnight to them, so I can easily imagine her tiptoe into the room, check the covers on them, pick up a teddy that's fallen out of bed in the night, and gently whisper "I love you" before leaving the room, and feeling safe and secure to fall asleep herself knowing her babies are safely tucked up in bed and having sweet dreams.

She was a caring, loving, doting mother. I think the first thing she did after removing her shoes and setting her purse and luggage down was go up and check in on her babies.

 

[nanwv]

Looking forward to the experts dissecting CW mental state. This is By Far the most creative nonsense I've ever heard for a killer. Was this a planned response or something his dad helped him come up. SW was killing the kids so I killed her, dumped her body in a shallow grave (pre dug?) and then my beloved kids in those awful oil tanks. Didn't think to call 911 or anything-he thought he'd save the taxpayers some $$ and all that hassle. After all, CW know's what its like to be low on cash. He'd rather go to work, where he just disposed of his family, so he can flirt with the mistress. Cowards are really dumb.

 

[DAdvocate]

The problem is that we don't have all those facts yet. A lot of this is just assumption and opinion. It's okay to discuss all scenarios here. I think a good sleuth looks in all possible directions.

Correct. We don't have solid facts on what their financial situation was on the day of the murders. We don't have solid facts on CW state the day before murders, and we don't know SW state around the time of the murders. However, given that SW briefly passed out the night before, I believe there's more to her state of mind that we need to know. CW was stated to be at a birthday party acting normal and then reported to be grilling out. I see more red flags with her shortly before the murders than him.

 

[Amandaaa]

So... there’s a lot of discussion about the birthday party on Sunday, and how it fits into the timeline... but I also saw/read an interview with a man (Jeremy Lindstrom, I believe) who had hosted the family at a birthday party for his son a few days before this happened.

Are we absolutely sure there were two separate parties - one a few days before, and one on Sunday? Has the Sunday party been confirmed to have taken place? I know I’ve seen it mentioned, but absolutely no details about when, where, who (and no statement from the host of the Sunday party, that I’m aware of).

Maybe I’ve missed something - I just find it odd that this seems to be held out as the “last sighting” of the girls, but no details have emerged...?

 

[Sabrina1011]

Hypothetical scenerio:
CW snaps ~ possibly when he learns that the flight was delayed and he had been stressed up until that point for varying reasons. He was frustrated because he had the girls for the business trip, he could not spend time with the mistress. Maybe the mistress was giving CW added grief about not be able to see him. Maybe CW was wanting to let SW know he was leaving her for the mistress. Lots of things going on his CW's mind.
He kills first child out of anger and rage.
He then has to kill the second child because she witnessed the first murder.
He has no other option but to kill SW.

The only part of this that I don’t get is until a few days before this, SW and kids were in NC for 6 weeks. He probably wanted to spend time with the kids. The kids go to bed at 6:30!! He could see her every night. JMO

 

[PommyMommy]

The only part of this that I don’t get is until a few days before this, SW and kids were in NC for 6 weeks. He probably wanted to spend time with the kids. The kids go to bed at 6:30!! He could see her every night. JMO

And maybe he did see her, and the girls woke up and he was busted. As in, "I'm telling Mommy!" Entirely speculative and JMO

 

[SuperTmo]

The threads move so fast, I lose track of posts. I thought I saw a clip of reporters knocking on the door of the supposed mistress. Did they name her?

I get the feeling that CW waited for SW to fall asleep before doing what he did. Does anyone else feel this way? I don't know if that means he killed the girls after or not. She didn't feel well, so she may have said "How are the girls?", instead of going in to check on them.

Oh my gosh. I hope they leave her alone unless and until police say she assisted or helped plan this tragedy. Going and knocking on her door without even know if she is the actual woman or if she knew he was married is horrible.

For all we know she was a new employee and had no idea he was married with kids. Maybe she became employed while Shanann was in NC.

 

[NuttMegg]

The threads move so fast, I lose track of posts. I thought I saw a clip of reporters knocking on the door of the supposed mistress. Did they name her?

I get the feeling that CW waited for SW to fall asleep before doing what he did. Does anyone else feel this way? I don't know if that means he killed the girls after or not. She didn't feel well, so she may have said "How are the girls?", instead of going in to check on them.

I think she walked in the door and he was so mad to have waited 4 hours longer, that they started arguing, and that (IMO) they were both yelling and she said I know about "so and so", he hit her and strangled her, maybe she was already "out", and then strangled the kids too. IMO he did not tell her he wanted to leave, IMO SHE told HIM she knew all about it and get the F out of here. I think he was up to his eyeballs in resentment for having to care for the kids for a couple of days. and the 4 hour delay set a fuse under a keg of evil dynamite.

 

[FlossyMay]

Remember, the affidavit states in two day investigation it was revealed he was having an active affair, which he had denied previously.
I’m sure the cops spoke to her even before C.W. confessed.

I never indicated they didn't speak to her. I just feel like they probably found out about the affair through other parties.

 

[SuperTmo]

I re - read the affidavit last night when the thread was in the "back & forth"

It's clear that each child was deposited in a separate tank. IDK how I missed that before and I was misled by his TV interviews where he said that he hoped that " they are huddled up together somewhere."

Again a very rational & deliberate act to use 2 tanks, for whatever reason ( fullness of tanks etc or other symbolic reason)

I think it was to spread out the decomposing body smell. Maybe he thought two bodies in one tank would smell too much and be more obvious than if they were separated.

 

[Jacquie1]

I'm wondering how the baby monitor and the phone on the upstairs couch fit in.

CW was asked by one of the reporters if he was asleep when Shanann got in. He said "no" but his following words suggested he hadn't wanted to admit that. I can't recall the exact words. The reporter had tried to ask something similar in the immediately preceding question but CW gave a response that had nothing to do with the question that was asked, again wanting to avoid answering that question.

So I do think he was awake waiting for her to get back. His explaining about Shanann's plane being late seemed like it had bothered him that the plane was late, which I don't think it would have been such a big deal to him if he was asleep? And I feel he confirms this by letting it slip out that he wasn't asleep.

So, Shanann comes in, kicks her shoes off, leaves her purse in the kitchen, goes upstairs with the phone. Where would she normally leave the phone at night? Does she normally switch the phone off at night so that they can sleep without any calls/texts bothering them and then turn the phone on in the morning when she's had a shower and had a coffee and more prepared for the blast of calls and texts from her friends and "her people".

Then Shanann goes upstairs to sleep? Was CW downstairs to 'greet' Shanann?

I think she must have gone into one of the girls rooms and seen that her baby wasn't breathing. I wonder if she turned off the phone and dropped it on the couch before entering the child's room?

So she sees one of her daughters isn't breathing, screams for CW to come (because she just knows her baby isn't breathing, she might not realize that it was death by manual strangulation? I don't know how obvious that would be, especially in a dark room where maybe there's only a hall light shining into the child's room so as to not disturb the child by turning on the main light in the child's bedroom? So she screams for CW to come quickly, exits the bedroom and goes for her phone to call 911....And CW attacks Shanann.

Or Shanann put her phone in the bedroom before checking on the first of the girls and had to run into the bedroom to get the phone, CW was in the bedroom pretending to be asleep, and he strangles Shanann there and then, and throws the phone onto the couch (why?) and then hides it behind a cushion while he's doing the quick clean-up before the body dump? But if Shanann had put the phone on the couch before she went into check on the girls, then I find it easier that CW is doing the quick clean-up of the scene, sees the phone on the couch cushion and pushes it between the cushions/seats as a quick fix? So I prefer that scenario, but then I don't understand how the main bedroom sheets come into it if Shanann wasn't murdered on the bed?

I think she DID go check the kids, saw they weren’t breathing, screamed for C.W. to call 911 and she started to do cpr (she used to work in a hospital). Seeing C.W. wasn’t calling 911 she started to call on her phone outside the kids room (loft area) and he attacked her.

*edited to add: that’s how/why he wants them tested for dna

 

[Lola68]

Hypothetical scenerio:
CW snaps ~ possibly when he learns that the flight was delayed and he had been stressed up until that point for varying reasons. He was frustrated because he had the girls for the business trip, he could not spend time with the mistress. Maybe the mistress was giving CW added grief about not be able to see him. Maybe CW was wanting to let SW know he was leaving her for the mistress. Lots of things going on his CW's mind.
He kills first child out of anger and rage.
He then has to kill the second child because she witnessed the first murder.
He has no other option but to kill SW.

Sorry if this has been discussed already - I can’t keep up - but someone pointed out on thread #8 (thank you!) that the charge sheet said they believe CW killed Shannon’s unborn child and she died as a result of this. To me, this is a game changer in terms of the scenarios we’ve been discussing so far!

Could the third pregnancy have been the catalyst? Did he mean to kill them both or did he flip, kick SW in the stomach etc and gravely injure her? This suggest he maybe didn’t kill her outright but left her to die. The girls could have been collateral damage - witnesses to a fight etc. The fact he can’t remember when he got up (4-5am) but is pretty accurate re when SW got home suggests to me that whatever happened took place when SW got home.

I’m still not convinced it was premeditated - but that’s more because of the bungling way he tried to cover it up. But he could just be that stupid. All IMO

 

[NuttMegg]

After reading the friend's comments again about CW being distant lately with his family, I'm starting to wonder if all this was premeditated. (I previously thought he had momentarily snapped).
Wondering if he thought he could do the perfect crime by putting them in an oil tank. He also seemed to have very little damage to himself in the way of scratches. So in keeping with the premeditation theory, maybe he had planned how to kill SW with minimal damage to himself.
So the question remains as to whether he planned to put SW in the tank, but the plan failed. Or did he expect decomp (sorry) to do it's thing to remove the evidence. (I hate to say that).
Some here on this site are women who have escaped assaults, and it's painful to hear others who have lost to their assailants... Sad.

I would guess that he was running out of time after putting the little girls in the crude oil, and SW was heavier than he anticipated, it might have been getting light, and he had to be at work at -------? And slightly buried her in haste.

IMO he had planned to use those vats as a burial ground, he must have known if they were scarcely ever checked, etc. So I think the thought occurred to him of using the vats for body disposal some day, but maybe just not that exact day.

 

[FlossyMay]

Oh my gosh. I hope they leave her alone unless and until police say she assisted or helped plan this tragedy. Going and knocking on her door without even know if she is the actual woman or if she knew he was married is horrible.

For all we know she was a new employee and had no idea he was married with kids. Maybe she became employed while Shanann was in NC.

I have a feeling she knew, but I don't know that for sure. I think it's crazy that they would knock on someone's door like that without knowing for sure she was the right person. Seems like they could get sued. Maybe they have more info than we do. IDK.

 

[MerryB]

The threads move so fast, I lose track of posts. I thought I saw a clip of reporters knocking on the door of the supposed mistress. Did they name her?

I get the feeling that CW waited for SW to fall asleep before doing what he did. Does anyone else feel this way? I don't know if that means he killed the girls after or not. She didn't feel well, so she may have said "How are the girls?", instead of going in to check on them.

Agree, Flossy.

 

[Lola68]

Also - why spare the dog?

 

[Shekkiec]

I would not think the affair person was involved . The police have not indicated more possible arrest pending . I do hope she wasn’t married or had children bc her life will be turned upside down . My ex husband was a narcissist and very abusive but so charasmic one on one . He easily portrayed himself as a great guy to other women and tried to place “blame” on being unhappy on me but he was so “nice” he was staying for the children . Even if she knew he was married she was probably manipulated . SW said she was at a low point when she met him. Men like him know how to seek out vulnerability.

 

[cottonweaver]

For those that believe his story that they had an emotional conversation or fight on her return:

Why no signs of a fight at the house?