GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #57

[Sjm_qc]

Wasn't there some mention very early on of a fancy powered digging machine which he had in the pick-up (or maybe the garage). It sounded like it would make short work of a suitable hole in the soil.

Nothing like that in the discovery documents that we are referencing (the evidence is listed). IIRC (will go back & check), there were 2 shovels in his truck, no other digging implements.

 

[Inthedetails]

I looked at a ruler this morning.

8" diameter hole in the tank.

 

[MsBetsy]

The VI who said the nut incident never happened, idk the VI screen name. I have trouble sometimes too trying to follow the quotes and responses without the original comment being included in the quote

Yes, well we all know who was in that house when the nut incident occurred.

 

[MsBetsy]

Just for reference, if you click on the white arrow alongside the poster's name in the black quote box you are replying to, it takes you back to the post they were replying to. In that way you can quickly get back to the original post.

Thank you, I never knew that! I always spend 10 minutes trying to find it.

 

[Tigerlily75]

I read in another thread about a case that was not current, but there was a forum here at some point. From what I understand the mother of the suspect or someone involved was a VI and tried to influence people. I don't remember the details, but she was anonymous and later it was found out to be her. I'm not implying CW's mom did that, however. I don't think that's the case. Obviously we all know how the family felt from the start and the steps they took to influence the public. Chris barely had any friends, and even the 2 we heard about barely knew anything about him or Shannon. In my opinion when the DA referred to the rumors hurting the investigation, it is the family who is responsible for that, and all the people who were willing to spread the malicious rumors and speculation that the person most likely to murder her children was Shanann. Imo

That’s exactly what happened here.

Not the mother.

The VI who said the nut incident never happened, idk the VI screen name. I have trouble sometimes too trying to follow the quotes and responses without the original comment being included in the quote

The screen name was the biggest clue of all.

 

[gitana1]

There’s still not enough there to convince me that he killed the girls first.

He appears to be lazy, and those pictures were easier to send than going into their rooms and taking photos of them while they were sleeping.

The texts to co workers was apparently standard practice as well.

The DA wasn’t able to to reach a conclusion one way or another, and I can see why.

They didn't say the texts were standard practice. They said occasionally they would text over the weekend. Almost never on Sunday.

And no one ever wanted to go to the site he dumped the bodies at because it was so far. Yet he eagerly volunteered in a somewhat unusual call before the murders. Suddenly volunteering to go alone to the very place he coincidentally dumped the bodies at the next day.

To me there's no way that's not connected.

 

[MsBetsy]

I have not read the documents, only following the posts here to learn.

So it appears that he took off her watch and hid her phone and put them both in the couch. I would love to know and a question for @PommyMommy to add, is when was the watch taken off her body? Because it certainly wasn't plugged in to be recharged.

From what I read in the documents, in the weeks before the murder they sometimes slept separately. When Chris came to NC the first day, Shanann slept on the couch. One of her friends said she had slept on the couch at home. I forgot which night. Maybe she fell asleep on the couch that night, or was there when they argued, and that's where he strangled her. Then maybe
he just stuck the phone between the cushion. That was the point when Shanann was aware that CW wanted out and was unhappy about the baby. She was devastated. I can't imagine they would sleep in the same bed. But then again I still think he killed her before she even had a chance to go to sleep. I don't think he would have wanted to wait. Or maybe he waited until she fell asleep and then killed her. We will probably never know.

 

[NuttMegg]

We live on a ranch and are always having to dig to repair lines to water tanks, build fences etc. Some of our ground is very hard and almost impossible to dig up without using a pic ax first or soaking the area first. He had an extremely difficult task digging that grave and it took some time.

Did they ever find a documented use for that rake? I doubt that a rake would help with digging a hole, but I think it was theorized that it could be a marker?
I live in desert/scrub habitat, very similar to that Weld County area with very hard soil/roots for about the first 8 inches, we use an implement that is like a tire iron but about 5 ft long, straight, and heavy, to just lift and drop to burst that top layer, then a pick ax. The hole was only some 25-27" deep IIRC and only about 8" over her behind, which was the highest point. Maybe off an inch or 2, sorry. Hard to do quickly with a shovel, even such a small hole.

 

[mrjitty]

They didn't say the texts were standard practice. They said occasionally they would text over the weekend. Almost never on Sunday.

And no one ever wanted to go to the site he dumped the bodies at because it was so far. Yet he eagerly volunteered in a somewhat unusual call before the murders. Suddenly volunteering to go alone to the very place he coincidentally dumped the bodies at the next day.

To me there's no way that's not connected.

Reading McCOYs statement, I discovered he found out about the problem at CERVI 319 on Friday!

He met McCOY in a parking lot to give him an Amazon Fire TV stick. McCOY received a call about CERVI 319

That is how Watts found out about it. He planned to deal with it himself as early as friday, and then texted Roberts on Sunday

 

[Inthedetails]

They didn't say the texts were standard practice. They said occasionally they would text over the weekend. Almost never on Sunday.

And no one ever wanted to go to the site he dumped the bodies at because it was so far. Yet he eagerly volunteered in a somewhat unusual call before the murders. Suddenly volunteering to go alone to the very place he coincidentally dumped the bodies at the next day.

To me there's no way that's not connected.

Does anyone remember what time CW texted the co-workers on Sunday?? And, what time did he depart the b-day party, do we know?

jmo

 

[MsBetsy]

That’s exactly what happened here.

Not the mother.



The screen name was the biggest clue of all.

I suspect that too but because I may be a little dense I don't know how the name was a clue... I'll have to think about that one.

 

[Tortoise]

Does anyone remember what time CW texted the co-workers on Sunday?? And, what time did he depart the b-day party, do we know?

jmo

From memory I think it was around 5pm he texted the coworker. I think that is also around the same time that he arrived home from the party.

 

[Tigerlily75]

I suspect that too but because I may be a little dense I don't know how the name was a clue... I'll have to think about that one.

I was born in 1975.

 

[NuttMegg]

I haven't seen anyone mention this yet: CW was stunted mentally. This affair is more like a first love, not an affair in your 30s. CW never had this experience before, but it's so important in human development: That first soul-crushing all encompassing obsessive first love. We, as adults, know how this inevitably ends: Heartbreak and disaster. But CW did not know this. He thought in his head he and NK were gonna live happily ever after.

But we know what would have happened, if he hadn't murdered his family; he gets a divorce and dates NK, a ton of drama and eventual break up, and maybe CW would have killed NK, if she didn't go along with his weird fantasy for them.

CWs main concern is what others think of him. He's very worried about his image. He was so worried that Shanann and his children would think less of him for having an affair, he thought it would be better to kill them than come clean. He is so naive and young. If he only would have thought of the reality of his relationship with NK, realized it would be an ultimately futile thing. That he would regret. If he only would have been more mature, to know everyone has financial struggles sometimes, and they aren't the end of the world.

If he only would have thought of others at least sometimes, instead of needing to have fawning women around him at all times, constantly telling him how amazing he is, and if they dare say anything critical, even his children, well, he'll show them.

One of NK's friends said she had poor choice in men, IIRC so much that the friend didn't ask for many details, and not the name of the latest guy, CW. I think NK was the first woman he encountered (after Mom, Sis, and Shan'ann) who was not stronger than he, and pliable enough to do anything he wanted. No wonder the was so head over heels, finally someone paying attention to him.

 

[gitana1]

Risky, but what with Chris Watt's being one of the dumbest criminals of all time, who knows?

Heck. We know the family was behind on the mortgage and so having financial issues. Yet here he was researching buying jewelry and going on trips with his new paramour. The ring could have helped with that.

 

[Tigerlily75]

They didn't say the texts were standard practice. They said occasionally they would text over the weekend. Almost never on Sunday.

And no one ever wanted to go to the site he dumped the bodies at because it was so far. Yet he eagerly volunteered in a somewhat unusual call before the murders. Suddenly volunteering to go alone to the very place he coincidentally dumped the bodies at the next day.

To me there's no way that's not connected.

Agree, definitely connected. It was basically described as being not completely abnormal, but definitely not the usual. Kodi Roberts and even NK thought it was a bit odd.

I still lean towards preplanned and not a result of an argument. No evidence at all of a struggle, and she definitely would have fought back given the chance. I really do think she was asleep.

 

[MsBetsy]

I was born in 1975.

Ohhhh. Got it. I could not even remember the number attached, it's been so long.

 

[x_files]

I agree. I actually suspect she might not be? But I just wonder what her intent is. The impression I get is she was an avid lover, loved taking nude pics of herself, was dating widely (and possibly having sex with them?) and pretty much comes across as awful (eg telling CW to pawn off his wedding ring, and telling him to close down his facebook). However, what we dont know is the extent of the lies he was telling her, as well as her level of gullibility.

Obviously she googled SW and she would have seen how incredibly gorgeous, positive and lively SW was, as well as the sheer amount of friends SW had. My guess is NK was incredibly threatened by that, but due to her low self esteem and self worth was getting her jollies from taking SW's man. Its absolutely pathetic but I do believe if it wasn't NK it would be someone else at some point.

Where did you find info she told CW to pawn his wedding ring? She sounds controlling! Bossing him around after dating only 6 weeks. holy hell.

 

[MsBetsy]

One of NK's friends said she had poor choice in men, IIRC so much that the friend didn't ask for many details, and not the name of the latest guy, CW. I think NK was the first woman he encountered (after Mom, Sis, and Shan'ann) who was not stronger than he, and pliable enough to do anything he wanted. No wonder the was so head over heels, finally someone paying attention to him.

An insecure woman who craved attention. Easy to manipulate.

 

[MsBetsy]

Where did you find info she told CW to pawn his wedding ring? She sounds controlling! Bossing him around after dating only 6 weeks. holy hell.

It's one of the interviews, I think. He told her over the phone that she left it behind.