GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #71

[Noreen McGurl]

I don’t think there is any jealousy. He simply was done with that phase of his life. Throw it away like used tissue and move on.Ho hum

When I say jealousy I don't mean it in the way like lovers jealous of somebody else I mean jealousy that she was living her best life and he was just a hollow shell of a man who would never be as good as she was and he couldn't stand to see her I hate to use the word" Thrive" and live the best life she could live

 

[kay74]

I wonder if CW's parents knew about NK before the killings? I doubt it but was it ever mentioned? That must have hit them hard if they knew it either way before or after.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

N0, its seconds.
'It can take less than 10 seconds for a person to lose consciousness as a result of strangulation, and death can occur in just under five minutes.'

Strangulation Can Leave Long-Lasting Injuries

N0, its seconds.
'It can take less than 10 seconds for a person to lose consciousness as a result of strangulation, and death can occur in just under five minutes.'

Strangulation Can Leave Long-Lasting Injuries

I was referring to asphyxiation/smothering.

 

[PommyMommy]

I wonder if CW's parents knew about NK before the killings? I doubt it but was it ever mentioned? That must have hit them hard if they knew it either way before or after.

During her media blitz, Ma Watts said in one of her interviews that she had an idea that CW was having an affair and thought it was an "emotional relationship" that began before SW went to NC, and then escalated while she was gone.

Interesting that she knew when it began and how it progressed but only had an idea that he was having an affair... MOO

 

[Seattle1]

delete (@PommyMommy answered).

 

[molly1255]

When I say jealousy I don't mean it in the way like lovers jealous of somebody else I mean jealousy that she was living her best life and he was just a hollow shell of a man who would never be as good as she was and he couldn't stand to see her I hate to use the word" Thrive" and live the best life she could live

I see this, too. He is a hollow shell of a man and I think he's a psychopath. I think he targeted Shanann because of the qualities she possessed that made him look very good. I think he felt jealous of her, and that turned to contempt and then she was devalued and discarded. JMO.

 

[Poedelini]

IMO, the conversation seemed almost staged between the two. From Ronnie’s reaction (or lack of), he already knew what his son had done. I think that most parents would be yelling - What the hell did you just say? What did you do?

Edited for spelling.

Yes that where my thoughts exactly when i saw it. Super weird.

Pi,
A few pages back, I asked about this change of date. I have not found any reasons given for the change to July 17.

According to the Weld County Trustee, the change was official.
Weld Public Trustee: Foreclosure Details

I really really find that interesting. Is it still possible to find evidence there?

 

[Nikynoo]

I was referring to asphyxiation/smothering.

is it not the same thing?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

is it not the same thing?

Strangulation is different than smothering and asphyxiation.

Smothering causes lack of oxygen but the blood circulates with the existing oxygen in the blood, until the point minutes later that the low oxygen in the blood will cause someone to pass out, and eventually death. (That is why you can do chest compressions on somebody who is not responsive to save their life). we have seen cases here where somebody was smothered, and the perpetrator thought they were dead but they came back to consciousness and they had to do it again.

Strangulation causes immediate lack of blood supply and oxygen to the brain. Strangulation is the condition in which circulation of blood to a part of the body is cut off by constriction.

Moo

 

[pinkie60]

There really weren't any signs that CW was going to do what he did, though. To SW, and to those around him, he was a kind and loving father and husband. IMO he wasn't "jealousy", he just didn't view his family as people anymore. They were merely objects that needed to be removed.

I think this is what gets to me the most. How he turned into a Jekyll and Hyde. Such betrayal on all levels. It really bothered the ones who knew and worked with him. For Shananns family he was a dream come true who turned into a nightmare. He never showed any anger or aggressiveness. To quote Frankie jr he actually cried at her wedding with happiness for her that she was marrying such a nice guy
I don't see how anyone can protect themselves from these kinds of people. The only thing I can think of if your spouse abruptly changes, take the kids and leave?
Someone on another site thought he was secretly very competitive with other males and felt threatened by Nico. Irrationally thought Nico would be able to see thru his mask
To do what he did he must have had a switch to be able to turn off his attachment to them.

 

[molly1255]

Strangulation is different than smothering and asphyxiation.

Smothering causes lack of oxygen but the blood circulates with the existing oxygen in the blood, until the point minutes later that the low oxygen in the blood will cause someone to pass out, and eventually death. (That is why you can do chest compressions on somebody who is not responsive to save their life). we have seen cases here where somebody was smothered, and the perpetrator thought they were dead but they came back to consciousness and they had to do it again.

Strangulation causes immediate lack of blood supply and oxygen to the brain. Strangulation is the condition in which circulation of blood to a part of the body is cut off by constriction.

Moo

Thank you for your post.

With respect to strangulation, I don't think it is safe for anyone to assume that unconsciousness from strangulation occurs in 10 seconds or less. It depends. Refer to attached which states with complete and sustained obstruction of both jugular veins, it takes approximately two minutes to full unconsciousness and another two minutes of sustained unconsciousness until death occurs.

As far as I know, it is unknown whether CW applied pressure to the carotid arteries or to the jugular veins and it is also unknown if that pressure was complete and sustained from the moment he began strangling Shanann.

JMO, the lack of defensive injuries to both Shanann and CW does not necessarily mean that she was unconscious before she knew what was happening. It could mean that she was restrained and unable to try to defend herself.

http://www.napsa-now.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/102.pdf

 

[kay74]

During her media blitz, Ma Watts said in one of her interviews that she had an idea that CW was having an affair and thought it was an "emotional relationship" that began before SW went to NC, and then escalated while she was gone.

Interesting that she knew when it began and how it progressed but only had an idea that he was having an affair... MOO

She probably thought oh poor baby he's getting the emotional support he doesn't get from Shanann. Whereas I would have read him the riot act. Married with 2 kids and another on the way. Come on

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Thank you for your post.

With respect to strangulation, I don't think it is safe for anyone to assume that unconsciousness from strangulation occurs in 10 seconds or less. It depends. Refer to attached which states with complete and sustained obstruction of both jugular veins, it takes approximately two minutes to full unconsciousness and another two minutes of sustained unconsciousness until death occurs.

As far as I know, it is unknown whether CW applied pressure to the carotid arteries or to the jugular veins and it is also unknown if that pressure was complete and sustained from the moment he began strangling Shanann.

JMO, the lack of defensive injuries to both Shanann and CW does not necessarily mean that she was unconscious before she knew what was happening. It could mean that she was restrained and unable to try to defend herself.

http://www.napsa-now.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/102.pdf

As to the lack of injuries, I completely agree. Thank you for expounding.

I grew up with when wrestlers ( long long long ago, iirc they called it the sleeper hold) and police were lawfully able to use a hold where it would cut off blood supply. I have seen it firsthand. They go out pretty quickly. But I don't discount what you are saying above.

Again, thank you for adding to the conversation on such.

 

[NuttMegg]

During her media blitz, Ma Watts said in one of her interviews that she had an idea that CW was having an affair and thought it was an "emotional relationship" that began before SW went to NC, and then escalated while she was gone.

Interesting that she knew when it began and how it progressed but only had an idea that he was having an affair... MOO

On June 29th CW and NK were texting about wink wink role playing, being warm sleeping next to one another, being addicted, etc. Didn't SW leave on June 27th? (IIRC) Sounds to me like it escalated before SW went to NC. Anyway the sister knew "from the beginning". presumably the mother did too.

 

[NuttMegg]

She probably thought oh poor baby he's getting the emotional support he doesn't get from Shanann. Whereas I would have read him the riot act. Married with 2 kids and another on the way. Come on

Somehow I doubt that Ma Watts would have gotten along with NK either & vice versa. Both overbearing pushy controllers/liars.

 

[PommyMommy]

She probably thought oh poor baby he's getting the emotional support he doesn't get from Shanann. Whereas I would have read him the riot act. Married with 2 kids and another on the way. Come on

She was probably elated. Heaven forbid she should consider the effect it may have on her grandchildren; just as long as her baby boy got away from that nasty, abusive wife of his. This is the woman who didn't even believe SW and the girls were missing, but that they had just run off somewhere to punish CW. You know - with no car, no keys, no phone, no medication. What a piece of work.

And her husband is just as ignorant. I'll never forget this one: "If he did it all, I can live with it." Yeah Ronnie, no big deal...
'He's not a monster': Parents of Chris Watts defend son who admitted to killing wife, children

 

[NuttMegg]

She was probably elated. Heaven forbid she should consider the effect it may have on her grandchildren; just as long as her baby boy got away from that nasty, abusive wife of his. This is the woman who didn't even believe SW and the girls were missing, but that they had just run off somewhere to punish CW. You know - with no car, no keys, no phone, no medication. What a piece of work.

And her husband is just as ignorant. I'll never forget this one: "If he did it all, I can live with it." Yeah Ronnie, no big deal...
'He's not a monster': Parents of Chris Watts defend son who admitted to killing wife, children

Pommy did you ever run across a written translation of his interview with the CBI/FBI? Once I tried to listen to it but couldn't understand a word.

 

[molly1255]

As to the lack of injuries, I completely agree. Thank you for expounding.

I grew up with when wrestlers ( long long long ago, iirc they called it the sleeper hold) and police were lawfully able to use a hold where it would cut off blood supply. I have seen it firsthand. They go out pretty quickly. But I don't discount what you are saying above.

Again, thank you for adding to the conversation on such.

I'm happy to chime in. In the prison interview with CW, the investigators were trying to get an answer from CW on how he strangled Shanann.

Coder brought up the lack of scratches on CW and he asked CW if that was because it was so powerful. CW said he didn't know the kind of force he put on her neck. He didn't know if it was 2-4 minutes. He said he had both hands on her neck.

Coder explained that if it was the carotid, it would be seconds and she would be out. He asked CW if it was that quick. No verbal response on the tape from CW, and Coder then asked a minute or two? Coder then said "ok".

My take-away from that exchange is that Shanann didn't lose consciousness in a matter of seconds, but it took a minute or two. That is, of course, if CW was being truthful.

JMO

 

[Poedelini]

Im rewatching Nicole Atkinson's statement and i find it weird that her phone was found on the couch outside the bedroom. If she was in bed sleeping she would sure put her phone on the nightstand beside her right?

 

[NuttMegg]

I'm happy to chime in. In the prison interview with CW, the investigators were trying to get an answer from CW on how he strangled Shanann.

Coder brought up the lack of scratches on CW and he asked CW if that was because it was so powerful. CW said he didn't know the kind of force he put on her neck. He didn't know if it was 2-4 minutes. He said he had both hands on her neck.

Coder explained that if it was the carotid, it would be seconds and she would be out. He asked CW if it was that quick. No verbal response on the tape from CW, and Coder then asked a minute or two? Coder then said "ok".

My take-away from that exchange is that Shanann didn't lose consciousness in a matter of seconds, but it took a minute or two. That is, of course, if CW was being truthful.

JMO

We are sorely missing the video to (try to) assess for ourselves his "truthfulness". She was probably thrusting her head violently back and forth as Bella did, and he may have lost the deadly hold on her neck a few times.