Deceased/Not Found CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #47

[afitzy]

Wonder if he gets commission

Its funny but IMO he never has to leave the office, just opens email or has a phone call and my guess is that the articles magically 'either write themselves' or possibly 'arrive fully baked and written'.

Watching the DA and HC situation play out in the Dulos case has IMO following many similar cases for a long time, been one of the least disguised and certainly most obvious tag teams between a possible source and a written article. I seriously question whether any pretence is made about multiple sourcing, objectivity or alternative POV. IMO the reporting we have seen simply breaks the mould on basic journalism standards and integrity and its been sad to watch.

MOO

Why kidnap her if he wasn’t planning to kill her?

Under one of the kidnap scenarios from long ago the idea was to extort GF to drop the civil litigation and get JFd to drop the divorce and modify custody terms. It was an extortion based plan. Might behave been the plan until things got violent IMO.

MOO

 

[Diddian]

I think the mud room door being unlocked is a definite key to the puzzle of whether there was an accomplice or not. He could have gone out that way to put the bike deeper in the woods to come back for later, or someone else could have left that way. Just not sure how the bike makes it way to the Tacoma. Did someone take the bike to the woods and he came back for it? Maybe he hid it,I just can’t see the bike tossed into the back of the Suburban with a body.

I'm curious why you doubt the bike could have been tossed into the back of the Suburban with the body.

Isn't that where the garbage bag(s) full of bloodied paper towels (and presumably gloves) would have been tossed? Presumably, JFd's body was bagged (two bags taped together open end to open end) and zip-tied so it wouldn't be an obvious human body but would resemble something like a rolled up rug packaged for carrying before it was placed in the back of the Suburban. Why would it be any odder to add a bike on top of all that than to have put everything else back there?

 

[annekris]

I'm curious why you doubt the bike could have been tossed into the back of the Suburban with the body.

Isn't that where the garbage bag(s) full of bloodied paper towels (and presumably gloves) would have been tossed? Presumably, JFd's body was bagged (two bags taped together open end to open end) and zip-tied so it wouldn't be an obvious human body but would resemble something like a rolled up rug packaged for carrying before it was placed in the back of the Suburban. Why would it be any odder to add a bike on top of all that than to have put everything else back there?

Yes agree there is plenty of room in a suburban that is designed to regularly hold 5 kids plus nanny and/or mom all at once

 

[BUF]

...

 

[SkylarSid]

IMO, I agree FD did not plan on the quantity of blood and extensive cleanup needed. Odd though that he grabbed JFd's cellphone, which was likely inside JFd's purse, so if the plan made in advance was to fake an abduction, why grab the cellphone and leave the purse behind?

I know young people and some men tend to carry their cellphones in their pants pockets, but I and most mothers I know - and certainly those of us in our 50's or 60's, keep our cellphones in our purses. I don't know what JFd's habits about this were.

IMO, there was quite a lot of panic at 69 Welles Ln about the quantity of blood after the attack, so plans went awry, time was ticking, and the attacker(s) were behaving in a disorganized way, but I strongly believe the Suburban left as it was (running lights on and transmission in "Reverse") and where it was (outside the park, rather than at a parking lot in the park) was reflective of that panic rather than as part of an original plan to fake an abduction which was supposed to have occurred at the site of the Suburban. At best, it was a poorly improvised alternative to the original plan.

If using a faked abduction to draw attention away from himself as most likely person-of-interest, IMO FD and his associate(s) would have developed plans to: transfer body, bags, and Suburban's cargo area mat to Tacoma, then park the Suburban in a parking lot at the park, then lock the doors, and then toss the keys (and possibly the phone, with SIM card removed) into some brush - to leave the impression that JFd had gone for a quick morning walk or run in the park and was abducted or attacked by a serial rapist and dragged off to some hidden location there -, and then ride bicycle from parked Suburban back to the Tacoma.

Perhaps that WAS the plan, but IMO the long clean up at the attack scene had eaten up all the time before an alarm might be expected to arise about JFd missing and not returning calls, so FD - in increasing panic about the potential for being caught with her body in close proximity to JFd's home - had to improvise and made multiple mistakes: forgot to grab the purse even while grabbing the cellphone out of it (that purse left at home with cellphone missing would be a big red flag, IMO), left the Suburban outside the park - close to where the Tacoma had been parked for over two hours - rather than in a parking lot inside the park away from where the Tacoma had been, moved the Suburban just a short distance away from Tacoma and forget to put transmission in "Park" in his hurry to get away, and left blood on the outside of the Suburban as well as inside the cargo area of the Suburban (even though the cargo mat was removed).

So, all that said, I think there may have been an original "make it look like an abduction at the park" plan, but a long and unplanned cleanup of blood at the attack scene necessitated new plans be improvised to make up for lost time. Once back on track with the original plan, FD went on his merry way as though the original plan had been followed without considering the many ways his disorganization at the first and second scene would point investigators back at him abducting JFd from her house rather than at a stranger-abductor taking JFd after she pulled over to the side of the road.

Maybe the cell phone was not in the purse. She could have had the cell in the car and left the purse for the quick run to the school.

 

[waldojabba]

What in the world could DA possibly know that we haven't already heard. Unless he has a direct link to LE that he can quote (which I doubt) I think this is a waste of time.

Iirc NP said he would get his hands on the discovery “ one way or another” and perhaps he has done so and he has started to feed his pal DA with info, strategically and selectively. Also, to be fair, with Colangelo going on the radio and discussing the case and divulging info, the GAG order is actually not being adhered to by either party... kind of perplexing all around

 

[SkylarSid]

I hope I am not the only one thinking this stupid question...so pls bear with me..how do you leave a vehicle running while in reverse? I know when in park, yes..you can leave in drive- when your foot is on the break, but in reverse? Thanks

Maybe he or she got spooked and tried to quickly put it in park, but didn’t quite get it all the way up to park.

 

[SkylarSid]

I'm curious why you doubt the bike could have been tossed into the back of the Suburban with the body.

Isn't that where the garbage bag(s) full of bloodied paper towels (and presumably gloves) would have been tossed? Presumably, JFd's body was bagged (two bags taped together open end to open end) and zip-tied so it wouldn't be an obvious human body but would resemble something like a rolled up rug packaged for carrying before it was placed in the back of the Suburban. Why would it be any odder to add a bike on top of all that than to have put everything else back there?

We don’t know how much stuff was back there or if everything went into the Suburban. It was reported that there were 30 some bags on Albany! Unless the bags were put on seats there is only so much room, unless someone lowered the seats.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

towels in pantry and pantry is in a kitchen

Correct. Not in the garage.

Its funny but IMO he never has to leave the office, just opens email or has a phone call and my guess is that the articles magically 'either write themselves' or possibly 'arrive fully baked and written'.

Watching the DA and HC situation play out in the Dulos case has IMO following many similar cases for a long time, been one of the least disguised and certainly most obvious tag teams between a possible source and a written article. I seriously question whether any pretence is made about multiple sourcing, objectivity or alternative POV. IMO the reporting we have seen simply breaks the mould on basic journalism standards and integrity and its been sad to watch.

MOO

Under one of the kidnap scenarios from long ago the idea was to extort GF to drop the civil litigation and get JFd to drop the divorce and modify custody terms. It was an extortion based plan. Might behave been the plan until things got violent IMO.

MOO

I’m guessing “fully baked” with icing!

 

[Wicked Strong]

Here is the AW3 of Fd for reference:

Read the Fotis Dulos Arrest Warrant

Page 4 of the AW said that the vehicle was found unoccupied, it's running lights were on, and it's transmission was left in reverse. IMO I think it doesn't refer to the vehicle found running, just lights.

Thanks afitzy for bringing these forward.

MOO

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I'm curious why you doubt the bike could have been tossed into the back of the Suburban with the body.

Isn't that where the garbage bag(s) full of bloodied paper towels (and presumably gloves) would have been tossed? Presumably, JFd's body was bagged (two bags taped together open end to open end) and zip-tied so it wouldn't be an obvious human body but would resemble something like a rolled up rug packaged for carrying before it was placed in the back of the Suburban. Why would it be any odder to add a bike on top of all that than to have put everything else back there?

Yep, he treated her body like it was garbage, so his throwing a bike on top of her certainly wouldn’t be beyond him. IMO

 

[pandaknows]

I hope I am not the only one thinking this stupid question...so pls bear with me..how do you leave a vehicle running while in reverse? I know when in park, yes..you can leave in drive- when your foot is on the break, but in reverse? Thanks

So it went down like this, MOO: Suburban driver is not a good driver. Some drivers know how to perfectly parallel park for a smooth transfer of cargo to the Tacoma. You would expect that being an hour or more late, Suburban driver was panicked and got yelled at for never really having learned how to precisely line up back of Suburban to back of Tacoma without leaving a bloody mess in the Suburban and outside of the Suburban and outside of the passenger door of the Tacoma. Comedy of errors. Blood oozing everywhere. Fd did not get out of the Tacoma to help - it was all on the accomplice because Fd could not be seen in New Canaan. Was there added protection against the 2017 Suburban rolling down a hill while still in reverse installed as compared with the 2015 model so that the lights couldn't be turned off as a warning that you are not in Park like you should be? Kind of like your car beeping when the seatbelt is not on? Sorry, IDK, my car is old and I pull the manual hand brake whenever I park but maybe the 2017 Suburban just keeps the lights on until you figure out what you did wrong. MOO.

 

[dlharris2712]

I do agree that the lack of ANY substantive information about MT involvement in the JFd MURDER and subsequent coverup seems to scream IMO for a FOURTH Installment in the series as otherwise the series of articles looks more like a pitch document for a Lifetime Network Movie and not really investigative journalism IMO. I do wish we could 'interview' the writer and ask about his sourcing for these articles as in reading them all again today some disturbing theme came through that weren't intuitively obvious to me upon first reading.

In reading the series of articles again this morning I did find myself scratching my head a bit as oddly I found the ongoing narrative heard from Fd (from the Greek interviews and Dateline), the "Sister" Rena interviews done via phone post Fd death by suicide and the various victim shaming/blaming interviews that the Family, Children and Public have had to endure from Atty. P. and Pattisville for 8 months, strongly coming through in the articles. These 3 sources IMO continued to push a very consistent narrative of victim blaming for the Fd CHOICES to be a serial cheat, not spend much time at home with his family and not seem to care too much about JFd or their marriage. It was classic victim shaming with the idea being that JFd somehow is responsible for the fact that she was murdered in her own garage after dropping off her 5 children at school on 5/24/19! Stunning stuff IMO and also IMO absolutely delusional and absolutely contrary to all the evidence put forward by Atty Colangelo and LE in 3 AWs!

What is so fascinating is that in her recent interviews with the Greek Press that "Sister" Rena basically said what was Fd to do if his wife kicked him out of the bedroom allegedly for 7 years! I'm not sure if this translation was correct but absent anything other than what @kimch33kim generously provided in terms of translation the other day in the prior thread, I will go with the statement. How stunning! To wave a magic wand and absolve Fd of all his sins in terms of serial cheating, 2+ year affair with MT, along with murdering his wife and all because JFd kicked out Fd? And to think that if you kick your spouse out for serial cheating and don't have the courage to get a divorce that it then follows that you have absolution for murdering her in her garage? Mmmm. I'm also thinking this goes WAY beyond cultural norms for marriage between Greece and the US!

I've long believed that the only way "Sister" Rena could cope with her brother was to make him into someone that he absolutely wasn't and to me, these interviews she has given along with the inability to even dignify JFd in the death certificate by calling her "Jennifer UNKNOWN" lead me to believe that there is no way the Greek Family will ever come to terms with who their brother/uncle was and hold him accountable for his choices in life, business and marriage. Fd could have left his family way back in 2010 when he and his sister said the 'marriage broke down'. But, nope, this didn't happen and Fd kept on no doubt sucking money out of the marriage and also no doubt supporting the entire Greek Family as the economy of Greece collapsed. And YET, the Greek Family makes claims to blame the situation on the Farber Family, wealth and some mysterious cabal associated with the Farber family. Fantastical stuff but also delusional I strongly believe!

I don't know what it is about an inability to be accountable for anything but it certainly seems to run in the Dulos family DNA so far as I can tell. The 'interview' no doubt written IMO by Atty. P. for Dave Altimari in the Hartford Court from "Sister" Rena shortly after Fd death (and before she and her husband hired 2 box trucks to clean out 4Jx!) where she proceeded to blame the Farber wealth, Judge Heller and the various unscrupulous legal and other professionals along with the CT Justice system for the problems that Fd had that resulted in him killing himself was something that I found beyond inappropriate when I first read it and even more so today after reading this series of 3 articles for a second time.

We see in these 3 articles the similar references to "Jewish Elite" in New York and how JFd grew up amidst much privilege. Yes, the privilege is real but I'm not sure how relevant this reference to "Jewish Elite" is as its frankly something that seems more appropriate to neo-nazi propaganda that sadly seems to be having a sick kind of resurgence both in the EU and US these days. I'm not sure exactly how all this precisely relevant to why JFd was murdered or how it might be tied to Fd AND MT AND KMs reasons for killing her at all?

Is this writer supporting the idea first put forward by Fd "Sister" Rena that there is some unknown semitic thread behind not only the Fd difficulties first in Family Court and then in Civil Court against GF, business failing and legal prosecution by the State of CT for the murder of JFd? Its disturbing if this were what is being put forward by the articles author IMO. Initially I thought it was the grief of losing her brother that prompted all this spewing of venomous hate and hateful speech from "Sister" Rena directed at the Farber family, but now I simply think it is who she is. She is sadly a person that is incapable of looking objectively at her brother and holding him accountable for how he lived his life and how he conducted himself in life, business and marriage. Rena Dulos simply seems to be someone who points a long finger at everyone else, including JFd, OTHER THAN HER BROTHER for the CHOICE he made to murder JFd.

Rena in her remarks oddly seemed to support the relationship of Fd to MT which I found particularly fascinating as we now know that MT is no patsy but she was front and centre in ALL ASPECTS of the MURDER of JFd as wasn't simply along for any 'ride' on Albany Avenue - nope, MT was helping to 'clean' it all up even if 'she wasn't cleaning Jennifer' - which IMO was one of the most horrific statements in any of the AWs. If anyone has any doubts about this MT involvement then I'd just say look at the lying from MT and even her feeble attempts to stay true to the 'alibi scripts' when the pieces of paper were removed from her view. Nope, IMO MT was all in and had been for a long time and no doubt was so delusional as well that she believed that she would be back in 4Jx installed as the Queen AGAIN until she saw she had been replaced by a 'newer and fresher' and certainly wealthier model in the form of AC!

But, getting back to the articles. I do now see in reading them all again that the sourcing for some of this information is more than a bit suspect given the narrative overlap to so much of what we have been hearing now for months from Atty. P. and Pattisville along with Fd "Sister" Rena. I hope I'm wrong in my suspicions about the sourcing of this series of articles but IMO the narrative overlap is simply too consistent. Perhaps the writer will redeem himself somewhat in his subsequent instalments and get back to the facts set out so clearly by Atty Colangelo and LE but I see now that in his attempt to perhaps better understand Fd that his articles sadly read more like a laundry list of 'excuses' to justify or perhaps rationalise the murder of JFd by BOTH FD and MT.

MOO

This should be a "Letter to the Editor"...moo

 

[dlharris2712]

I just finished reading the 3rd AW.
Began highlighting key points then gave up.
It is jam packed with solid evidence, IMO.
Organized and detailed.
Quite a read.
Based on this I would say Miss Michelle is in big trouble. BBM
MOO.

Also known as "Michi" to her friends...per the article...lol! moo

 

[pernickety]

Its funny but IMO he never has to leave the office, just opens email or has a phone call and my guess is that the articles magically 'either write themselves' or possibly 'arrive fully baked and written'.

Watching the DA and HC situation play out in the Dulos case has IMO following many similar cases for a long time, been one of the least disguised and certainly most obvious tag teams between a possible source and a written article. I seriously question whether any pretence is made about multiple sourcing, objectivity or alternative POV. IMO the reporting we have seen simply breaks the mould on basic journalism standards and integrity and its been sad to watch.

MOO

I’m not an HC subscriber, but I’d like to ask Dave this: Who paid for FD’s defense in criminal court? Have the Probate Court records re FD’s estate turned up any creditors for his unpaid legal and investigative expenses, and has the estate Administrator requested and/or obtained the retainer agreement FD entered into with Pattis & Smith and a detailed accounting from P& S of how that retainer was spent, in order to determine if there are unexpended funds that may now be due to FD’s creditors and/or heirs?

 

[Chicago54]

@davealtimari
Trying something different. Going to do a Q&A on Dulos case. I've gotten private messages and questions from people so thought it'd be worth it. Next Tuesday at noon, you can submit questions ahead of time by following link. Its for subscribers only.
Courant investigative reporter Dave Altimari to answer your questions about the Dulos case live

Cannot express enough how much I despise this guy’s “reporting”.
And thought there was still a gag order in place?
Didn’t HC file a motion against the gag order?

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Not crazy at all. Apparently, they had planned for a bloodless killing, or at least to get out of that garage without making a big mess (and without having to clean it up - that seemed to have caught them off-guard!) and finish it elsewhere - perhaps back at 80MS? I think she fought back like crazy, surprising them.

Just thinking about Jennifer’s last moments of shock, horror, fear and panic and how hard she must have fought his bony little @** to survive. I definitely think he had an accomplice with him who assisted in subduing her when FD couldn’t. IMO

 

[pernickety]

What in the world could DA possibly know that we haven't already heard. Unless he has a direct link to LE that he can quote (which I doubt) I think this is a waste of time.

Who paid FD's legal bills.

 

[enelram]

Just thinking about Jennifer’s last moments of shock, horror, fear and panic and how hard she must have fought his bony little @** to survive. I definitely think he had an accomplice with him who assisted in subduing her when FD couldn’t. IMO

If there was an accomplice, then it must be Andreas Tout who was mentioned as a key person in the investigation along w/ mT and KM. Could be problems with him being back in Greece and difficulties finding and charging him.
there's a question for puppet DA.
Obvious to me mT and KM are not suspects in
the actual murder or they would have been charged by now.
Another question for DA, IF he were a trusted
conduit of inside information. Ask him what's
the latest on the attitude of LE against MT?
do they plan to pursue a trial? Offer her a deal
in exchange for information? What's her status?
there is just so so much that we don't know.
I'd love to see a running commentary on how LE believes this all played out.
And what about Birch St., Dave?

 

[acutename]

LA had mentioned that, when she arrived at 69 Welles Ln the morning of JFd's disappearance, she noticed that the paper towel dispenser in the kitchen was empty, so she went to the pantry and discovered 10 rolls missing from the package of 12 she'd put there the day before.

Seems odd that the paper towel dispenser in the kitchen would be empty if FD (and helper, if any) had gathered rolls of paper towels for cleanup in advance of the attack.

The fact that the dispenser was empty AND ten rolls were missing suggests to me that the attack occurred first and there was a lot more blood loss than planned, so individual paper towels or the roll itself were quickly taken from the kitchen dispenser and when those weren't enough, more rolls were gathered from the pantry (that act was probably attended by a lot of profane language). Assuming LA had left the package intact when she put it in the pantry, the fact that ten rather than twelve rolls were missing suggests the rolls were taken one or two at a time, rather than grabbing the whole package. I think there was a bit of panic about the quantity of blood and the unplanned mess that quantity of blood made.

The fact that few prints were found, and those only in the garage, was likely because thorough cleanup had been attempted. House interiors also tend to be lit much more brightly than garage interiors, so it is easier to do a thorough job of cleaning inside the house.

wonder how he/they found the paper towels since they had never been in the house..