DCA - American Airlines passenger plane collides with Blackhawk over the Potomac River, all 67 on both dead, 29 Jan 2025

[Cryptic]

I also am curious about the last minute switch to runway 33. I know it's done, but what are the protocols for switching like was done here?

As @acutename mentioned, its done to increase landing efficiency.

A commercial pilot on a Youtube channel mentioned that it is a routine option asked by ATC when they need to land planes quickly. He then related that he had flown the switched route and that it demands total concentration from the flight crew.

The pilot also implied that accepting the switch is voluntary as the ATC asks crews if they "can accept" the new assignment. This implies that if the flight crew is not comfortable with a rapid new assignment to a tricky approach, they can decline and still land at the originally assigned run way.

 

[JDG]

More victims of American Airlines plane crash identified

A dozen more victims of the deadly American Airlines and Black Hawk helicopter crash have been identified, authorities announced Sunday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[iamshadow21]

It's paywalled for me, but from the headline and the tiny bit I can read, I think it's about Olivia Ter and her mum.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2025/02/02/ice-skating-dca-plane-crash-virginia-mother-daughter/

This article is about the Livingston family.

'They're very rare': Family lost in DC plane crash dedicated lives to figure skating

Peter, Donna, Everly and Alydia Livingston devoted their lives to figure skating before the devastating plane crash near Reagan National Airport.

www.usatoday.com

 

[Charlot123]

More victims of American Airlines plane crash identified

A dozen more victims of the deadly American Airlines and Black Hawk helicopter crash have been identified, authorities announced Sunday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I'd really like to do something for the divers, you know. Any ideas?

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Sheesh ... for a few minutes I thought I was in the wrong universe here.

Posts have been removed.

This case is not about plastic, autism/ADHD, low testosterone levels, low sperm counts, Nomadic tribesman, warrior genes, men being the expendable sex, etc. None of this has any place in this discussion.

Please get back to discussing this tragedy, this plane crash, and stay on topic. Members who continue to post off topic will be removed from this discussion.

Thanks !!

 

[SouthAussie]

"Col. Francis Pera of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, Baltimore District, said crews are scheduled to begin lifting large pieces of the wreckage of both aircraft from the water at dawn on Monday after spending two days surveying the debris field and rehearsing how the recovery of the wreckage will go.

Pera said wreckage will be placed on flatbed trailers and taken to a nearby hanger for investigators to analyze.

Pera said that if crews come upon more human remains, the salvage teams are prepared to pause the operation to facilitate a "dignified recovery" of the victims."

DC plane crash updates: Remains of 55 victims recovered and positively identified

An American Airlines regional jet went down in the Potomac River near Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport.

abcnews.go.com

 

[SouthAussie]

"The families of victims of the deadliest US air disaster in nearly 25 years have visited the crash site

Dozens of people walked along the banks of the Potomac River near Reagan National Airport

They arrived in buses with a police escort, remembering loved ones" .

Families of DC plane crash victims visit site as 55 bodies recovered - and rescue team reveals 'horrors' in river

The families of victims of the deadliest US air disaster in nearly 25 years have visited the crash site - as bodies continue to be recovered from the Potomac River.

www.lbc.co.uk

 

[Lilibet]

"The families of victims of the deadliest US air disaster in nearly 25 years have visited the crash site

Dozens of people walked along the banks of the Potomac River near Reagan National Airport

They arrived in buses with a police escort, remembering loved ones" .

Families of DC plane crash victims visit site as 55 bodies recovered - and rescue team reveals 'horrors' in river

The families of victims of the deadliest US air disaster in nearly 25 years have visited the crash site - as bodies continue to be recovered from the Potomac River.

www.lbc.co.uk

I can’t begin to imagine the pain they must have felt visiting the site where they lost their loved ones in such a horrible way. It’s heartbreaking.

 

[Megnut]

I can’t begin to imagine the pain they must have felt visiting the site where they lost their loved ones in such a horrible way. It’s heartbreaking.

I'm sure it's been studied but just a sad observation -- each with personal grief over their individual loss but overwhelmed by the corporate loss. Like 9/11. Mass trauma over individual trauma. Like war.

And some victims still not recovered, perhaps those who were seated where the fuselage imploded.

And then the contrast now, as the sky and water look placid as if no terrible thing occurred there... except for the plane's carcass...

I can only try to fathom the grief...

Well-intentioned folks often say to those facing the tragedy of loss words about getting through it... and perhaps they mean getting through the passage of time because that comes but I don't know that there's ever a "getting through" grief. It sounds too close to "getting over" it and that hurts worse. I think what it really is, we hope they find a way to carry it.

Unfathomable loss. Multiplied.

I hope it helps to know a whole world of people care.

JMO

 

[SouthAussie]

I'm sure it's been studied but just a sad observation -- each with personal grief over their individual loss but overwhelmed by the corporate loss. Like 9/11. Mass trauma over individual trauma. Like war.

And some victims still not recovered, perhaps those who were seated where the fuselage imploded.

And then the contrast now, as the sky and water look placid as if no terrible thing occurred there... except for the plane's carcass...

I can only try to fathom the grief...

Well-intentioned folks often say to those facing the tragedy of loss words about getting through it... and perhaps they mean getting through the passage of time because that comes but I don't know that there's ever a "getting through" grief. It sounds too close to "getting over" it and that hurts worse. I think what it really is, we hope they find a way to carry it.

Unfathomable loss. Multiplied.

I hope it helps to know a whole world of people care.

JMO

They are all part of a club that they never wanted to belong to. And they each understand how they all feel.

May their lives be filled with kindness to help them along the difficult path they walk.

 

[Megnut]

Black Hawk helicopter's altitude at issue; families of crash victims 'want answers'

Victims' families gathered near the site where a plane and copter collided and fell into the Potomac River. 'They are all hurt,' an official said.

www.usatoday.com

 

[lynchmob67]

Salvage crews began lifting the wreckage of American Airlines Flight 5342 from the Potomac River in Washington on Monday morning, the start of an operation that was expected to take three days.

Crews Lift First Wreckage From D.C. Plane Crash Out of Potomac

A crane began removing the fuselage of the American Airlines jet that crashed into the Potomac River last week after colliding with an Army helicopter.

www.nytimes.com

 

[lynchmob67]

"Our goal is to really lift as much as we can, given the fact that we are also accounting for the human remains component," Col. Francis Pera with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers told reporters.

D.C. plane crash wreckage being removed from Potomac River

Crews spent the weekend positioning cranes and other key equipment following last week's deadly plane crash near Washington, D.C.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[IceIce9]

As @acutename mentioned, its done to increase landing efficiency.

A commercial pilot on a Youtube channel mentioned that it is a routine option asked by ATC when they need to land planes quickly. He then related that he had flown the switched route and that it demands total concentration from the flight crew.

The pilot also implied that accepting the switch is voluntary as the ATC asks crews if they "can accept" the new assignment. This implies that if the flight crew is not comfortable with a rapid new assignment to a tricky approach, they can decline and still land at the originally assigned run way.

As I mentioned (far) upthread, I was on a flight where the pilot refused a new runway assignment, and pulled up out of the landing pattern. He got on the PA to inform the passengers why he had pulled up from the landing pattern and that he didn’t think it was safe to change to the last minute ru way change. He went in to state that it is always up to the pilot whether to accept a new runway assignment and if they don’t feel comfortable with it they can refuse or circle around and come back to it.

 

[Megnut]

Did the Tower ever alert the commercial pilots to the presence of cross-traffic on their short runway approach?

 

[Justice101]

Did the Tower ever alert the commercial pilots to the presence of cross-traffic on their short runway approach?

probably not because all the incoming traffic for landing and take off was to the south. No crossover commercial flights.

 

[Megnut]

probably not because all the incoming traffic for landing and take off was to the south. No crossover commercial flights.

But here's where I'm stuck. Those two aircraft, even with the call out from the ATC at 12 seconds before contact, were uncomfortably close. Like mayday close. Seems like the AA pilots should have been advised (assuming they weren't) that switching to the sorry runway would bring them VERY CLOSE to the Blackhawk's crosswind course, giving the pilots enough information to reject the runway change or reject the landing altogether, in favor of a fly around.

100 feet of supposed clearance? Who could be satisfied with that?????? Comfortable near hit? Hot miss?

There's got to be a better way to prioritize incoming commercial flights with souls aboard and feathering in military transport, especially when it transects short approaches.

The aircraft was mere feet really from a successful landing. T-boned. By a projectile which could only happen IMO if both crews were blind to one another. And that just shouldn't be.

That's a gap we should be able to close. One crash too late.

JMO

 

[SouthAussie]

But here's where I'm stuck. Those two aircraft, even with the call out from the ATC at 12 seconds before contact, were uncomfortably close. Like mayday close. Seems like the AA pilots should have been advised (assuming they weren't) that switching to the sorry runway would bring them VERY CLOSE to the Blackhawk's crosswind course, giving the pilots enough information to reject the runway change or reject the landing altogether, in favor of a fly around.

100 feet of supposed clearance? Who could be satisfied with that?????? Comfortable near hit? Hot miss?

There's got to be a better way to prioritize incoming commercial flights with souls aboard and feathering in military transport, especially when it transects short approaches.

The aircraft was mere feet really from a successful landing. T-boned. By a projectile which could only happen IMO if both crews were blind to one another. And that just shouldn't be.

That's a gap we should be able to close. One crash too late.

JMO

Yes, I also think all should be informed of each other's close presence ... military aircraft or not.

It sounds as if the plane pilot(s) saw the helicopter at the last minute, as the preliminary flight data indicates they may have tried to pull up in the last seconds.

Pilots tried to pull passenger jet’s nose up within seconds of deadly DC helicopter collision, preliminary NTSB data shows
.

 

[vls12345]

'You helped bring our boy home' | Parents of Black Hawk crew member in DC crash share profound sense of loss, thank first responders

Staff Sgt. Ryan O'Hara was from Gwinnett County and an alum of Parkview High.

www.11alive.com

 

[PrairieWind]

But here's where I'm stuck. Those two aircraft, even with the call out from the ATC at 12 seconds before contact, were uncomfortably close. Like mayday close. Seems like the AA pilots should have been advised (assuming they weren't) that switching to the sorry runway would bring them VERY CLOSE to the Blackhawk's crosswind course, giving the pilots enough information to reject the runway change or reject the landing altogether, in favor of a fly around.

100 feet of supposed clearance? Who could be satisfied with that?????? Comfortable near hit? Hot miss?

There's got to be a better way to prioritize incoming commercial flights with souls aboard and feathering in military transport, especially when it transects short approaches.

The aircraft was mere feet really from a successful landing. T-boned. By a projectile which could only happen IMO if both crews were blind to one another. And that just shouldn't be.

That's a gap we should be able to close. One crash too late.

JMO

I think very poor reporting by the media is making this situation worse.
The airport is there, and it is busy. But, this is the nation's capital and the Army has to operate its own flight missions in the area. So, the flight corridors exist. This helicopter got out of the corridor and failed to observe visual avoidance as was required. We don't know why. The 100 ft issue is meaningless. It wasn't supposed to be anywhere near that close to the plane, the helicopter operating under visual separation authorization, meaning it is supposed to just fly around scheduled traffic. Normally that isn't a problem. But some reason, that night they failed to see the plane they were supposed to avoid.
The request to change runways had nothing to do with the helicopter and the AA pilots seemed to have no problem with the change.
I am an Army veteran and still think that the blame for this mostly falls on the Army pilots. Yes, the flight corridors are rough, but there is just a LOT of traffic that has to fly in that area. Should that all be reconsidered? Perhaps, but that is beyond my paygrade. But it seems maybe Reagan International needs to go away.