Emergency custody papers filed by mother of JI's son 11/14/11

[Karmaa]

That's what I don't understand about the explanation that it could be that JI somehow prevented her from seeing her child. Even if you truly believe that, that still is no excuse as to not having any contact for 6 years. I've never seen or heard of any mother (or father for that matter) simply ignore the child even exists because the ex is being a pain in the butt for visitation. Not if the mother really wants to be a part of that child's life. It wasn't even a small period of time, it's 6 years. That's a long time.

I'm curious to think what the reaction to this story would be if it was the other way around, meaning if it was a father doing this emergency custody order instead of a mother, but with the same circumstances (no contact for 6 years). I'm pretty positive the first question that comes up would be 'is he paying child support'? (mothers can pay child support too).

IIRC, RR was supposed to be paying child support to Jeremy, and hasn't. I remember reports that she is $25,000 behind.

 

[yllek]

You could be right, but exactly what does "was not able to" mean? It could mean that something prevented her (for example only: JI got in her way, or she was in jail).

Or it could be her way of saying that she just didn't feel like it or try. (As in: I wasn't able to get off the couch because I was so tired).

Regardless, judges do not take it well when their orders are not followed. If JI prevented her from seeing the kid, and she went back to court, she might even get custody just because HE prevented her from seeing the kid. That happens fairly often, actually - especially when one parent is trying to protect the child from an abusive ex. Simply refusing to allow that ex their visitation can result in the ex getting custody. That's why, no matter how bad it is, attorneys always advise their clients to follow the judges orders.

If this mom didn't see her son for 6 years, it's really doubtful that JI simply refused to let her.

BBM

I agree. We just don't know what the situation is with Ms. Raim. Because we don't know, I think it's fair to question her true desire to care for her son after 6 years of not seeing him. I understand her being concerned for her son no matter what her reasons for the last 6 years, given Lisa's reported abduction and Debbi's admitted drunkeness, anybody would be, imo. We have no indication that Ms. Raim is an evil heartless woman who could care less if her son disappeared too, so I won't assume that about her. But, I am not ready to say the court should hand the boy over to Ms. Raim, we don't know enough about her and her desire/fitness to provide a better environment and care than he is currently receiving from Jeremy and Debbi.

We also don't know enough about the lifestyle behind closed doors in Jeremy's house to know if there are issues that put the boy at risk; issues that may also have put Lisa at risk. The judge will have a lot of questions and factors to consider in making his ruling.

Assuming no delays (crossing fingers), we will know much more in 6 days when the custody hearing is held. If the gag order is denied, I think we will learn a lot more about the lifestyles and fitness of Ms. Raim, Jeremy, and Debbi. We will learn if Ms. Raim was somehow prevented from seeing her son or if she makes some excuse for not doing so. If the gag order goes through, we may learn little about the details and reasons, but at least we'll see whether to boy is left with Jeremy, placed with Ms. Raim, or placed elsewhere (and that will speak volumes about all involved, imo).

 

[Evan's Mom]

BBM

I agree. We just don't know what the situation is with Ms. Raim. Because we don't know, I think it's fair to question her true desire to care for her son after 6 years of not seeing him. I understand her being concerned for her son no matter what her reasons for the last 6 years, given Lisa's reported abduction and Debbi's admitted drunkeness, anybody would be, imo. We have no indication that Ms. Raim is an evil heartless woman who could care less if her son disappeared too, so I won't assume that about her. But, I am not ready to say the court should hand the boy over to Ms. Raim, we don't know enough about her and her desire/fitness to provide a better environment and care than he is currently receiving from Jeremy and Debbi.

We also don't know enough about the lifestyle behind closed doors in Jeremy's house to know if there are issues that put the boy at risk; issues that may also have put Lisa at risk. The judge will have a lot of questions and factors to consider in making his ruling.

Assuming no delays (crossing fingers), we will know much more in 6 days when the custody hearing is held. If the gag order is denied, I think we will learn a lot more about the lifestyles and fitness of Ms. Raim, Jeremy, and Debbi. We will learn if Ms. Raim was somehow prevented from seeing her son or if she makes some excuse for not doing so. If the gag order goes through, we may learn little about the details and reasons, but at least we'll see whether to boy is left with Jeremy, placed with Ms. Raim, or placed elsewhere (and that will speak volumes about all involved, imo).

One thing we do know is that she was seriously lackadaisical about seeing her child during the last six years for whatever reason.

I guess this hits really close to home for me. I divorced my ex over ten years ago. He wouldn't sign the papers unless I agreed to the absolute minimum in child support, $60 a week for three kids. He was a drug addict and abusive, so I went along with it just to be rid of him. Not once did dude ever pay me a dime. He lives 20 minutes away and has gotten clean off and on over the years. I even gave him the kids cell phone numbers so he wouldn't have to deal with me. He still acted like just because I divorced him, he divorced the three kids. He never called and never attempted to see them.

It's like they just didn't even exist anymore. I can see how that would happen if he were on drugs, but what about the times he was clean?
This is why I don't feel sympathy for RR in any way.

 

[vlpate]

IIRC, RR was supposed to be paying child support to Jeremy, and hasn't. I remember reports that she is $25,000 behind.

Do you have a source for this please? TIA

 

[Karmaa]

Do you have a source for this please? TIA

http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...-battle-for-missing-baby-s-older-half-brother

"That statement is comprised of very touching words written by a lawyer but are fictional when it comes to this woman and the 8 year old boy she abandoned," Tacopina wrote. Mrs. Raim hasn't seen her son, who she claims to care so much about, for six years, despite a court order allowing visits.

"Further expressing her concern for her son, she hasn't paid court ordered child support to help B****[the son]," Tacopina wrote. "Of course those facts were absent from the lawyer's statement."

I don't have a source on hand for the $25,000, but I'll look. It was one of the MSM people. MK maybe?

ETA: I still haven't found the $25,000, but I found this: http://www.kctv5.com/story/16043329/baby-lisas-parents-expected-to-move-back-into-home
"It's despicable to see a lady that hasn't seen her son or paid child support in six years all of a sudden claim to have an interest," Tacopina said." If she hasn't paid anything in 6 years, $25k doesn't seem like an unreasonable amount to be in arrears.

 

[vlpate]

http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...-battle-for-missing-baby-s-older-half-brother

"That statement is comprised of very touching words written by a lawyer but are fictional when it comes to this woman and the 8 year old boy she abandoned," Tacopina wrote. Mrs. Raim hasn't seen her son, who she claims to care so much about, for six years, despite a court order allowing visits.

"Further expressing her concern for her son, she hasn't paid court ordered child support to help B****[the son]," Tacopina wrote. "Of course those facts were absent from the lawyer's statement."

I don't have a source on hand for the $25,000, but I'll look. It was one of the MSM people. MK maybe?

Forgive me if I don't hang on Tacopina's every word - there was the $300/Jersey story just days ago.

I'll wait for the facts. Meanwhile - has JI taken a paternity test to verify he is Lisa's father? As it stood, he really had no rights as far as Lisa was concerned. He's not married to Deborah and I would imagine SB is listed as the father on the BC. If JI had wanted custody of Lisa, and DB didn't want him to have her, well, the only way he could do that would be to have her kidnapped - ruthless, I know.

SB hasn't seen his little boy in quite some time. IMO, this household is terribly dysfunctional and the example they are setting for these boys is less than ideal. It will be a miracle if they make in out without long term issues.

 

[cityslick]

Forgive me if I don't hang on Tacopina's every word - there was the $300/Jersey story just days ago.

I'll wait for the facts. Meanwhile - has JI taken a paternity test to verify he is Lisa's father? As it stood, he really had no rights as far as Lisa was concerned. He's not married to Deborah and I would imagine SB is listed as the father on the BC. If JI had wanted custody of Lisa, and DB didn't want him to have her, well, the only way he could do that would be to have her kidnapped - ruthless, I know.

SB hasn't seen his little boy in quite some time. IMO, this household is terribly dysfunctional and the example they are setting for these boys is less than ideal. It will be a miracle if they make in out without long term issues.

This is OT, but I'm assuming BL's legal last name is Irwin and I'm not sure you can do that without legally determining you are the father (if not her last name would of defaulted to Bradley). But I'm not 100% on that.

I went through something like this and I believe in my case, the ex had to state in an affidavit that the child was not mine. May be the same thing here.

 

[vlpate]

I don't think DB is absolved of anything. If she really did get drunk that night, it was wrong and yes, neglectful. But this isn't about DB. DB is not even a party in this action. This is about someone who hasn't seen her child in 6 years and now all of a sudden feels the need to 'get involved'.

this isn't about DB? This is NOT about someone who hasn't seen her child in 6 years - and yes, DB was neglectful of THREE children, including RR's child.

Look, truth be known, this is another case of lawyers and LE finding a way to depose the Bradley/Irwin's and find Lisa since they are not volunteering the information to find her themselves. RR is just a vehicle to get from A to B.

If the state felt those boys were in danger, they would have been removed. As for RR, I'm all for a mothers giving up her rights if they feel they are a bad mother - I applaud them for doing what's best for the child....but NONE of us know what went on with RR and JI - the bashing of RR, and the sudden canonization of DB, is hard to stomach while a precious baby is still missing.

 

[vlpate]

This is OT, but I'm assuming BL's legal last name is Irwin and I'm not sure you can do that without legally determining you are the father (if not her last name would of defaulted to Bradley). But I'm not 100% on that.

I went through something like this and I believe in my case, the ex had to state in an affidavit that the child was not mine. May be the same thing here.

According to DB's mother-in-law, and if I remember correctly, SB didn't even know DB was pregnant until he saw the missing BL story. Since she is married to SB, I do think the baby's name would default to Bradley, with SB as the father - otherwise, oy vey, the whole system would be a clustah.

 

[Sparklin]

Raim said she has not been able to see her son for years.

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...irwins-half-brothers-speaks-out#ixzz1fFd9vK5O

Not that she didn't want to...she was "not able".



(**sorry the link does not work any longer)

BBM and respectfully snipped by me
This speaks volumes to me. I think JI might just have been ruthless enough to deny her every time she asked until she quit asking, and/or made it so impossible to follow his rules for her visitation.

It really does happen, folks. That is one great reason for no Judge to ever, ever leave it up to a parent to set the guidelines. Sometimes the parent and the child's best interest is not followed or even thought of by the controlling parent.

MOO

But really, she is trying to fight for custody, is she going to say 'oh I have had better things to do so didn't get to see my son'...
It only makes sense she would word it that way imo

 

[epiphany]

http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...-battle-for-missing-baby-s-older-half-brother

"That statement is comprised of very touching words written by a lawyer but are fictional when it comes to this woman and the 8 year old boy she abandoned," Tacopina wrote. Mrs. Raim hasn't seen her son, who she claims to care so much about, for six years, despite a court order allowing visits.

"Further expressing her concern for her son, she hasn't paid court ordered child support to help B****[the son]," Tacopina wrote. "Of course those facts were absent from the lawyer's statement."

I don't have a source on hand for the $25,000, but I'll look. It was one of the MSM people. MK maybe?

Respectfully, BBM.

In the state I reside in, the custodial parent cannot prevent/deny nor make visitation difficult even if the non-custodial parent has months of unpaid child support. For all I know, Jeremy could have used the one to justify the other to the mother.

I wonder why Jeremy did not return to court to enforce his son's child support payments? I wonder why Jeremy's mother and father could not influence him to do so. Given what I have observed and read, that seems a little unusual. Maybe, Jeremy and Debbie as well as the GPs preferred it this way-it might make J and D uncomfortable if visitation occurred.

Perhaps, this wasn't the first time the couple's cell phones were turned off. Maybe, the mother could not reach Jeremy's personal cell in the past due to unpaid bills. Maybe, Jeremy refused to provide the mother his work cell number as an emergency number to reach him to set up visitation.

I expect the mother may begin visitation with her son soon and gradually work and build towards her son remaining with her overnight. That would also be a major plus for Debbie's son because she could spend more quality time with him and he could have her undivided attention!

 

[Donjeta]

We might hear a lot about RR's and JI's faults but whatever they are it doesn't sound like she stands a chance of getting custody if she's not seen her child in six years and hasn't paid child support and if supervised visits were required to begin with it. IDK why but it's hard to change the status quo with that kind of parenting history. Maybe there was mental illness or some other problem and she's better now in which case I think it would be best to start with visitation. But IMO, unles some info about Lisa's fate comes out in the open which I am not expecting to happen this custody hearing is largely irrelevant to me. It's sad that the boy hasn't seen his mom in six years for whatever reason but it's really between him, JI and RR and may not have anything to do with Lisa's case.

 

[mlc9852]

IIRC, RR was supposed to be paying child support to Jeremy, and hasn't. I remember reports that she is $25,000 behind.

JI doesn't seem to have very good taste in women.

 

[amymarie]

This is OT, but I'm assuming BL's legal last name is Irwin and I'm not sure you can do that without legally determining you are the father (if not her last name would of defaulted to Bradley). But I'm not 100% on that.

I went through something like this and I believe in my case, the ex had to state in an affidavit that the child was not mine. May be the same thing here.

In my state, with an unwed couple, if the father is present at the birth and signs the birth certificate, the baby can have his last name (no paternity test required if the father says the baby is his). If not, then the baby has the mother's last name.

 

[vlpate]

Consider this - if Lisa was kidnapped, and her birth certificate went with her, the name on the birth certificate is likely Bradley, not Irwin. Is this why everyone is calling her "Baby Lisa", because they know they are not looking for Lisa Irwin?

The long term implications? No one will look twice at the name Lisa Bradley on a birth certificate - daycare, hospital, school, passport.... everyone's looking for Lisa Irwin.

Does anyone know? What is the name on her BC?

 

[vlpate]

In my state, with an unwed couple, if the father is present at the birth and signs the birth certificate, the baby can have his last name (no paternity test required if the father says the baby is his). If not, then the baby has the mother's last name.

Yes, an unwed couple - one person in the Bradley/Irwin equation is married.

 

[cityslick]

Yes, an unwed couple - one person in the Bradley/Irwin equation is married.

Right, that's why I brought up the affidavit, because in my case we were married.

 

[vlpate]

Right, that's why I brought up the affidavit, because in my case we were married.

Like I said, I don't believe SB knew about Lisa, so he couldn't have waived his rights as the father....and the husband would be the assumed father.

Interesting.

 

[cityslick]

Like I said, I don't believe SB knew about Lisa, so he couldn't have waived his rights as the father....and the husband would be the assumed father.

Interesting.

Just to be clear (and this may not be their situation), I didn't sign or submit anything in my case. Both mom and dad signed an affidavit saying the child was theirs. No test was done.

If SB truly believes BL is his, he would need to prove it at this stage (dna test).

 

[hambirg]

BEM: Sorry, but those are NOT the only choices. There are other reasons one parent doesn't see their children, like fear and intimidation. What did it mean when family said Jeremy "ruthlessly" obtained custody? I've seen and heard all kinds of horror stories where a parent tries to find dirt on the other parent to win custody of a child. Sadly, killing the child is much too common solution for enraged and selfish parents.

Custody battles can be more brutal than a simple either/or. Google "father kills child in custody battle" - there are over 4 million results.

This post is not a reflection on anyone, just sayin', custody battles can get super ugly.

Somebody help me out. Very early on on this case, Steve Young had said, when talking about RR and SB (DB's husband), that RR had been deported. It was either a direct quote or he said it in an interview. I can't find it now, but I distinctly remember it, because she was one of my first suspicions.