Family wants to keep life support for girl brain dead after tonsil surgery #7

[rob]

I have tried to steer clear of commenting on speculation of what happened.

I think there is a lot of truth to the BBM in your post though. Whether it's as simple as Jahi being scared to have the procedure or it goes deeper, remains to be seen "if" we ever get to see or here from the hospital on what happened that day.

I have felt from the beginning, that the fact that the hospital wants to make a statement, and is not being allowed to, says that they have the other side of the story. If the family can disparage the hospital, then the hospital should be allowed to speak.
But I guess, once its in a courtroom, all sides of the story will be told.

 

[Quester]

Random thoughts and all JMO …

* * *

Possible moral of the story for the hospital … don’t bend the rules for anyone and even then there are no guarantees people won’t try to take advantage of the rules … unless hospital sets a no visitor policy and then they might not get any patients. JMO

* * *

Shouldn’t the FLOTUS take up this cause [ETA: meaning childhood obesity and choosing elective surgery rather that losing weight] <modsnip>? Didn’t she take up childhood obesity, diabetes, nutrition?

* * *

Why wasn’t this obese child guided to lose weight prior to any surgery? Was surgery chosen because it was the easier option? Why would a doctor agree to such a surgery without the child first losing weight? I’d like to understand why that surgery took place and why the parents agreed to it.

Since JM's case has such national coverage, I would think many parents of obese children, experiencing similar issues (sleep apnea, possible type 2 diabetes, bed wetting, etc), would benefit from such an article/discussion. JMO

* * *

I would bet this surgery is rarely to never done in France due to removal of the uvula making it impossible to pronounce the "r" sound in french.

 

[popsicle]

President of New Beginnings Allyson Scerri's Fox News Interview

Would give Jahi physical, speech and occupational therapy if she was in her facility. Get a clue woman.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=BTdhCQ2Qrjs

 

[Wolfie]

Random thoughts and all JMO …

Shouldn’t the FLOTUS take up this cause and could possibly have a direct impact particularly on the Black community? Didn’t she take up childhood obesity, diabetes, nutrition?

I hope that she wouldn't take it up. I don't think it's appropriate. I also don't think that the family deserves that kind of attention. I can't see how it could be done in a way that didn't offend one side or the other.

 

[Quester]

I hope that she wouldn't take it up. I don't think it's appropriate. I also don't think that the family deserves that kind of attention. I can't see how it could be done in a way that didn't offend one side or the other.

Sorry for the confusion ... I ETA'd my post with the bolded text below:

Shouldn&#8217;t the FLOTUS take up this cause [ETA: meaning childhood obesity and choosing elective surgery rather that losing weight] and could possibly have a direct impact particularly on the Black community? Didn&#8217;t she take up childhood obesity, diabetes, nutrition?

 

[rob]

President of New Beginnings Allyson Scerri's Fox News Interview

Would give Jahi physical, speech and occupational therapy if she was in her facility. Get a clue woman.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=BTdhCQ2Qrjs

Is she, as a hair dresser, qualified to do this?

Not trying to be ugly, just wondering.

 

[Quester]

[JM]: Family of brain-dead girl keeping out of public view
January 14, 2014, 10:36 a.m.

After waging a public battle to keep brain-dead [JM] on a ventilator and then transfer her body to an undisclosed facility, the 13-year-old girl's family has chosen to lie low and "heal up," their attorney said. ...

... Family members need to "heal up from this whole experience" and have "some quiet time" away from media questions, he added. ...

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...mily-brain-dead-body-20140114,0,6326964.story

 

[Nore]

Thank you for your post. Very well stated.

I have been hoping for someone in the mental health profession, that has experience with grief counseling, to whey in on this from that perspective.

I haven't seen any mental health professions, anywhere on the web speak about it.

---------
Hi Lark Bunting.
I can only say thank you. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. You have stated my exact thoughts. Yes I have lost two children, one stillbirth, one at 36, at 32 to a basilar artery stroke. I have sat here and thought what you wrote. My children were precious. My son was my life. I was on meds, still an antidepressant or I cry. You are needed here at other times too. Please stay with us. Nore.:seeya: :loveyou:

 

[LarkBunting]

Is she, as a hair dresser, qualified to do this?

Not trying to be ugly, just wondering.

Absolutely not. If she is a hairdresser, she is qualified to dress hair, not to provide physical, occupational, or any other sort of therapy.

I didn't listen to the interview bc I know it will just tick me off more, but did she say SHE would provide these therapies herself, or that she would hire actual credentialed, licensed professionals? Even if she did hire professionals, what makes her think she is capable of over-seeing these professionals?

Can somebody please order psych evals for EVERYONE connected to this case?


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[MissJ]

So to add to this. Do you think the whole keeping her on a ventilator is just to hope to mask the cause of death. If it comes out that the suction caused the bleed. That the family caused the bleed they wouldn't win a malpractice suit. Assuming of course that the suction device was in the icu and not handed to them by a nurse. So do you think it all boils down to guilt and money?

Possibly so. JMO. No nurse ever handed any family member a suction catheter. As a retired RN I will guarantee that.:twocents:No RN is that stupid.

 

[Donjeta]

Absolutely not. If she is a hairdresser, she is qualified to dress hair, not to provide physical, occupational, or any other sort of therapy.

I didn't listen to the interview bc I know it will just tick me off more, but did she say SHE would provide these therapies herself, or that she would hire actual credentialed, licensed professionals? Even if she did hire professionals, what makes her think she is capable of over-seeing these professionals?

Can somebody please order psych evals for EVERYONE connected to this case?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The question she was asked was what kind of therapy Jahi would receive in her facility, she listed what they're offering and didn't go into any detail about the credentials of the therapists.

It doesn't matter really, it could be a Harvard professor or the ice cream truck driver offering speech therapy and it would make just as much difference to a brain dead person. And it doesn't seem like Jahi is going anyway. But hey, some free publicity never hurt anyone.

 

[joypath]

From American Thinker or American Stinker?

* * *

[JM] is Alive
http://www.americanthinker.com/2014/01/jahi_mcmath_is_alive.html

From the "publication/opinion piece": "The dehumanizing language and failure to accommodate Jahi's family led to involvement of the Terri Schiavo Foundation, who eventually helped the family find alternative medical care. Bobby Schindler, Terri's brother, eloquently describes the efforts to dehumanize brain injured persons, as in this case of his sister, where Terri's Schiavo's diagnosis of "persistent vegetative state" led some to regard her as less than human, as Jahi's diagnosis of "brain death" allows her to be confused with a person who is actually deceased."

BBM: PVS of Mrs Schiavo is NOT the same as "brain death"! PVS PATIENTS retain brain function, brain dead individuals DO NOT retain brain function.


To confound the issue deeper, the Texas case is cited: " Here physicians do not regard her as a corpse, but a patient in need of their best efforts." BUT the next point is made: "The organ transplant literature states that in the case of "brain death" the patient's family is offered the possibility of donating their loved one's organs to others. In this case, the physiological functions of patient are fully supported. If the patient is not an organ donor, therapeutic measures cease."

HOW the HECK can this author (aka physician under a nome de plume) MISS the basic fact in the 2 statements: The Texas case is driven by TEXAS law, the California case is following CA LAW and oh by the way, the mother in TEXAS is providing an organ donation, a uterus! (Sorry to be so darn blunt!)

And the last insult: " No pathologist will perform an autopsy and no funeral director will embalm a "brain dead" person." REALLY??? Heaven help us if this were NOT done!
TOTAL & COMPLETE cessation of brain perfusion & brain stem function are exactly what make up the COD for a brain dead decedent.

Scares me what is available as an enabling tool for those set in NW's (or is it now OS's) "camp"

 

[ItsJustaName]

If a family member did cause Jahi's death, they could still feel the hospital was at fault by not preventing them from doing something stupid. Maybe the thought process would be "If a nurse had been in the room at all times it would not have happened, There was not a nurse in the room. Therefore it is the hospital's fault she died." I have seen this type of thinking more than once. The person cannot admit that they caused the problem so it has to be someone else's fault, no matter how convoluted.

 

[danzn16]

Has it been said why they think Jahi bled out in the ICU room? I have read above the family may have used a suctioning device or fed solid foods when they weren't supposed to. Is this just questioning or was there something said about this? I haven't been able to keep up as well as I would like.

 

[joypath]

Since you mentioned it..... I have wondered if it will even be possible for Jahi to be embalmed after so much time.

Absolutely NOT a funeral director but.....I'm sure that the body could be prepared by embalming but as for an open casket viewing...um, not so much depending on the skin turgor. (not going into detail but flash back to your days in the sun & wind and the subsequent dehydration of your exposed skin).

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/003281.htm

 

[LarkBunting]

---------
Hi Lark Bunting.
I can only say thank you. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. You have stated my exact thoughts. Yes I have lost two children, one stillbirth, one at 36, at 32 to a basilar artery stroke. I have sat here and thought what you wrote. My children were precious. My son was my life. I was on meds, still an antidepressant or I cry. You are needed here at other times too. Please stay with us. Nore.:seeya: :loveyou:

You are so welcome, Nore. Thank you for sharing your personal experiences with us. I have read your posts & feel that you have given us readers wise thoughts on the experience of having a child on life support & on being a bereaved mother. I am so sorry for your losses.

I have lost babies through miscarriage & had a terrible time grieving them. I can't imagine losing a living child that I had spent years of time loving and raising. I have counseled grieving parents, but I don't pretend to know the magnitude of their loss firsthand. This is why I honestly can't and won't judge Jahi's mother's statements or actions.

I don't usually talk about this, but if it gives perspective, it may be helpful to someone. As I was miscarrying (the first time), I knew what was happening & knew my tiny, itsy baby had no chance of life. Even though my rational, scientific brain KNEW it was impossible, I sobbed & begged the doctor to "please, put it back in!" (Maybe it would reattach and continue to grow and come back to life and none of this would be happening...) This was irrational grief talking. Clearly, I needed someone to step in & help me. I was fortunate to have a good nurse who held my hand, gently told me my baby was gone & couldn't come back to life, & even told me that she had been through this & it would be okay & now, she has three kids, & someday, I would have a baby who lived. (She was right.) She was very kind, but also firm. I am thankful that she sat with me in my early grief -- without enabling that grief or any irrational or magical thinking.

I wonder if there was anyone like that to do the same for Jahi's mother. She needs someone to help her. I can imagine that in her grief, it must be insanely confusing to be surrounded by people who are, literally, spouting delusional thoughts of resurrection. This is only making things worse for her. My heart goes out to her, even as it hardens in anger at those enabling her magical thinking.


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[Herat]

No matter how much we discuss ethics of death in the modern times, we cannot ignore the HUGE secondary gain from the money numbers floated out there by Dolan.

$30 million is a huge enough number to make normal people do completely insane things.

<modsnip> I think they really underestimate the process they are going to go through for any money. Of course, having a noisly public primed to support you in your David vs Goliath fight never hurts.

JMO

 

[joypath]

Has it been said why they think Jahi bled out in the ICU room? I have read above the family may have used a suctioning device or fed solid foods when they weren't supposed to. Is this just questioning or was there something said about this? I haven't been able to keep up as well as I would like.

Here's the "family" lawyer's view: http://www.contracostatimes.com/new...describes-jahi-mcmaths-post-surgical-bleeding


Naturally, CHO can NOT release the medical records...Jahi's mother has prohibited that & HIPAA rules remain in effect without a release

 

[Hopeful One]

I would like to thank all of the contributors to this thread. If the public wants to become knowledgeable on this case, this is a great place for the most accurate information. Funny how you think you know a case until you started reading these threads.

You all are awesome! :blowkiss:

 

[Peliman]

This page collects, in reverse chronological order, key court cases pertaining to medical futility.

http://thaddeuspope.com/futilitycases.html

Legal filings in the Jahi case and others throughout the years.