Father says DNA could solve one of country’s biggest murder mysteries: Who killed JonBenét Ramsey #2

[GRT]

Yes, I always will believe he killed JB.
Everyone has the right their own opinions, and that is mine.

If advanced DNA found a male who matched the DNA found in the crotch of JBR's panties and also under her fingernails--and then the man broke down and confessed and offered the story of exactly how he killed her and it matched the info the BPD has -- would you still believe JR killed his child?

 

[Bekind89]

If advanced DNA found a male who matched the DNA found in the crotch of JBR's panties and also under her fingernails--and then the man broke down and confessed and offered the story of exactly how he killed her and it matched the info the BPD has -- would you still believe JR killed his child?

Yes, but that hasn't happened, has it? And imo, it never will.

 

[CloudedTruth]

I want to thank GRT for posting this and especially for mentioning the comments that follow the story.
Super interesting and enlightening.
They make me personally feel positive and full of hope that this case will be resolved.
The following is my favorite comment following the story and the one that rings true to me.

All IMHO


Otter63
31 January, 2025

This case is the biggest travesty in the history of US crimes. They have played this out long enough. Why hasn't the FBI or CIA been involved, since it seems to be the local Law Enforcement is part of the crime that has been committed? Talk about a "Cover Up".

The FBI has been involved since day one. The CIA's purpose is to collect and analyze foreign intelligence in order to protect national security. A murder case is not in their realm.

Local LE are not the bad guys in this case, although there certainly has been a concerted effort to paint them in that light. It's a deflection tactic.

 

[GRT]

The FBI has been involved since day one. The CIA's purpose is to collect and analyze foreign intelligence in order to protect national security. A murder case is not in their realm.

Local LE are not the bad guys in this case, although there certainly has been a concerted effort to paint them in that light. It's a deflection tactic.

Local LE were the ones that ran the FBI off at first. That was a big mistake but only one of many.

Arndt was a huge problem. And her story conveniently changed with time. Her initial report didn't mention all her "feelings" that JR was an evil killer. But, in subsequent statements, as the heat started settling over her for all her mistakes, she suddenly knew JR did it.

 

[AddieBoo]

A week or so ago, we were talking about whether most people now thought the Ramseys were guilty in the death of JonBenet or innocent. I mentioned that in my experience, I thought most people now think the Ramseys were always innocent.

Today, I ran across this DNA update story, and it's interesting, but even more interesting are the comments that follow the story. I'll leave to WS'ers to decide what boat they think most folks are in.

JonBenet Ramsey’s Dad Shares New Update After Meeting with Boulder P.D.: "I Think..."

John Ramsey is still pushing to find his daughter's killer almost 30 years later, and met with police to discuss re-testing DNA evidence.

www.yahoo.com

I'm just pointing it out because I've observed opinions changing as new evidence is released.

I do think that on true crime sites, the opinion favors blaming the R's, but I don't think that is the general consensus, which is why I wanted to mention it.

I do get a sense of competition from some here, though. And, I'm also seeing a lot of unsubstantiated

The FBI has been involved since day one. The CIA's purpose is to collect and analyze foreign intelligence in order to protect national security. A murder case is not in their realm.

Local LE are not the bad guys in this case, although there certainly has been a concerted effort to paint them in that light. It's a deflection tactic.

Despite whatever anyone thinks about who did what, when, about this crime, as my personal consolation for all the lies, obfuscation, twisting of facts and manipulation of information broadcasted to the public by the Ramsey bot farms and their leader, John Ramsey, the Four True Bills stand, as the most powerful indictment against the Ramsey family, and are public record forever.

Thirteen men and women met for 13 months. They heard all the testimonies and evidence with full subpoena power. They were an investigative Grand Jury. They heard all the “theories” regarding Lou Smits intruder theory. They heard from John Douglas. The good citizens who participated were vetted and sworn in to investigate this crime without bias. The conclusion, based on facts, was that John and Patsy Ramsey were KNOWINGLY RESPONSIBLE for the death of JonBenet Ramsey, and the subsequent cover up of her murder.
MOO

 

[CloudedTruth]

Despite whatever anyone thinks about who did what, when, about this crime, as my personal consolation for all the lies, obfuscation, twisting of facts and manipulation of information broadcasted to the public by the Ramsey bot farms and their leader, John Ramsey, the Four True Bills stand, as the most powerful indictment against the Ramsey family, and are public record forever.

Thirteen men and women met for 13 months. They heard all the testimonies and evidence with full subpoena power. They were an investigative Grand Jury. They heard all the “theories” regarding Lou Smits intruder theory. They heard from John Douglas. The good citizens who participated were vetted and sworn in to investigate this crime without bias. The conclusion, based on facts, was that John and Patsy Ramsey were KNOWINGLY RESPONSIBLE for the death of JonBenet Ramsey, and the subsequent cover up of her murder.
MOO

Amen.

That is absolutely the bottom line, no matter who tries to twist it.

 

[GRT]

Despite whatever anyone thinks about who did what, when, about this crime, as my personal consolation for all the lies, obfuscation, twisting of facts and manipulation of information broadcasted to the public by the Ramsey bot farms and their leader, John Ramsey, the Four True Bills stand, as the most powerful indictment against the Ramsey family, and are public record forever.

Thirteen men and women met for 13 months. They heard all the testimonies and evidence with full subpoena power. They were an investigative Grand Jury. They heard all the “theories” regarding Lou Smits intruder theory. They heard from John Douglas. The good citizens who participated were vetted and sworn in to investigate this crime without bias. The conclusion, based on facts, was that John and Patsy Ramsey were KNOWINGLY RESPONSIBLE for the death of JonBenet Ramsey, and the subsequent cover up of her murder.
MOO

Except that the GJ never saw the DNA report that came out in 2008.

It’s a funny thing about DNA, it can flip a story on its head.

 

[CloudedTruth]

Despite whatever anyone thinks about who did what, when, about this crime, as my personal consolation for all the lies, obfuscation, twisting of facts and manipulation of information broadcasted to the public by the Ramsey bot farms and their leader, John Ramsey, the Four True Bills stand, as the most powerful indictment against the Ramsey family, and are public record forever.

Thirteen men and women met for 13 months. They heard all the testimonies and evidence with full subpoena power. They were an investigative Grand Jury. They heard all the “theories” regarding Lou Smits intruder theory. They heard from John Douglas. The good citizens who participated were vetted and sworn in to investigate this crime without bias. The conclusion, based on facts, was that John and Patsy Ramsey were KNOWINGLY RESPONSIBLE for the death of JonBenet Ramsey, and the subsequent cover up of her murder.
MOO

Gretchen Smith, who was a member of the Boulder PD and honored as Officer of the Year for 1996 had this to say:

She believed that one of the reasons DA Hunter did not want to prosecute was because of the Ramseys clout in the Boulder community.

“The parents of the child, they had money. The District Attorney’s office and some of the administration did not want to hear that an affluent member of the community was guilty of a crime like this….I don’t think they wanted to solve this crime, and if they had to go down a different path that might not have been the truth, I think they were willing to do that.”

She went on to describe how it was an expectation that the DA’s office work in cooperation with LE to solve a case, and how in this case they did the opposite. To the point where it affected police morale substantially.

Steve Thomas in his resignation letter stated: “Attempts to gather evidence were met with refusals and instead was suggested we ask for permission from the Ramseys before proceeding”.

DA Hunter then proceeded to hide from the public that the GJ had returned 2 true bills for each parent holding them responsible for the death of their child. What was the purpose of that? The citizens and community of Boulder had a right to know what the GJ concluded.

The GJ did their job. They performed their sworn duty and found despite the DA’s attempts to prevent the truth from being known, that the preponderance of the evidence showed that the Ramseys were responsible for the death of JonBenet.

But as the recent to this case OJ Simpson case proved, money talks. To suggest the Ramseys were treated unfairly is simply not true.

 

[AddieBoo]

Gretchen Smith, who was a member of the Boulder PD and honored as Officer of the Year for 1996 had this to say:

She believed that one of the reasons DA Hunter did not want to prosecute was because of the Ramseys clout in the Boulder community.

“The parents of the child, they had money. The District Attorney’s office and some of the administration did not want to hear that an affluent member of the community was guilty of a crime like this….I don’t think they wanted to solve this crime, and if they had to go down a different path that might not have been the truth, I think they were willing to do that.”

She went on to describe how it was an expectation that the DA’s office work in cooperation with LE to solve a case, and how in this case they did the opposite. To the point where it affected police morale substantially.

Steve Thomas in his resignation letter stated: “Attempts to gather evidence were met with refusals and instead was suggested we ask for permission from the Ramseys before proceeding”.

DA Hunter then proceeded to hide from the public that the GJ had returned 2 true bills for each parent holding them responsible for the death of their child. What was the purpose of that? The citizens and community of Boulder had a right to know what the GJ concluded.

The GJ did their job. They performed their sworn duty and found despite the DA’s attempts to prevent the truth from being known, that the preponderance of the evidence showed that the Ramseys were responsible for the death of JonBenet.

But as the recent to this case OJ Simpson case proved, money talks. To suggest the Ramseys were treated unfairly is simply not true.

Gretchen Smith, who was a member of the Boulder PD and honored as Officer of the Year for 1996 had this to say:

She believed that one of the reasons DA Hunter did not want to prosecute was because of the Ramseys clout in the Boulder community.

“The parents of the child, they had money. The District Attorney’s office and some of the administration did not want to hear that an affluent member of the community was guilty of a crime like this….I don’t think they wanted to solve this crime, and if they had to go down a different path that might not have been the truth, I think they were willing to do that.”

She went on to describe how it was an expectation that the DA’s office work in cooperation with LE to solve a case, and how in this case they did the opposite. To the point where it affected police morale substantially.

Steve Thomas in his resignation letter stated: “Attempts to gather evidence were met with refusals and instead was suggested we ask for permission from the Ramseys before proceeding”.

DA Hunter then proceeded to hide from the public that the GJ had returned 2 true bills for each parent holding them responsible for the death of their child. What was the purpose of that? The citizens and community of Boulder had a right to know what the GJ concluded.

The GJ did their job. They performed their sworn duty and found despite the DA’s attempts to prevent the truth from being known, that the preponderance of the evidence showed that the Ramseys were responsible for the death of JonBenet.

But as the recent to this case OJ Simpson case proved, money talks. To suggest the Ramseys were treated unfairly is simply not true.

Ramsey wining about being treated unfairly is just another example of a world class narcissist. IMO. It’s all about his “suffering” not the brutal murder of his daughter.

One six year old child, brutally murdered and all the lives that have been influenced and ruined as result in the pursuit of justice for her. What was Boulder worried about? Their frickin property values? My heart goes out to those LE. Their whole world is to get the bad guy. And how they were prevented from doing their job is criminal. And the frickin Governor did basically nothing. And where was their AG?
Just wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

A lot of people think that if the case would have proceeded to full indictments leading to charges and trial, that it would have been impossible to win for the DA. But I beg to differ. A trial would have brought forth more discovery and more witnesses.. A comprehensive investigation about the finances of John Ramsey and what the pressures were regarding his relationship with Lockheed.
Even now, I believe a jury would come to the same conclusion with the distinct possibility of naming the primary person responsible. The SA evidence and testimony alone would be very persuasive for motive. And all the media clips and interviews? But then you never know about juries..
That GJ restored my faith in humanity about this case. Those jurors did their jobs and so grateful that reporter busted Alex Hunter!

I really want to know about those 911 calls on Dec 17th, and if John Ramsey was at home the time of those calls…….New thread? But dunno if those facts will ever be known..,

 

[Ponytale]

A lot of people think that if the case would have proceeded to full indictments leading to charges and trial, that it would have been impossible to win for the DA. But I beg to differ. A trial would have brought forth more discovery and more witnesses.. A comprehensive investigation about the finances of John Ramsey and what the pressures were regarding his relationship with Lockheed.
Even now, I believe a jury would come to the same conclusion with the distinct possibility of naming the primary person responsible. The SA evidence and testimony alone would be very persuasive for motive. And all the media clips and interviews? But then you never know about juries..
That GJ restored my faith in humanity about this case. Those jurors did their jobs and so grateful that reporter busted Alex Hunter!

Yes! I agree with you 100%.
There is no way that the GJ believed that the Ramsey's were innocent. It's impossible. All you have to do is think along with the indictments they presented to see that.

1 - The Grand Jury had a probable cause to believe that both Patsy and John were guilty of knowingly putting JB into harms way and that they both helped (rendered assistance) each other in covering up the crime.

That is a fact and, IMO, proves 100% that they can not be seen as innocent.

As I believe in my theory that Burke was involved in a part of that crime that started the whole thing in the first place, I read the next indictment as follows:

2 - They say that each parent (John and Patsy) knowingly rendered assistance to a person (only other person in the house was Burke), knowing that the person (Burke) being assisted has committed and was suspected of the crime of Murder in the First Degree and Child Abuse Resulting in Death.

Meaning - they knew (or believed) that Burke had killed JB and assisted in covering up the crime. They just could not have mentioned Burke's name in the True Bill indictments because of the law.

Now, the second one is only my own opinion and interpretation of the second indictment. I know it could be read in different ways and I do not argue that as I do not know what the GJ thought (I hope we one day will). But it is one possibility...

Yes, we can assume that it also could have been a third party - someone outside the house. A "crazy monster intruder" coming into their house to murder their child? Now why would John and Patsy have rendered assistance to an intruder to kill their child? Really? Parents would not help him.
So here goes the intruder theory...

 

[AddieBoo]

Yes! I agree with you 100%.
There is no way that the GJ believed that the Ramsey's were innocent. It's impossible. All you have to do is think along with the indictments they presented to see that.

1 - The Grand Jury had a probable cause to believe that both Patsy and John were guilty of knowingly putting JB into harms way and that they both helped (rendered assistance) each other in covering up the crime.

That is a fact and, IMO, proves 100% that they can not be seen as innocent.

As I believe in my theory that Burke was involved in a part of that crime that started the whole thing in the first place, I read the next indictment as follows:

2 - They say that each parent (John and Patsy) knowingly rendered assistance to a person (only other person in the house was Burke), knowing that the person (Burke) being assisted has committed and was suspected of the crime of Murder in the First Degree and Child Abuse Resulting in Death.

Meaning - they knew (or believed) that Burke had killed JB and assisted in covering up the crime. They just could not have mentioned Burke's name in the True Bill indictments because of the law.

Now, the second one is only my own opinion and interpretation of the second indictment. I know it could be read in different ways and I do not argue that as I do not know what the GJ thought (I hope we one day will). But it is one possibility...

Yes, we can assume that it also could have been a third party - someone outside the house. A "crazy monster intruder" coming into their house to murder their child? Now why would John and Patsy have rendered assistance to an intruder to kill their child? Really? Parents would not help him.
So here goes the intruder theory...

 

[AddieBoo]

Yes! I agree with you 100%.
There is no way that the GJ believed that the Ramsey's were innocent. It's impossible. All you have to do is think along with the indictments they presented to see that.

1 - The Grand Jury had a probable cause to believe that both Patsy and John were guilty of knowingly putting JB into harms way and that they both helped (rendered assistance) each other in covering up the crime.

That is a fact and, IMO, proves 100% that they can not be seen as innocent.

As I believe in my theory that Burke was involved in a part of that crime that started the whole thing in the first place, I read the next indictment as follows:

2 - They say that each parent (John and Patsy) knowingly rendered assistance to a person (only other person in the house was Burke), knowing that the person (Burke) being assisted has committed and was suspected of the crime of Murder in the First Degree and Child Abuse Resulting in Death.

Meaning - they knew (or believed) that Burke had killed JB and assisted in covering up the crime. They just could not have mentioned Burke's name in the True Bill indictments because of the law.

Now, the second one is only my own opinion and interpretation of the second indictment. I know it could be read in different ways and I do not argue that as I do not know what the GJ thought (I hope we one day will). But it is one possibility...

Yes, we can assume that it also could have been a third party - someone outside the house. A "crazy monster intruder" coming into their house to murder their child? Now why would John and Patsy have rendered assistance to an intruder to kill their child? Really? Parents would not help him.
So here goes the intruder theory...

Absolutely. Especially after reading what the Ramsey loyalists believe the facts are.

Alex Hunter feared any hint of prosecution from a jury IMO. Whatever chance to none couldn’t be risked. IMO I agree a good winning case could have been made charging the Ramsey’s and prosecuting them.

There was no proof - even probable cause proof of an intruder. Full stop. The end. IMO Any DNA evidence that the defense presents would be shredded by the prosecution. IMO

The Grand Jury heard some type of history that the words “Knowingly”
were chosen In their True Bills.
The final two weeks of December there were five calls of urgency made that are connected to the Ramsey’s.

Three after a pageant. One at a Christmas party. One for the murder.
Patsy was calling for help in some capacity on December 17th. Something that she couldn’t remember…
Then the Christmas party. The call attributed to Fleet White - yet he has never publicly stated the reason why he allegedly made that call. Susan Stine takes control when police show up. Where were Patsy and John at that time? The door was never opened for LE. Susan Stine responded through intercom system. That is IMO, a lot of control.

There is a good, strong argument, I agree, for BR involvement. And the True Bills are mysterious in that way, regarding accessory… The request for the medical records of BR were denied. I don’t know if those records were subpoenaed by the GJ. But only if those records contained pertinent information about the murder would their access be denied. IMO.
However, IMO, if BR is involved in the actual murder, or any part if it, he will be historically labeled as one brilliant kid psychopath for his ability to evade detection by LE.
It’s possible. And maybe all the “Burke was not involved” rhetoric from LE and attorneys is just a smoke screen…
Would love to know the facts surrounding the word, “knowingly”
In those True Bills.
MOO

 

[Ponytale]

There is a good, strong argument, I agree, for BR involvement. And the True Bills are mysterious in that way, regarding accessory… The request for the medical records of BR were denied. I don’t know if those records were subpoenaed by the GJ. But only if those records contained pertinent information about the murder would their access be denied. IMO.
However, IMO, if BR is involved in the actual murder, or any part if it, he will be historically labeled as one brilliant kid psychopath for his ability to evade detection by LE.
It’s possible. And maybe all the “Burke was not involved” rhetoric from LE and attorneys is just a smoke screen…
Would love to know the facts surrounding the word, “knowingly”
In those True Bills.
MOO

Oh I hope that the GJ will speak more about what was behind their indictments one day...

I only see Burke being involved in the accident, not in the cover up. But it is only my opinion.
And I see it possible only when I believe that Burke really did not know anything about the cover up and what really happened to JB. At least not when it happened, or some time soon after.
What you mentioned is actually part of why I believe it - if he did not know about anything, he could not talk about anything. And then he does not need to be brilliant for evading any suspicion or detection - there is nothing to hide if you are sincere, IMO. He's just a kid telling his story and keeping one secret that was told to be kept.

Many believe that Burke could not have been involved in this crime because then there had to be so much "coaching" and he needed to learn how to lie about things and fool all the detectives. But it does not have to be so difficult. I don't see it this way. I think too, that if he knew what actually happened, he, a 9-year-old boy (or even at 11), would not have been able to "fool" all the people and detectives questioning him, into believing that he did not know about the things he was asked about. There would have been signs of deception and he would have had much more nervous body language at interviews. IMO. Quite a difficult job even for an adult to lie convincingly to LE, never mind a little boy. And to keep doing it for 28 years...

But, if he was only responsible for the accident and was told by his parents that JB woke up after it and was fine, he believed them exactly because he was a little boy and believed his parents. He also believed a kidnapper came to their house and took his sister from her bed in the middle of the night if he was told so by his father. So, he seemed like he did not know about anything because he really did not know anything else, except that his sister was kidnapped. And then later found murdered. IMO.

There is a chance that all that Burke has stated in his interviews is actually true. I have read and watched his interviews available to us through the mindset of him not knowing about staging part, and it seems quite credible.
He doesn't change his statements like his parents do. It just could be that what he is saying is what he knew that time of what happened. IMO

And if I believe this, then all the "coaching" he really needed was his parents telling him that he can never tell anyone about the accident when he hit JB on the head. And that's it. We have already discussed here about kids keeping secrets. IMO, not a hard secret to keep for a child if his parents (and maybe later lawyers too) told him to do so...
And especially if he did connect the dots some time later and knows that it probably is not true that he did not play any part in this - it is a secret he must keep.

IMO

 

[AddieBoo]

You make a persuasive theory.
I had to stew on this…
From everything that is publicly known, BR striking his sisters skull with the flashlight makes sense. Though the flashlight was a gift from JAR to JR, one perception is that Burke used it frequently at night. And why his medical records were sealed?
The murder of JonBenet was violent. It was brutal. ..
IIRC the psychologist that interviewed BR after the murder had requested a follow-up visit.
I have read on these sites that there is a belief/suspicion that BR could have some history of SA too.

I do believe that BR was heavily influenced by professional advisors- be it PR or attorneys. There was too much pressure on JR to prevent any hint of information that could further LE suspecting their involvement. The final sale of Access Graphics had not been made yet, and Lockheed was in the glare of the SEC. Lockheed was in mega millions in their association with JR.., that ship would not sink.

My point is that despite what ever feelings BR had for his sister, he knows she was murdered. And while that could be considered at a level of cool to a non grieving sister hating 10 year old…that reality had to have set in…. Or that reality in no uncertain terms was explained. Did he ever feel threatened? Psychological threats are extremely real in families. Particularly it would seem, to a family where SA was occurring.
That’s a possible childhood for BR.

But when BR reaches teenage years on to adulthood what then? His mom dies. Pending death can be one heck of a manipulative tool.
What are the dynamics of a family who has to keep a catastrophic secret, a secret about their parents, a secret about their sister? A secret that may have had nothing to do with them. Or a secret they were partially involved in.
That’s heavy drama on a Shakespearean level.
Cause all the family members have some level of leverage…and some level of resentment. IMO

IMO, John Ramsey controlled his family. But now? After 29 years of blood sport cat and mouse media games? Have his kids finally had enough?
MOO

 

[CloudedTruth]

You make a persuasive theory.
I had to stew on this…
From everything that is publicly known, BR striking his sisters skull with the flashlight makes sense. Though the flashlight was a gift from JAR to JR, one perception is that Burke used it frequently at night. And why his medical records were sealed?
The murder of JonBenet was violent. It was brutal. ..
IIRC the psychologist that interviewed BR after the murder had requested a follow-up visit.
I have read on these sites that there is a belief/suspicion that BR could have some history of SA too.

According to Mark Becker who was specifically asked about medical records in the AMA he did for Reddit, the Ramseys did sign a release for BR's medical records. The police have never divulged what they contain, which is appropriate given that he was a minor. This probably why so many people seem to think the records were sealed from the police.

The child psychologist did have some concerns about BR and abuse. She did want to do another interview, which was denied. She had hoped to explore the abuse question as well as his lack of emotions, seeming feelings of detachment from his sister and parents, and what she strongly felt was the effects on him of having to live in such a dysfunctional environment.

But she also expressed he did not show any signs of sociopathic behaviors or that he was responsible for what had happened. Det. Patterson who interviewed BR on 12/26 at the home of the Whites also felt that BR was not responsible for what happened to JBR.

I do think however, that he knows more than he has told. Given what we know of the approximated TOD and that he was up, awake and downstairs much later than his parents said, I think it's very likely that he at least heard something. As I have mentioned before, there is evidence that suggests what happened started in JBR's bedroom. If he was back in his bed by that time, I believe it could be the same scenario that he related about the following morning......staying in bed afraid to get out. One of the details that has always stood out to me as being very odd, is both PR and JR relating that they never asked him if he had heard or seen anything. To this day JR has said in interviews that they have never discussed that, they have never asked him those questions. Instead he says that IF BR had heard or seen something he would've said so, apparently that is the reason why they never asked. Huh?? That makes no sense to me. IMO it's more likely that they simply told him, no matter what you heard or saw, you will never, ever talk about it to anyone.

 

[AddieBoo]

According to Mark Becker who was specifically asked about medical records in the AMA he did for Reddit, the Ramseys did sign a release for BR's medical records. The police have never divulged what they contain, which is appropriate given that he was a minor. This probably why so many people seem to think the records were sealed from the police.

The child psychologist did have some concerns about BR and abuse. She did want to do another interview, which was denied. She had hoped to explore the abuse question as well as his lack of emotions, seeming feelings of detachment from his sister and parents, and what she strongly felt was the effects on him of having to live in such a dysfunctional environment.

But she also expressed he did not show any signs of sociopathic behaviors or that he was responsible for what had happened. Det. Patterson who interviewed BR on 12/26 at the home of the Whites also felt that BR was not responsible for what happened to JBR.

I do think however, that he knows more than he has told. Given what we know of the approximated TOD and that he was up, awake and downstairs much later than his parents said, I think it's very likely that he at least heard something. As I have mentioned before, there is evidence that suggests what happened started in JBR's bedroom. If he was back in his bed by that time, I believe it could be the same scenario that he related about the following morning......staying in bed afraid to get out. One of the details that has always stood out to me as being very odd, is both PR and JR relating that they never asked him if he had heard or seen anything. To this day JR has said in interviews that they have never discussed that, they have never asked him those questions. Instead he says that IF BR had heard or seen something he would've said so, apparently that is the reason why they never asked. Huh?? That makes no sense to me. IMO it's more likely that they simply told him, no matter what you heard or saw, you will never, ever talk about it to anyone.

According to Mark Becker who was specifically asked about medical records in the AMA he did for Reddit, the Ramseys did sign a release for BR's medical records. The police have never divulged what they contain, which is appropriate given that he was a minor. This probably why so many people seem to think the records were sealed from the police.

The child psychologist did have some concerns about BR and abuse. She did want to do another interview, which was denied. She had hoped to explore the abuse question as well as his lack of emotions, seeming feelings of detachment from his sister and parents, and what she strongly felt was the effects on him of having to live in such a dysfunctional environment.

But she also expressed he did not show any signs of sociopathic behaviors or that he was responsible for what had happened. Det. Patterson who interviewed BR on 12/26 at the home of the Whites also felt that BR was not responsible for what happened to JBR.

I do think however, that he knows more than he has told. Given what we know of the approximated TOD and that he was up, awake and downstairs much later than his parents said, I think it's very likely that he at least heard something. As I have mentioned before, there is evidence that suggests what happened started in JBR's bedroom. If he was back in his bed by that time, I believe it could be the same scenario that he related about the following morning......staying in bed afraid to get out. One of the details that has always stood out to me as being very odd, is both PR and JR relating that they never asked him if he had heard or seen anything. To this day JR has said in interviews that they have never discussed that, they have never asked him those questions. Instead he says that IF BR had heard or seen something he would've said so, apparently that is the reason why they never asked. Huh?? That makes no sense to me. IMO it's more likely that they simply told him, no matter what you heard or saw, you will never, ever talk about it to anyone.

If BR is not involved in this crime, that puts a whole new question (IMO) about the term “Knowingly” from the True Bills.,,,

 

[CloudedTruth]

If BR is not involved in this crime, that puts a whole new question (IMO) about the term “Knowingly” from the True Bills.,,,

I have always interpreted it to point to both JR and PR, that each aided the other and that they each knew which one of them did what. They each had some guilty knowledge and they covered for each other.

 

[AddieBoo]

I have always interpreted it to point to both JR and PR, that each aided the other and that they each knew which one of them did what. They each had some guilty knowledge and they covered for each other.

Agree..I really don’t know if it could be interpreted any other way, if BR is removed as a consideration. But it is mysterious.That is one hell of a way to live as a family… an environment that lead to her death…

 

[CloudedTruth]

Agree..I really don’t know if it could be interpreted any other way, if BR is removed as a consideration. But it is mysterious.That is one hell of a way to live as a family… an environment that lead to her death…

If there's one thing we have learned about the Ramseys over the years, it's that they were anything but a "normal" family. IMO both JR and PR were fixated on the wrong things in life. Perhaps when the money started rolling in they lost sight of some things. IMO they were both narcissists, especially JR but PR too. I can attest from personal experience that narcissists are twisted people.

 

[Zodiac_Speaking]

I have always interpreted it to point to both JR and PR, that each aided the other and that they each knew which one of them did what. They each had some guilty knowledge and they covered for each other.

Tacking on: I do believe Burke knew more than he let on and hence the word "involved" (at some level of the coverup) is accurate, IMHO.

I go to the "garotte" - it served 3 purposes that night. I believe it was used by an *ADULT/S* in a very advanced sexual something or other.... (I do not believe a 9 yr old boy would be that sexually advanced to even have a notion of such things) (Nor do I believe that a 9 yr old boy came up with that as the final murder weapon of choice) - The "garotte" also served as the murder weapon, and it also served as a very convenient piece of evidence pointing to an intruder...

I think it started off sexual in nature, an accident happened of some sort (Head injury), some time passed.... cooler heads prevailed.... the "marks" from the rope / twine were already present and you can't cover that up, so you gotta finish the job so to speak to be able to explain those marks. You can't magically make those marks go away and so the "garotte" explains all of it.

Since we know math, and we don't believe it was an intruder (grand jury) - and we don't believe (my opinion) that Burke was involved in the actual murder, the math of 3 people goes down to 2 people...JR and PR.

But, IMHO, Burke knew of the "family dynamic" that Linda Arndt spoke of - he was not asleep the "whole time." He knows more. With Ramseys legal advice army, if it was Burke, then they already knew > "Just tell the truth, they can't touch him because of CO law." It would have amounted to a slap on the wrist at worst. Something much more sinister was going on. But what?? That's the question.