GUILTY FL - Cherish Perrywinkle, 8, Jacksonville, 21 June 2013 #3

[floridamomma]

BBM. <Mod Snip>. I've been a foster/adoptive mom for many years, and I've had children in my care that CPS had no business removing from their homes. CPS is often the cause of adults with mental health issues. <Mod Snip>.

RP made some incredibly foolish decisions, but she is not responsible for the death of her daughter. She will, however, have to live with those decisions the rest of her life... reliving the torture her daughter endured. MOO

thank you.

i had them involved in my life for ten months. i was so naive, thought they could help me. protect my kids from my ex... what a nightmare.

 

[momrids6]

I want to say I am not 'defending' the mom here. Mom was not bright. Even after the life I have lived, my preteen daughter is my world and no way would she ever be put into this situation.

Media screws things up all the time. When they did the article on the fire they stated that my youngest died in foster care after she was put there days after her birth. It was NOT days, she was over a year old and they took all of my children. I was a drunk, making bad choices, I sadly chose booze over my children. A choice I regretted every day. After over 23 years, I do not regret it any longer, and i am not proud of it either. It made me what I am today. Today I care about all people. I think most who make bad choices or act stupidly when given a chance can change. Most.... not all.

Anyway my point is that msm does not always quote correctly. They often put false information out there. They also sensationalize things and make something be there that is not.

Both the police report & the dispatch report are online, and available to media. This is not MSM error: it is her voice being transcribed per the 911 call, and her statements given to LE at the scene.

What many keep giving the excuse of "not bright", "vulnerable", or with mental health issues, it is not accurate. Most people with special needs follow the lessons they have learned to the extreme- and most of this population does not have children without family and medical supervision/support. Cherish was not snatched. This perp is darn lucky he did not approach my son with a disability & his siblings- as he would have needed an ambulance.

If she was any of the above, why would the BF/father of the younger two let her take them "every Friday" (his own words) shopping by walking in a bad neighborhood unescorted? Why at WIC appts, well baby checks, etc., was she not referred to the appropriate services if she was so "impaired"?


ETA: this makes me so angry. The disabled, no matter what their disability, know they already have a ball & chain stigma attached to them. They try harder, work harder, and suffer more discrimination that the "average" joe.

How many threads on WS involve a disabled parent abusing, neglecting, or killing their child versus a non- disabled parent?

Oh sure, when the average get caught- the first thing they use as an excuse is an immediate "new" disability- usually mental health. People tend to buy into that- as most people do not abuse, neglect or kill their children- and it is easier to rationalize. This simply further stigmatizes people with true disabilities

 

[Donjeta]

Do we know which services she was or was not referred to?

 

[momrids6]

Do we know which services she was or was not referred to?

If she was referred, and did not take or follow what was recommended, why did she still have custody? So- offered and rejected, or not offered due to lack of impairment- leaves her just as negligent, imo.

Mandated reporters are required to report an unstable parent.

 

[Donjeta]

If she was referred, and did not take or follow what was recommended, why did she still have custody? So- offered and rejected, or not offered due to lack of impairment- leaves her just as negligent, imo.

Mandated reporters are required to report an unstable parent.

That's two alternative scenarios. The third is that the family was referred to something-or-other and received services and yet this happened anyway.

 

[momrids6]

That's two alternative scenarios. The third is that the family was referred to something-or-other and received services and yet this happened anyway.

sure- and that also equates to lack of impairment.

 

[floridamomma]

If she was referred, and did not take or follow what was recommended, why did she still have custody? So- offered and rejected, or not offered due to lack of impairment- leaves her just as negligent, imo.

Mandated reporters are required to report an unstable parent.

but!! don't assume it always happens.

 

[momrids6]

but!! don't assume it always happens.

I would not assume it always happens. I am simply not willing to give this woman an "out". It is called personal responsibility. I am not willing to pass the blame onto anyone else.

Next, it will be Walmart's fault, the customers at Dollar General's fault, or global warming's fault.

 

[Donjeta]

sure- and that also equates to lack of impairment.

I don't see why. Plenty of people with impairments get various services and end up in the news when something bad happens to them regardless. Why on earth would that mean they weren't impaired to begin with? There are also people with impairments who have not been referred to appropriate services or were turned away when they asked for help because of lacking resources or because someone (falsely?) thought these people are not faring badly enough to be a priority or because their particular difficulties are not easily seen in an appointment type situation and the family does not realize the extent of their problems etc. No system is perfect and sometimes people slip through the cracks or cannot be helped quite enough even though they might be willing to receive services.

Unless I've missed something we don't really have much information about which prior problems were detected by which agencies, what they recommended and what was done about those recommendations, if any. Apparently the evaluators in the custody case did see some concerns but haven't read if the court recommended any interventions to improve the situation or if the family complied.

 

[floridamomma]

I would not assume it always happens. I am simply not willing to give this woman an "out". It is called personal responsibility. I am not willing to pass the blame onto anyone else.

Next, it will be Walmart's fault, the customers at Dollar General's fault, or global warming's fault.

totally agree. Blame lies on two people ultimately.

 

[Donjeta]

I would not assume it always happens. I am simply not willing to give this woman an "out". It is called personal responsibility. I am not willing to pass the blame onto anyone else.

Next, it will be Walmart's fault, the customers at Dollar General's fault, or global warming's fault.

I am not suggesting we should blame Walmart or Dollar General or that we should deny personal responsibility, I am simply saying that I don't think we should assume that the family irresponsibly refused services which they needed and which were offered to them because we don't have information that this is the case. Nor should we take it for granted that there was no impairment because no services were offered, because a) we have no information that says no services were offered and b) even if no services were offered there could still be impairment. In a perfect world everybody would get all the services they need but this isn't one.

Services or no services, impairment or no impairment, there is still personal responsibility. Those people who are so severely impaired that they are not responsible for their actions probably should not have custody of small children.

 

[vasportsmom]

totally agree. Blame lies on two people ultimately.

Seconding (third?) this. Two people are responsible for the death of this child and one of those should have been the person that Cherish could always count on to protect her.

This case and little Elaina's has got the best of me. I'm sick of letting women off easy just because they were able to birth a child. Girls not yet in their teens are giving birth these days and a lot of them are probably better mothers than RP.

 

[mrsward]

Seconding (third?) this. Two people are responsible for the death of this child and one of those should have been the person that Cherish could always count on to protect her.

This case and little Elaina's has got the best of me. I'm sick of letting women off easy just because they were able to birth a child. Girls not yet in their teens are giving birth these days and a lot of them are probably better mothers than RP.

Amen to that !

 

[momrids6]

Services or no services, impairment or no impairment, there is still personal responsibility. Those people who are so severely impaired that they are not responsible for their actions probably should not have custody of small children.

RSBM: Exactly- this ^^. Thanks for stating it more clearly than I was able to.

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

Both the police report & the dispatch report are online, and available to media. This is not MSM error: it is her voice being transcribed per the 911 call, and her statements given to LE at the scene.

What many keep giving the excuse of "not bright", "vulnerable", or with mental health issues, it is not accurate. Most people with special needs follow the lessons they have learned to the extreme- and most of this population does not have children without family and medical supervision/support. Cherish was not snatched. This perp is darn lucky he did not approach my son with a disability & his siblings- as he would have needed an ambulance.

If she was any of the above, why would the BF/father of the younger two let her take them "every Friday" (his own words) shopping by walking in a bad neighborhood unescorted? Why at WIC appts, well baby checks, etc., was she not referred to the appropriate services if she was so "impaired"?


ETA: this makes me so angry. The disabled, no matter what their disability, know they already have a ball & chain stigma attached to them. They try harder, work harder, and suffer more discrimination that the "average" joe.

How many threads on WS involve a disabled parent abusing, neglecting, or killing their child versus a non- disabled parent?

Oh sure, when the average get caught- the first thing they use as an excuse is an immediate "new" disability- usually mental health. People tend to buy into that- as most people do not abuse, neglect or kill their children- and it is easier to rationalize. This simply further stigmatizes people with true disabilities

Thank you.

(I have a mental illness and although it is often the reason I do things, it isn't an excuse. Sometimes it makes it very challenging for me and when people are supportive and understanding I def appreciate that - but it doesn't make it ok for me to behave badly or treat people poorly. I know I don't have the most severe illness so I try to be mindful of that, but still I think you're so right.)

I want to remove the stigma associated with mental illness or disabilities, so that people who suffer feel free to be open about their suffering and to ask for whatever help they need. I think that we (in general) should not shy away from understanding that certain conditions can warp your sense of reality or whatever or drive you to do terrible things - IF that is true in a particular case. But if it isn't, spreading misinformation and fear hurts us all. Jmo.

 

[MsFacetious]

I want to say I am not 'defending' the mom here. Mom was not bright. Even after the life I have lived, my preteen daughter is my world and no way would she ever be put into this situation.

Media screws things up all the time. When they did the article on the fire they stated that my youngest died in foster care after she was put there days after her birth. It was NOT days, she was over a year old and they took all of my children. I was a drunk, making bad choices, I sadly chose booze over my children. A choice I regretted every day. After over 23 years, I do not regret it any longer, and i am not proud of it either. It made me what I am today. Today I care about all people. I think most who make bad choices or act stupidly when given a chance can change. Most.... not all.

Anyway my point is that msm does not always quote correctly. They often put false information out there. They also sensationalize things and make something be there that is not.

I am glad that someone feels this way about people who make mistakes.
My Aunt royally screwed up her life for many, many years. Drugs got involved and it went downhill.
She recently died... in a room not fit for people to live in... possibly of a drug overdose.

Today I stood in the room she died in and could not believe that this is where her life ended.
I remember her before the drugs and it is incomprehensible to me that she ended up where she did.
She did run into a few people who had compassion like you do... but unfortunately most did not.

She was finally turning her life around... she was sober a week before her death.
If we had more compassion in the world maybe people would correct their mistakes more. :twocents:

I have also seen the way media sensationalizes a story... and agree on that as well.
With all that said... my Aunt never endangered any children. I feel that Cherish was failed by her mother.
However, there are two other children who need protecting now.

 

[1&2&3]

To Neenna66 - from the sounds of your written words, you have picked yourself up, gotten rid of the demons, raised yourself far above the place you were, and you are willing and ready to help that fellow citizen who is in the dark pit you once faced. Bless you dear heart, it has been a long long climb out of that barrel, but you have achieved that glory that was so evasive!! And now, you are ready to reach out to help and share with others! God has a special place for you!! I personally say Congratulations for your strength and will power and Thank You for wanting to help others. :seeya::rockon:

 

[1&2&3]

I have another thought about RP that I don't know if it has been brought up.
Is there any chance that RP thought the attention she was getting from DS was for HER and she didn't even give a thought that the attention was toward Cherish? Not knowing he was a RSO, would it even enter her mind?

 

[jjenny]

I have another thought about RP that I don't know if it has been brought up.
Is there any chance that RP thought the attention she was getting from DS was for HER and she didn't even give a thought that the attention was toward Cherish? Not knowing he was a RSO, would it even enter her mind?

Based on the police dispatch, she realized DS was paying too much attention to Cherish.

 

[Donjeta]

I have another thought about RP that I don't know if it has been brought up.
Is there any chance that RP thought the attention she was getting from DS was for HER and she didn't even give a thought that the attention was toward Cherish? Not knowing he was a RSO, would it even enter her mind?

Who knows but she told the dispatcher that he was paying too much attention to Cherish .

Read more at Jacksonville.com: http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/...kle-abductiondeath-key-evidence#ixzz2YWP9Jywr