FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #21

[Thor]

No, no MUCH easier than that. All DA has to do is prove Dale was last to see her alive and that there is no sign that she is still alive. Check out the 90%+ conviction rate of murder trials where there was no body found. Over 300 cases and they USUALLY get their guy/gal...Here they will get Dale! JMO

To further my previous point on this issue, I don't think that convincing a jury that Michelle has been murdered with or without a body is a problem for the prosecution (assuming trial). I think most reasonable people would arrive to that unfortunate conclusion. I think the real problem for the DA's office is to prove that Dale did it (or for that matter someone else), especially if a body is not available that can possibly shed a light on time of death, cause of death, method of death and so on and when there might not be compelling forensic and/or circumstantial evidence to point to DS' guilty. Please note I said might not be, since we know of no such evidence and by the fact that they have brought no charges against Dale 6 months into the investigation (even longer by now). IMO

 

[Thor]

Yes you are correct! It has been over 6 months and there haven't been any witnesses to come forth to state Michelle was seen ANY time after arriving at Dale's...so that WOULD make Dale the LAST person to see her. Pretty clear cut...

There is a substantial difference with being the last known person to have seen a victim, and being the only possible person to have seen a victim . The first is easily verifiable here the second needs stuff like evidence. As per no eyewitness to have seen her after she got to DS' condo that means .... oh ... they did not see MP after she left the condo? They did not see MP drive away, they did not see MP getting in the car, they did not see Dale killing MP, they did not see Dale put a body in the car, they did not see any DS' accomplices helping him hiding evidence of a crime, ... so what did they see? ... could it be nothing and that is why we have no eyewitness? IMO

 

[What'sThatClue]

There is a substantial difference with being the last known person to have seen a victim, and being the only possible person to have seen a victim . The first is easily verifiable the latter needs stuff like evidence. As per no eyewitness to have seen her after she got to DS' condo that means .... oh ... they did not see MP after she left the condo? They did not see MP drive away, they did not see MP getting in the car, they did not see Dale killing MP, they did not see Dale put a body in the car, they did not any DS' accomplices helping him hiding evidence of a crime, ... so what did they see? ... could it be nothing and that is why we have no eyewitness? IMO

We don't know for sure that there were no eyewitnesses. If there were, they were not reported/released by LE. JMO

Hard to see something happen to Michelle if she was in the house or garage, if the car was in the garage, etc. JMO.

 

[Thor]

We don't know for sure that there were no eyewitnesses. If there were, they were not reported/released by LE. JMO

Hard to see something happen to Michelle if she was in the house or garage, if the car was in the garage, etc. JMO.

Yes you're right, we don't know that there are any witnesses, my point was only about the relevance of not knowing about any witnesses in the context of this post:

Jazzmaster - (quote)
"Yes you are correct! It has been over 6 months and there haven't been any witnesses to come forth to state Michelle was seen ANY time after arriving at Dale's...so that WOULD make Dale the LAST person to see her. Pretty clear cut... " (end quote) I put on bold the part I was referring to.

 

[Kamille]

There is a substantial difference with being the last known person to have seen a victim, and being the only possible person to have seen a victim . The first is easily verifiable here the second needs stuff like evidence. As per no eyewitness to have seen her after she got to DS' condo that means .... oh ... they did not see MP after she left the condo? They did not see MP drive away, they did not see MP getting in the car, they did not see Dale killing MP, they did not see Dale put a body in the car, they did not see any DS' accomplices helping him hiding evidence of a crime, ... so what did they see? ... could it be nothing and that is why we have no eyewitness? IMO

No one saw her drive away in the Hummer with the decals intact and no one saw her on any of the roads that her phone travelled on either. If there was one witness or video surveillance camera that saw or caught her alone in that Hummer away from the condo after 3:18pm, DSJr would not be a prime suspect...period.

So are we to believe that because no one saw anything at the condo that nothing happened? So if you want to commit a crime, just make sure you're not on video or that the nosy neighbours are not watching and you're home free?

There could be a murder happening right now across the street from me. I am not outside or at a window. How would I see it? :waitasec:

MOO

 

[katydid23]

Then wouldn't the hummer remain parked for as long period a time as Dale leaves and comes back later?

Is there any eyewitness recollection of the Hummer being parked of Dale's condo for that duration something one needs to further that theory? Is not that an Hummer is not easily noticeable especially MP's Hummer, with the decals and all. IMO

He had a garage that closed up tight. He could have very easily moved it inside his garage,and taken off the decals, then driven out after dark.

 

[Thor]

No one saw her drive away in the Hummer with the decals intact and no one saw her on any of the roads that her phone travelled on either. If there was one witness or video surveillance camera that saw or caught her alone in that Hummer away from the condo after 3:18pm, DSJr would not be a prime suspect...period.

So are we to believe that because no one saw anything at the condo that nothing happened? So if you want to commit a crime, just make sure you're not on video or that the nosy neighbours are not watching and you're home free?

There could be a murder happening right now across the street from me. I am not outside or at a window. How would I see it? :waitasec:

MOO

Not at all, my point is the opposite, if no one saw anything happening that is not proof that something happened. If no one saw MP leave that is no proof that she didn't leave. If no one saw DS kill MP that is no proof he did not kill her and so on. Not knowing does not equal knowing.

I simply replied to a post that asserted that because there are no witnesses (not my assumption) that Michelle left the condo then this means that Dale would be the last person to have seen her.

That is all

 

[Kamille]

Not at all, my point is the opposite, if no one saw anything happening that is not proof that something happened. If no one saw MP leave that is no proof that she didn't leave. If no one saw DS kill MP that is no proof he did not kill her and so on. Not knowing does not equal knowing.

I simply replied to a post that asserted that because there are no witnesses (not my assumption) that Michelle left the condo then this means that Dale would be the last person to have seen her.

That is all

Sorry but I'm not following here. So are you admitting that because no one saw her away from the condo after 3:18pm that DSJr, by his own admittance, was the last known person to see her?

 

[Thor]

Sorry but I'm not following here. So are you admitting that because no one saw her away from the condo after 3:18pm that DSJr, by his own admittance, was the last known person to see her?

I am not following you sorry, may be you should go back a few posts above and start from the beginning, (post #662) it might make more sense to you. I am sorry, I don't mean to be impolite in not answering your question really.

 

[Gia]

I haven't read much this week. But from the last page or two, IMO it seems as though some strongly believe that DS was the last person who saw MP. And being that there aren't any witnesses who have come forward saying they DID see MP after the time she dropped off the twins, it means she never left the condo alive. And DS HAS to be responsible for her disappearance.

Then some are saying that just because no one came forward to say they saw MP after she dropped off the twins, it does not prove that she never left, or that DS was the last to see her. It simply means no one saw her leave. Which in turn would mean that DS does not HAVE to be the one responsible for her disappearance.

That's the gist of what I got from the last few posts. Though I could be just as confused as others. :waitasec:

 

[telemag]

I haven't read much this week. But from the last page or two, IMO it seems as though some strongly believe that DS was the last person who saw MP. And being that there aren't any witnesses who have come forward saying they DID see MP after the time she dropped off the twins, it means she never left the condo alive. And DS HAS to be responsible for her disappearance.

Then some are saying that just because no one came forward to say they saw MP after she dropped off the twins, it does not prove that she never left, or that DS was the last to see her. It simply means no one saw her leave. Which in turn would mean that DS does not HAVE to be the one responsible for her disappearance.

That's the gist of what I got from the last few posts. Though I could be just as confused as others. :waitasec:

I think you got it. The last person that was KNOWN to see Michelle alive was Dale. Dale said that Michelle let his place alive. He is either lying or telling the truth. It's pretty simple really.

 

[Jazzmaster]

No, you right, just because someone has not been charged with a crime does not mean one will never be charged for a crime nor that he will be charged with one. I don't get the "little bit pregnant" analogy here though, There is in fact no statue of imitation for murder.

I just pointed that out to say that may be the police had looked into that theory and found no evidence to support it, that's all.

RE: Little bit pregnant

Dale is guilty IMO and he can't be a little bit guilty. He either is or he isn't. I believe he is! It's kind of like a pregnancy...you either are or you aren't...It's an expression we use here in America. Now I bet Dale wishes he could go back in time and change some of what took place...Kind of like Boris the Animal.

 

[Jazzmaster]

I haven't read much this week. But from the last page or two, IMO it seems as though some strongly believe that DS was the last person who saw MP. And being that there aren't any witnesses who have come forward saying they DID see MP after the time she dropped off the twins, it means she never left the condo alive. And DS HAS to be responsible for her disappearance.

Then some are saying that just because no one came forward to say they saw MP after she dropped off the twins, it does not prove that she never left, or that DS was the last to see her. It simply means no one saw her leave. Which in turn would mean that DS does not HAVE to be the one responsible for her disappearance.

That's the gist of what I got from the last few posts. Though I could be just as confused as others. :waitasec:

No...you have it correct. Great summary! IMO Dale made Michelle disappear after she arrived and because he either immobilized or killed her no one saw her in person or received a text or phone call from her again, her bank accounts have had no activity, and her vehicle was never spotted again with the GLOW decals after she arrived at Dale's...all of these point back to Dale. JMO

 

[Thor]

I think you got it. The last person that was KNOWN to see Michelle alive was Dale. Dale said that Michelle let his place alive. He is either lying or telling the truth. It's pretty simple really.

Alive and by her own volition I would add.

 

[Thor]

No...you have it correct. Great summary! IMO Dale made Michelle disappear after she arrived and because he either immobilized or killed her no one saw her in person or received a text or phone call from her again, her bank accounts have had no activity, and her vehicle was never spotted again with the GLOW decals after she arrived at Dale's...all of these point back to Dale. JMO

Then why the police has not arrested DS and charged him?

 

[Jazzmaster]

You right, mine was only to illustrate a point where guilt would be irrefutable.

Yours was an example where guilt is in question and a jury believes the prosecution's contention that "because of this then that".

I don't know here that the police can place Dale as the only person to have seen Michelle alive if six months of investigation and no charges are of any indication.

We have no indication of what stage LE are at in terms of probable cause for an arrest. I believe that Dale will be arrested soon enough. Do you think he'd put up a fight like the Showdown on Coruscant with Palpatine? Or will he fight his battles in the court room? I know Dale has spent a lot of time in court. Does he usually win? Wonder what his record is wins versus losses looks like.

 

[Jazzmaster]

Then why the police has not arrested DS and charged him?

Like a fine wine you cannot rush the process my dear friend...Patience, patience...Grab some popcorn...the show will begin soon enough. JMO

 

[Jazzmaster]

To further my previous point on this issue, I don't think that convincing a jury that Michelle has been murdered with or without a body is a problem for the prosecution (assuming trial). I think most reasonable people would arrive to that unfortunate conclusion. I think the real problem for the DA's office is to prove that Dale did it (or for that matter someone else), especially if a body is not available that can possibly shed a light on time of death, cause of death, method of death and so on and when there might not be compelling forensic and/or circumstantial evidence to point to DS' guilty. Please note I said might not be, since we know of no such evidence and by the fact that they have brought no charges against Dale 6 months into the investigation (even longer by now). IMO

IMO it will be easy to prove Dale was involved in her disappearance. Without seeing all the evidence we do NOT know what's behind door #2...With what we do know...I still believe the DA's office has enough for a conviction. Based on cell pings, Michelle's phone activities, Jr's activities on the days in question, FB activity with him and friends, and a host of other IMO admissible evidence...I believe the DA could get twelve peers to collectively form a guilty verdict.

The odds right now are probably not high enough that any DA that's in his or her right mind would feel confident to secure said conviction... That being said the burden of proof could be met IMO at this moment but why rush the process? If Dale is being tailed and kept in check by private and public eyes, he poses little immediate danger to the public. Why not sit back continue collecting evidence UNTIL you feel 99% sure you'll get said conviction? JMO

 

[Gia]

I partially see your point...Not withstanding there have been MANY attempts to look at others and take our eyes off Dale...which as I have stated I believe would be without substance as those possibilities could go ANYWHERE and would involve WILD speculation. We have no facts or evidence to lead us in THAT direction so we could go off on a wild goose chase. I have chased far too many geese in my day. Instead...I choose to focus on the facts and circumstances that will lead us closer to the TRUTH.

It is like a magician as they try to distract you while they perform their little magic trickery. But if you focus on what they are really doing...you will see the magic is just an illusion. If we focus on someone other than Dale as I have already mentioned I believe it is a distraction and an injustice to the victim here...Michelle. She deserves better and IMHO to find the truth one needs to look no further than Dale. As an outsider who doesn't know ANY of the players in this case either...I just bring in my unbiased opinions and links when I find something of substance...

BBM

I was one who came into this thinking DS was innocent, in the very beginning. I kept trying to think of different scenarios, as to who or why or what. But everything always pointed right back to DS (in MY eyes).

True, it's always best to try and stick with the facts. But like some already mentioned, we have little facts to go on. So some degree of speculation will always be present. Even if we try to think of other possibilties/suspects, we have even LESS to go on, and would have to fill in the blanks with our opinions even more.

And I'm quite sure that LE did look at other avenues, and I would hope that they are still doing so. But again, if the trail keeps leading back to one person, that's not something that can be overlooked.

We have no idea what evidence LE has or doesn't have. They obviously want DS convicted if this goes to trial. So I think it's for the best that they keep trying to build their case to better the chances of a conviction. Like someone said before, they only get one shot. They better make it count. Six months is a long time, but it doesn't necessarily mean LE has nothing on DS.

ETA~ Jazz, I saw your above reply after I posted.

 

[southern_comfort]

IMO it will be easy to prove Dale was involved in her disappearance. Without seeing all the evidence we do NOT know what's behind door #2...With what we do know...I still believe the DA's office has enough for a conviction. Based on cell pings, Michelle's phone activities, Jr's activities on the days in question, FB activity with him and friends, and a host of other IMO admissible evidence...I believe the DA could get twelve peers to collectively form a guilty verdict.

The odds right now are probably not high enough that any DA that's in his or her right mind would feel confident to secure said conviction... That being said the burden of proof could be met IMO at this moment but why rush the process? If Dale is being tailed and kept in check by private and public eyes, he poses little immediate danger to the public. Why not sit back continue collecting evidence UNTIL you feel 99% sure you'll get said conviction? JMO

I wish they were that close, for the sake of Michelle and her family and friends, but I believe the truth lies closer to what Detective Michael Bailey from the Pinellas County Sheriff's Office said less than 2 weeks ago, when he said they have very limited evidence.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_...-in-missing-fla-mom-investigation-police-say/