GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #10

[2Hope4]

I think the one thing that really sticks out in the crime scene to me.....

The garage was where it's assumed Mr. D was murdered and beheaded. Likewise there wasn't a crime scene inside the home. WHY? What was the reasoning? Why would a killer care if there was blood or 'a mess' INSIDE that beautiful home? They weren't going to gain whether the house was ransacked, walls busted in, windows broken, blood everywhere, etc. So why weren't they murdered in their bed? Murdered before they woke up for the day, or after the went to bed that night? WHY during daylight? There's clues in that crime scene. Things like the importance of the house being kept sacred.... was it so it would still sell? Afterall, the garage could be demolished and rebuilt.

Was the killer concerned about who might live there after the murders? Was the killer intention to murder in the garage? Why wasn't either vehicle stolen as the get away? Why wasn't anything known to have been stolen?


The sole purpose of the killer being at the D's home was to murder them. WHY?

 

[wildebeest]

Someone mentioned something above that made me think......I don't think we have seen the estate or the will yet. Are those public after a year? Some people DO have separate wills from their spouse. I know my parents did, and they are no where near as rich as the Dermonds were. However, if either spouse had a kid before the current marriage, that could play a factor in wills. Likewise if a parent is mad at a child, they could write them out of the will, or give them less than the other siblings.

Wonder if anything like that happened here? Or was the estate left to the grandkids and not the kids? Any left to charities? Church? Maybe money truly is the way to solving this.

But how would we go further with that thought unless we can see the will, or trust or whatever it's called?

**Hoping this makes sense. My Dad died the last part of June. My thinking still isn't clear! Had he been murdered....dear Lord I don't know how I would breath. I know I would at some point be screaming for someone to be held accountable, but honestly, knowing he was dying, I still haven't been able to 'live' more than just existing....**

Yes, 2Hope4, I think you have a great thought. "Follow the Money" is always a good idea. As human beings, we are quite predictable.

IMHO

 

[wildebeest]

I think the one thing that really sticks out in the crime scene to me.....

The garage was where it's assumed Mr. D was murdered and beheaded. Likewise there wasn't a crime scene inside the home. WHY? What was the reasoning? Why would a killer care if there was blood or 'a mess' INSIDE that beautiful home? They weren't going to gain whether the house was ransacked, walls busted in, windows broken, blood everywhere, etc. So why weren't they murdered in their bed? Murdered before they woke up for the day, or after the went to bed that night? WHY during daylight? There's clues in that crime scene. Things like the importance of the house being kept sacred.... was it so it would still sell? Afterall, the garage could be demolished and rebuilt.

Was the killer concerned about who might live there after the murders? Was the killer intention to murder in the garage? Why wasn't either vehicle stolen as the get away? Why wasn't anything known to have been stolen?


The sole purpose of the killer being at the D's home was to murder them. WHY?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Razz]

Interesting theory. So along that line, was Mrs D not killed until after the 5 mile ride in the boat? And if so, why not just drown her since she was weighted down? Why the 'blunt force trauma'? JMO, but I would think since she was weighted, drowning would have been easier for the perp, and less chance for Mrs D to scream or do anything to alert others that she was being killed.

I'm assuming not all victims scream or make any loud noises or think to do anything to escape. I've thankfully never been in a real situation to know how I would react. The closest I've come is walking up on a snake, and realizing I was in striking distance and I froze. I couldn't physically move, and I couldn't speak. It was terrifying.

I really get the feeling that torture or terrorizing the Dermonds was not what this was about and "care" was taken to make sure that neither suffered
unnecessarily before they were "murdered" in such a heinous way. (meaning, they were killed by a quick blow to the head, first).

So.....If it was to get rid of the Dermonds to make way for selling their house and collecting their assets, I just don't feel beheading Mr. D. in the garage is the way to go about it. I don't see anyone close to the D's requesting a beheading...even if lots of money was involved. I'm not buying a house where an unsolved beheading took place, even if it was in the garage. No way, no how. And because of the beheading, getting half what the house is worth would be a miracle. And then splitting $ among 3 siblings just isn't a lot in their world.

If there were other assets that could be garnered from their deaths.........maybe. But I just don't see it.

Yes, follow the $$, but not the $$$ from the selling of all the assets.









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[Foxfire]

Quote Originally Posted by 2Hope4 View Post
I think the one thing that really sticks out in the crime scene to me.....

The garage was where it's assumed Mr. D was murdered and beheaded. Likewise there wasn't a crime scene inside the home. WHY? What was the reasoning? Why would a killer care if there was blood or 'a mess' INSIDE that beautiful home? They weren't going to gain whether the house was ransacked, walls busted in, windows broken, blood everywhere, etc. So why weren't they murdered in their bed? Murdered before they woke up for the day, or after the went to bed that night? WHY during daylight? There's clues in that crime scene. Things like the importance of the house being kept sacred.... was it so it would still sell? After all, the garage could be demolished and rebuilt.

Was the killer concerned about who might live there after the murders? Was the killer intention to murder in the garage? Why wasn't either vehicle stolen as the get away? Why wasn't anything known to have been stolen?


The sole purpose of the killer being at the D's home was to murder them. WHY?

<BBM for Focus>

2Hope4, the perps in the Dermond murders and abduction terrorized and tortured them simply by the act itself..
The likely predetermined isolation of the crime scene to the garage by the perps was intentional and indicates that they were forensically aware. With the use of a disposable tarp, dna and other forensics could be easily cleaned up and destroyed to hamper the investigation if contained in this manageable area, imo.
The Kentucky Derby parties were likely factored in, as to why they carried out the Dermonds in broad daylight, imo. Reynolds Plantation/Great Waters Security would have been overwhelmed due to the enormous traffic and visitors that day..

The Dermond's vehicles could have been easily traced, nothing known was stolen, large or small. This was a well planned and executed crime of the most heinous nature with the intent of sending a message of retribution, imo..

 

[Deleted member 162919]

Well over 2 years since this horrible murder and the police have no leads but according to the Sheriff he has dna, hair ,fibers and other evidence yet he can't figure out who did this. my theory is because he is either lying about the evidence he has or the dna is a match for someone in the family and could easily get tossed in court because they have been in the house many times before. Yes he says the family is not suspected but I don't believe him.

There has been no update in months and even the last update was the same as the other updates. I'm convinced he knows who did this he just can't get a conviction.

 

[Foxfire]

Well over 2 years since this horrible murder and the police have no leads but according to the Sheriff he has dna, hair ,fibers and other evidence yet he can't figure out who did this. my theory is because he is either lying about the evidence he has or the dna is a match for someone in the family and could easily get tossed in court because they have been in the house many times before. Yes he says the family is not suspected but I don't believe him.

There has been no update in months and even the last update was the same as the other updates. I'm convinced he knows who did this he just can't get a conviction.

Or if Sheriff Sills does have dna evidence related to the crime, the person/perp's dna identifier may simply not be in the CODIS database. The shoe print impression evidence, provided that it was found in the vicinity of the person witnessed on the Dermond's property, is likely very significant in the investigation, imo.

I believe Sheriff Sills may know who is responsible for the well planned and executed Dermond murders, but has not solved it due to squandering valuable investigative resources.. jmo

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I think this points to either a family member or a close friend think about it. dna from a family member depending on where they found it could be hard to use since they probably visit there often or are related. Personally I don't think Sills has any evidence and his lack of going public with any information shows he has nothing and will not solve it unless someone comes forward and admits to it or rats someone out. ts wasn't a random murder since they knew well enough to take a boat and where to dump Shirley. Too much knowledge of the victims and the area = someone familiar with the area

 

[Foxfire]

Imo, this case will eventually be solved due to information from a confidential informant/probable inmate willing to do some bargaining to escape the wrath of a much more severe sentence.. I disagree with Sheriff Sills when he states, "Uh, I don&#8217;t know any professional decapitators.&#8221;

___________________

Relentless: Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills chases a killer

In Putnam County, everybody knows Howard Sills, and Howard Sills knows everybody&#8212;except who brutally murdered an elderly couple on Lake Oconee last May 2014. After four decades of always getting his man, has the sheriff met his match?
[ - - - ]
Sills was struck by the pristine condition of the house. A horror scene it was not. Aside from the headless body in the garage, and save for an unmade bed and an off-kilter lampshade in the living room, it was showroom-perfect. The lampshade caught Sills&#8217;s eye only because everything else was so neat. What blood there was&#8212;a considerable amount&#8212;had pooled and dried near the body.

The best Sills could remember, there hadn&#8217;t been a double homicide in Putnam County since May 1984, 30 years earlier. It involved the rape and murder of an elementary and high school classmate of Sills&#8217;s. The killer, serving life, also shot and stabbed to death the woman&#8217;s 5-year-old daughter.

In minutes, the mood inside the lake house swung from wild intensity to who the hell did this?

This, the sheriff told himself, ain&#8217;t local talent.
[- - - ]
More than one killer?

Possibly, Sills said, but impossible to be sure. All avenues were being explored.

As the back-and-forth wound down, a reporter asked, &#8220;With the amount of evidence that you&#8217;ve collected so far, would you consider this a professional job?&#8221;

&#8220;A professional what job?&#8221; Sills said.

&#8220;There doesn&#8217;t appear to be a lot of evidence for it to be an amateur,&#8221; the reporter said.

&#8220;Is it a professional robbery?&#8221; Sills said. &#8220;Nothing seems to be gone. Is it a professional burglary? Nothing seems to be gone . . . Uh, I don&#8217;t know any professional decapitators.&#8221;

<snipped from: http://www.atlantamagazine.com/grea...-county-sheriff-howard-sills-chases-a-killer/

 

[Foxfire]

http://www.atlantamagazine.com/grea...-county-sheriff-howard-sills-chases-a-killer/
[---]
<snipped from:

Relentless: Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills chases a killer
Sills may best be known for his dealings with the United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors in the 1990s and early 2000s. Or more precisely the cult&#8217;s charismatic leader, Dwight York, a Brooklyn hustler whose thousands-strong flock streamed into the county. They built plywood pyramids northwest of Eatonton. Amid ever-shifting tenets, they mostly worshipped York, who one year claimed to be an alien from another planet, then a Native American chieftain, and later a reincarnated pharaoh. Meanwhile, he mounted failed bids to commandeer the local government by steering zealots onto voter rolls.

Sills and a small contingent of federal investigators heard of rampant child molestation at York&#8217;s compound. Their case would become the largest prosecution of its kind in Georgia history&#8212;209 counts in all, with 13 victims named in the indictment, though there were more, Sills says. In 2004, York was sentenced to 135 years in prison on federal charges that included racketeering and sexual exploitation.
_________________________

Ironically the PCSO lead investigator on the Dermond murder investigation came over from the Gwinett County Sheriffs Department.. The defendants in the following Gwinett County murder case are awaiting trial. LE via MSM has been completely silent for 22 months on this investigation..

_________________________

Woman who was held captive by a cult member and starved until she weighed just 59 pounds graduates from high school 18 months after her rescue

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...gh-school-18-months-rescue.html#ixzz4KH5Hk3or
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
________________________________


Websleuths thread - GA - Alcenti McIntosh, 15 mos, starvation death reveals family horror, 11 Nov 2014
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ly-horror-11-Nov-2014&p=12805366#post12805366

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

After Mr Russel Dermond was brutally murdered and beheaded, Mrs Shirley Dermond was likely taken as a hostage in case of routine boat inspection by DNR or a 911 call made by a neighbor, imo. When the possible suspect was witnessed in the Dermond's yard, it would be reasonable to conclude that he/she was aware that they had been witnessed. When they safely reached their destination five miles up the lake without law enforcement involvement. She would have been no further use to them and that's likely why she was disposed of in the lake near the boat launch. jmo

You know these crimes aren't ususally that complicated I guess, the rule of KISS applies here, this would be the answer

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Someone mentioned something above that made me think......I don't think we have seen the estate or the will yet. Are those public after a year? Some people DO have separate wills from their spouse. I know my parents did, and they are no where near as rich as the Dermonds were. However, if either spouse had a kid before the current marriage, that could play a factor in wills. Likewise if a parent is mad at a child, they could write them out of the will, or give them less than the other siblings.

Wonder if anything like that happened here? Or was the estate left to the grandkids and not the kids? Any left to charities? Church? Maybe money truly is the way to solving this.

But how would we go further with that thought unless we can see the will, or trust or whatever it's called?

**Hoping this makes sense. My Dad died the last part of June. My thinking still isn't clear! Had he been murdered....dear Lord I don't know how I would breath. I know I would at some point be screaming for someone to be held accountable, but honestly, knowing he was dying, I still haven't been able to 'live' more than just existing....**

I know the D's house sold, assuming the funds went to the family but I guess we know about ASSUME ing things haha but who would sell it if not settled estate, of course it could have been handled by a trustee outside of the family or soemthing I guess

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I think the one thing that really sticks out in the crime scene to me.....

The garage was where it's assumed Mr. D was murdered and beheaded. Likewise there wasn't a crime scene inside the home. WHY? What was the reasoning? Why would a killer care if there was blood or 'a mess' INSIDE that beautiful home? They weren't going to gain whether the house was ransacked, walls busted in, windows broken, blood everywhere, etc. So why weren't they murdered in their bed? Murdered before they woke up for the day, or after the went to bed that night? WHY during daylight? There's clues in that crime scene. Things like the importance of the house being kept sacred.... was it so it would still sell? Afterall, the garage could be demolished and rebuilt.

Was the killer concerned about who might live there after the murders? Was the killer intention to murder in the garage? Why wasn't either vehicle stolen as the get away? Why wasn't anything known to have been stolen?


The sole purpose of the killer being at the D's home was to murder them. WHY?

exactly, 2 scenarios come to mind, both would be to follow the money

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

so that's real simple then, who would get their $$$$$$ if they were dead, trying to make too much out of it, this thing gets confusing..............it is real simple Im sure, and the killers or the ones who hired the hit are still right there possibly.............the reason nothing was stolen is becuase after they were dead, SOMEONE would get it all............the briber and/or the family

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I really get the feeling that torture or terrorizing the Dermonds was not what this was about and "care" was taken to make sure that neither suffered
unnecessarily before they were "murdered" in such a heinous way. (meaning, they were killed by a quick blow to the head, first).

So.....If it was to get rid of the Dermonds to make way for selling their house and collecting their assets, I just don't feel beheading Mr. D. in the garage is the way to go about it. I don't see anyone close to the D's requesting a beheading...even if lots of money was involved. I'm not buying a house where an unsolved beheading took place, even if it was in the garage. No way, no how. And because of the beheading, getting half what the house is worth would be a miracle. And then splitting $ among 3 siblings just isn't a lot in their world.

If there were other assets that could be garnered from their deaths.........maybe. But I just don't see it.

Yes, follow the $$, but not the $$$ from the selling of all the assets.









Sent from my SM-G386T using Tapatalk

well............ ok, BUT WHAT is the most confounding and confusing about this case? really if we eliminate that part, the beheading, what would it appear happened here?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Well over 2 years since this horrible murder and the police have no leads but according to the Sheriff he has dna, hair ,fibers and other evidence yet he can't figure out who did this. my theory is because he is either lying about the evidence he has or the dna is a match for someone in the family and could easily get tossed in court because they have been in the house many times before. Yes he says the family is not suspected but I don't believe him.

There has been no update in months and even the last update was the same as the other updates. I'm convinced he knows who did this he just can't get a conviction.

he's probalby lying or withholding something in this case............but bottom line, it's not solved and there is no evidence to follow, didnt he offer reward in hopes someone that knew something would come forward, somebody has already gained in this thing, kind of like last night, some fool stole my antique coins, they're gone, no finding them, all gained by the perp..........over and out , mission accomplished.....yes I think he jsut needs to prove it but has nothing to prove it, didnt he question family time and again? Surely must suspected something there and of course, he cant slander folks and say he suspects family or anyone else

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Or if Sheriff Sills does have dna evidence related to the crime, the person/perp's dna identifier may simply not be in the CODIS database. The shoe print impression evidence, provided that it was found in the vicinity of the person witnessed on the Dermond's property, is likely very significant in the investigation, imo.

I believe Sheriff Sills may know who is responsible for the well planned and executed Dermond murders, but has not solved it due to squandering valuable investigative resources.. jmo

even if he were able to ask for prints of suspicious folks, which I dont know that he can, but the kids were there all the time, there prints will be there anyway....................this is all getting clearer and clearer..............................some say no one would ask for your parent to be beheaded, but you say they would ONLY ask for them to be murdered?? whats the difference there??? Compassion?? being facetious of course, if you aren't a muderer and if you dont have a debt that might get you killed or whatever the cirumstances might be, and if you arent a murderer, then we cannot fathom any of it..............therefore cannot say what someone else that is a killer will or will not do, .......................

 

[watcher9]

We really don't know for sure if he was killed in the garage. I seem to remember that they said his body had been moved. We never found out how far or if there was a blood trail, only that he ended up being between the two vehicles in the garage with his head gone. I can't remember now if they saw any blood splattered up on the cars.

Why was that perp out in the yard? Maybe he was rinsing the blood off his hands and weapon before starting on MrsD? Could he have been dragging either MrD or MrsD into the garage? If the perp knew that he had been seen, he may have panicked. He grabbed her and took off without making it into the house to complete the theft of whatever he was after. The "he" could be a "they".

I also seem to remember that Sills said he had a suspect in mind (unnamed) but needed to question someone else first.

 

[Razz]

even if he were able to ask for prints of suspicious folks, which I dont know that he can, but the kids were there all the time, there prints will be there anyway....................this is all getting clearer and clearer..............................some say no one would ask for your parent to be beheaded, but you say they would ONLY ask for them to be murdered?? whats the difference there??? Compassion?? being facetious of course, if you aren't a muderer and if you dont have a debt that might get you killed or whatever the cirumstances might be, and if you arent a murderer, then we cannot fathom any of it..............therefore cannot say what someone else that is a killer will or will not do, .......................

Ok. Here's how I see it as plainly as I am able.

BIG UNKNOWN BOSS: We need to get xxxxxxxxx to tow the line. They are not doing what they agreed to.

MINION: What do you want us to do?

BUB: Start small. Begin with the elder folks. Behead one of them and put the other in the water.
BUT it's not these elderly folk who are behind payments. Yes, make it shocking but no need to make them suffer. They haven't done anything. But it should get the message across real fast to xxxxxxxxs and get them to tow the line as promised.

Minion: What if that doesn't work?

BUB: We'll worry about that later if need be. And we won't be as compassionate next time...if you get my drift.

************************

Sorry, very elementary but as of now, it's the only thing that makes any kind of...... sense.(to me.) I'm always up to hear other suggestions and retool my thinking but I haven't heard
any yet that makes sense.

Don't know if it's mafia, drug lords or whoever, but the elder Dermonds were not the ultimate target. They were just the message.

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[dancinunderthemoon]

We really don't know for sure if he was killed in the garage. I seem to remember that they said his body had been moved. We never found out how far or if there was a blood trail, only that he ended up being between the two vehicles in the garage with his head gone. I can't remember now if they saw any blood splattered up on the cars.

Why was that perp out in the yard? Maybe he was rinsing the blood off his hands and weapon before starting on MrsD? Could he have been dragging either MrD or MrsD into the garage? If the perp knew that he had been seen, he may have panicked. He grabbed her and took off without making it into the house to complete the theft of whatever he was after. The "he" could be a "they".

I also seem to remember that Sills said he had a suspect in mind (unnamed) but needed to question someone else first.

I feel like it was donein the garage, seems like an article noted that Mr D had been moved a few feet.....? He was already deceased so there is not going to be a lot of splatter I guess, seems there was some blood on the wall maybe? I can't imagine beheading but I would imagine he was moved around a bit in order for someone to get that done........I can't imagine them carrying or dragging a beheaded body across the yard or across town but who knows