GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 6

[Litig8ter]

Bet he fought like hell if he even had the opportunity if not caught off guard

That's not what the coroner said. No signs of struggle, no bruises, etc. Must have been caught off guard.

http://www.13wmaz.com/videos/news/local/hancock/2014/05/13/8919687/

 

[tomkat]

Good point! I was thinking the search of the Dermond house this morning was totally pointless. If LE had turned the property back over to the family, no new evidence today would hold up in court because of contamination of the crime scene (surely the family had the house cleaned when they came for the funeral). It makes sense that it may have been staged to create anxiety in a person of interest.

So, unless LE has a head (so they know what the murder weapon was), then is it safe to assume RD was shot? To know for certain the murder weapons, without a head, LE must have found trace amounts of gunshot residue on RD. They never said he WASNT shot, they just said they found no exit bullets or corresponding blood spatter. But they also said they didn't think he was murdered in the house or garage anyway so perhaps that's why there was no bullet shell/casing etc. LE also stated there was no trauma anywhere else on his body. Again, RD would most likely have bruising on his hands at least (defensively guarding or holding his head) if he died of blunt force trauma. But, nothing. If he was shot, it would also explain the decapitation, as the overriding theory on WS and to Sills is that it was done in an attempt to hide evidence.

I can follow it all up to this point. If this were so well planned out, two people at least to commit the crimes, what idiot makes such a huge blunder in the commission of shooting their victim that, after they kill him and go undetected, they kill his wife, quietly boat FIVE miles out, weigh her down, maybe even tie her underwater to a tree, probably all done in pitch dark, and then all of the sudden realize they shot the wrong gun?!? Whoops! I better run back and 'remove' those bullets that will implicate me! This is the part that trips me up and makes me doubt the whole chain of thought....

BBM, the reason it seems to me the beheading was planned, but IDK

 

[tomkat]

That's not what the coroner said. No signs of struggle, no bruises, etc. Must have been caught off guard.

http://www.13wmaz.com/videos/news/local/hancock/2014/05/13/8919687/

Right! Thanks!

 

[tomkat]

:floorlaugh: ICU

:lurk:

 

[Bootsctr]

That's not what the coroner said. No signs of struggle, no bruises, etc. Must have been caught off guard.

http://www.13wmaz.com/videos/news/local/hancock/2014/05/13/8919687/

First thing he said was a gun shot and then blunt force trauma. He doesn't have the head. I believe him. Cranial cerebral trauma, more specifically.

 

[Litig8ter]

First thing he said was a gun shot and then blunt force trauma. He doesn't have the head. I believe him. Cranial cerebral trauma, more specifically.

I went back and looked at that again yesterday. Somehow I had gotten caught up in the whole idea that he was bludgeoned. I am starting to think now that they are sure there were two different weapons that they have concluded from lab analysis that he had gunshot residue on his torso.

And I'm starting to think more and more that RD was killed off site, and the beheading was to emotionally torture SD (as well as other family members....like the horse head in the Godfather). When his body was being put in the garage, she walked in and became the second victim. Beheading for shock and not to hide something distinctive.

 

[Foxfire]

IMO Sills & the FBI know HOW and WHERE the killer/s did this. They just don't know WHO and WHY.

So, I am going to direct my thoughts as to motive.
1. The Sills knew a secret
2. One of the family members knew a secret
3. Revenge from a past employee
4. Revenge from a current friend, neighbor, acquaintance
5. Burglary of their cash/possessions
6. Drugged up thrill kill
7. Psycho thrill kill
8. Money, paid to kill them
9. Family member in trouble & this was message to family member
10. Killer got the wrong address and wrong people

Please add thought if you wish.

<BBM for Focus>

RE #1 - Hickory Born, did you mean that the Dermonds knew a secret?

 

[atthelake]

:seeya: Fox! I'm headed up your way today...and will wave as I pass by!

Hope there is new news when I get to where I'm headed for the weekend.

 

[tomkat]

I went back and looked at that again yesterday. Somehow I had gotten caught up in the whole idea that he was bludgeoned. I am starting to think now that they are sure there were two different weapons that they have concluded from lab analysis that he had gunshot residue on his torso.

And I'm starting to think more and more that RD was killed off site, and the beheading was to emotionally torture SD (as well as other family members....like the horse head in the Godfather). When his body was being put in the garage, she walked in and became the second victim. Beheading for shock and not to hide something distinctive.

so now we are back to something more organized, not saying cartel or mafia exactly, but just not thugs or hoodlums ??

Maybe we should listen to the people on the streets, they are saying organized to some large degree, that would send a message, the beheading, just as was thought in the very beginning,

If so, then now, the why?

 

[Litig8ter]

so now we are back to something more organized, not saying cartel or mafia exactly, but just not thugs or hoodlums ??

Maybe we should listen to the people on the streets, they are saying organized to some large degree, that would send a message, the beheading, just as was thought in the very beginning,

If so, then now, the why?

The WHY is there regardless of WHO it was. If the beheading was to shock, it doesn't necessarily translate to mafia/cartel; just someone extremely mad at the Dermonds (or one of them, including family) and who wanted to get horribly even.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I tend to agree that this theory is very sound based on what we have been told by Sills and others. Here are my thoughts.

First, as long as there is no rain or fog, navigating a boat at night is not hard if you have a spot light, which most boats owned by a GW resident would. Of course he would have his running lights on too to look normal. An add-on trolling motor would let him approach docks very silently.

Next, I think it's just as plausible that RD was lured away and killed, beheaded, taken to the garage, and SD was worried to death, heard noises in the garage, and ended up dead. Maybe the beheading was to inflict utmost horror upon her when she discovered the body later.

But regardless of which possibility, how did he get RD's body to the garage? I understand he weighed what he weighed and discount the dead weight idea. Was it by his boat and he drug HIM in the tarp up to the garage?

I also like the idea the killer had medical training and knew the techniques of body carriage as well as basic anatomy.

JMO

I believe he used his own boat as the only transportation when he left the torso in the garage and when he disposed of Shirley out in the deeper waters. I think he simply idled up to Russ' dock that he knew was unoccupied and dragged him the 50 feet or so in order to place the torso in the garage.

That way he wouldn't have to use a vehicle to transport any of the body evidence. 50 or 60 feet isn't a long distance at all. I am sure many of us have front yards that are much deeper than that. And cleaning cars can be noticeable especially if it is done by someone who has always had their car cleaned by someone else.

However; washing down boats with a pressurized hose is commonly seen as the sun coming up. Boats are made to be washed down and to withstand water whether it is on the inside or the outside of the boat.

I tend to think if Shirley had really walked in the middle of it all she would have been immediately killed in the garage and there would be a lot of evidence of that but there doesn't seem to be any evidence that either one was killed in their home or even the garage.

That is why I believe they both were together and both were targeted to be murdered.

I agree on the medical training and I have even thought whoever this person is may have a degree in psychology.

I think he was playing mind games with the police and wanted them to believe that Shirley was missing and whereabouts unknown as if she had left the area on her own free will.

It worked for awhile too because even the reporters were on the same wave length when they directly asked SS if Shirley could be involved in her husband's murder. And he answered very honestly and told them since he did not know her whereabouts or what happened to her (at that time) he couldn't rule her out as being involved.

Whoever this is they are very cold and calculating. Imo, they did want it to seem like Shirley did this and was hoping she would take the fall. He knew as long as she remained 'missing' and the case remained unsolved SS wouldn't ever be able to rule her out as a possible suspect.

It shows he is very unemotional, cold, and totally unattached to either victim and he would do whatever he felt was necessary in order to deflect his own involvement in the crimes even if that meant setting up Shirley as potential suspect.

IMO

 

[southernmimi]

The WHY is there regardless of WHO it was. If the beheading was to shock, it doesn't necessarily translate to mafia/cartel; just someone extremely mad at the Dermonds (or one of them, including family) and who wanted to get horribly even.

I, too, think the beheading was primarily for shock value...and it worked, didn't it? So much anger directed towards two elderly people, but I can't imagine why and why now?
What type of information could the Dermonds have to share that would make anyone so angry?

 

[atthelake]

I, too, think the beheading was primarily for shock value...and it worked, didn't it? So much anger directed towards two elderly people, but I can't imagine why and why now?
What type of information could the Dermonds have to share that would make anyone so angry?

:welcome: :wagon:

 

[Foxfire]

:seeya: Fox! I'm headed up your way today...and will wave as I pass by!

Hope there is new news when I get to where I'm headed for the weekend.

:seeya: atthelake, anytime you want to come to BC, let me know & I'll call you in the gate. Great rainbow trout fishin, good food, and crime discussions..:floorlaugh:

 

[Nuvolari]

She had knee surgery at one time, but did she have a mobility problem? Knee replacement usually corrects any mobility problems. Didnt' see that info anywhere, just inquiring

Reference: http://www.msgr.com/news/local_news/article_780fad32-e12c-11e3-911e-001a4bcf887a.html

From reference: "Those were the days when Shirley drove herself to EDBC meetings, parking close to the building because she was struggling with some mobility issues."

The entire article is worth reading. Were her "mobility issues" fixed by surgery?

 

[OTPTarheel]

What about the Ds cars? I don't remember reading what they were.

I am donating my 1999 Infiniti QX 4 with 248k miles. Bought it when I was working at an "isolated" construction site and had the dealer install LoJack, which all the rage back in the day! I had forgotten about it until I was filling out the papers!
Has LE checked the cars to see if they had LoJack?? I hadn't thought about it LoJack in years!

 

[Hickory Born]

She had knee surgery at one time, but did she have a mobility problem? Knee replacement usually corrects any mobility problems. Didnt' see that info anywhere, just inquiring

It was my understanding a bridge club member said she picked Mrs. D up & drove her to bridge because she had a mobility problem.

 

[Hickory Born]

<BBM for Focus>

RE #1 - Hickory Born, did you mean that the Dermonds knew a secret?

Thank you! Guess I needed more coffee. Trying again:


IMO Sills & the FBI know HOW and WHERE the killer/s did this. They just don't know WHO and WHY.

So, I am going to direct my thoughts as to motive.
1. The Dermonds knew a secret
2. One of the family members knew a secret
3. Revenge from a past employee
4. Revenge from a current friend, neighbor, acquaintance
5. Burglary of their cash/possessions
6. Drugged up thrill kill
7. Psycho thrill kill
8. Money, paid to kill them
9. Family member in trouble & this was message to family member
10. Killer got the wrong address and wrong people
11. Mafia hit
12. Newaubian Cult> Retribution against Sheriff Sills/Justice System
13. Sadistic Psychopathic Sexual Predator/Ritual killer> Acting out Fantasy
14. Cartel hit

Please add to list if you wish.

 

[2Hope4]

Wondering, if the Dermonds had stocks and was getting ready to sell them, would that make a motive??

 

[Litig8ter]

way back before women had any rights , the father would leave son in laws as exec instead of his daughter, if they had no sons, or have them co exec with their own sons, if not just ONLY their sons, which is usually the case

how does that differ today or does it as far as daughters excecx?

In general terms, and without referring to or speculating why certain people were named coexecs in this case, and without specific knowledge of Georgia law, I can say that many states require an executor (and each of them) to be either a resident of the State of probate OR blood family.

I advise my clients to name someone they trust and someone that will accept the burden that will be placed on them. I often have clients that will name one or more children, but not all. Not that they don't trust the unnamed, they just feel their choice of the ones named is best.

I have a client that has two sons. One is a business man and one is a playwright. Guess which one got named.

I would not read anything into who was and was not named in any particular case, other than it was the decedent's choice when the Will was drawn up. We cannot tell from the Notice whether the Will was done recently or not.

Also, it is possible that all children could be named as execs in a will, and when the time comes to offer it for probate, one or more declines to serve. In that instance only the ones willing to serve will be appointed executor(s).