Gene Hackman dead at 95: Iconic actor and wife, 63, are found dead with their dog at Santa Fe home.

[Occam's Zebra]

After each of our parents died, I met up with my brother to get food. Seems pretty normal to me.

Agreed. No one wanted to cook after my father passed - we went out to eat. Let's not judge how people grieve.

 

[Hygge]

she could have locked her dog in the wardrobe to protect him from danger, hearing strangers in the house maybe or to protect him from the other dogs. Not always 3 dogs get along nice together. A German Shepard dog has a lot of power and energy and only a harmless jump on a 95 one and he will fall. Maybe one dog could have gone mad

 

[NuttMegg]

It just seemed odd to me. Most of my friends have aging parents, although not into their 90s, and they keep in close contact, visiting daily if they live nearby, or phoning daily or several times a week if they live out of state.

As I mentioned upthread my dad and I spoke on the phone every day from the time he was 65. He lived in a different state and I visited in person at least a couple times every month.

Maybe my circle of friends and I are the exceptions but we keep or kept in close contact with our parents.

Due to having 2 stepmothers that were nowhere near my age, I saw both of them distance my Dad from me. It would have been weird if they had also been my contemporary.

Not saying that his wife or anyone else distanced his kids from him. But they saw him being well taken care of, and GH may not have encouraged constant contact.

He was known to be a little gruff, see his interviews. Maybe he felt just fine with financing education, however he supported them. Loved them and didn't feel the need for constant contact. He wrote several books in his later years and spoke of the solitude and different type of focus he developed as an author, as opposed to being surrounded by so many opinions on the movie set.

 

[shetalksinstereo]

My feeling is that Betsy may have had a medical event and tried to mitigate with taking medications. It was also stated in some articles that her body was more decomposed than Gene's, which MAY have been due to heat from the heater, if it was on. It is not stated what the pills were for, that may offer some clue if she was feeling unwell.
Gene being found with sunglasses and cane in the mud room, and open door, may indicate he was trying to leave the house to go for help but succumbed.

I do not believe in a suicide situation.
So very sad.....

I agree that it's just a series of unfortunate events. My grandfather fell in his basement when he was in his early 80s. It was July. He was on the floor for several hours when my uncle found him. We never learned how/why he ended up on the floor; however, he was hypothermic when he got to the hospital and ultimately passed away from kidney failure related to the hypothermia. This could be a similar situation? He was trying to get help and fell either due to a medical episode, trip/fall, etc.

 

[CityKid]

You would think mail would have piled up, or packages that had been delivered.

It's a gated community, so it's very possible there is a central mail/package room and nothing would be delivered straight to the homes.

 

[Megnut]

Most logical explanation is she has taken the tablets to kill herself. Why? Well maybe she found her husband dead and couldn't live anymore. Next most logical is she took her life and gave him some tablets at the same time. Perhaps he'd taken a sudden turn for the worst like dementia and she couldn't take it that he couldn't remember her and decided to end them both. As for the dog. Probably eat one of the tablets.

I don't think we even know what the pills were.

But they were spilt so 1. She didn’t take them all and 2. Unless they were like arsenic or something, I can't imagine instant effects. As to whether she purposefully intended to overdose, it doesn't seem like the scene supports that, to me. The spilt pills and sudden fall seem to have occurred in stereo. IMO that's more consistent with her in distress, making her way as far as the bathroom, trying to take medication for whatever symptom she may have been experiencing, and then collapsing.

The nature of those pills will likely shed light.

JMO

 

[SMK777]

I don't think we even know what the pills were.

But they were spilt so 1. She didn’t take them all and 2. Unless they were like arsenic or something, I can't imagine instant effects. As to whether she purposefully intended to overdose, it doesn't seem like the scene supports that, to me. The spilt pills and sudden fall seem to have occurred in stereo. IMO that's more consistent with her in distress, making her way as far as the bathroom, trying to take medication for whatever symptom she may have been experiencing, and then collapsing.

The nature of those pills will likely shed light.

JMO

True. I did just read that investigators said that these were prescription pills, so that rules out something like Tylenol as some have conjectured.

 

[Cardgame]

If the maintenance man saw both bodies, then why didn't he see that the front door was open?

Given that Betty was by the front door and he saw her through the window?

I'm not very good at spatial awareness imagining, so maybe it's a geography question. But it's confusing.

 

[Sunshynn]

Most logical explanation is she has taken the tablets to kill herself. Why? Well maybe she found her husband dead and couldn't live anymore. Next most logical is she took her life and gave him some tablets at the same time. Perhaps he'd taken a sudden turn for the worst like dementia and she couldn't take it that he couldn't remember her and decided to end them both. As for the dog. Probably eat one of the tablets.

I, with all due respect, agree that this is the most logical explanation.
I, like so many others, am leaning toward carbon monoxide poisoning.
Maybe, Betsy was getting ready for the day or they were getting ready to go out or any number of things and succumbed along with her loyal dog.
Gene may have been outside (hence the sunglasses) and upon entering the house also was overcome by the carbon monoxide or had gotten farther out than Betsy before he was overcome.
The other two dogs being alive and healthy is the only thing I'm having a hard time figuring out. Unless they were outside when Gene (in my fictional scenario) was and stayed out longer and gave the carbon monoxide time to dissipate.
The one dog being with Betsy while the other two are lounging around or whatever outside is something I can see because I have two dogs and I have one that is literally nearly attached to me when I am home.

Again, all of this is MOO.

 

[Cardgame]

Whatever has happened here, it seems that an 'unlikely' or 'unlucky' series of events has transpired.

Even if CO poisoning, they have to have died within such a short space of time that neither could call 911.

Isn't the reason CO poisoning kills people 'at the same time' because it usually kills you while you're asleep?

These people weren't in bed. They were up and about, in the bathroom, wearing sunglasses, walking cane etc.

 

[Sunshynn]

Isn't the reason CO poisoning kills people 'at the same time' because it usually kills you while you're asleep?

These people weren't in bed. They were up and about, in the bathroom, wearing sunglasses, walking cane etc.

It can cause sudden loss of consciousness which seems like it could have been the case here.

Carbon Monoxide Poisoning Basics

From the attached article:

Symptoms​

The most common symptoms of CO poisoning are headache, dizziness, weakness, upset stomach, vomiting, chest pain, and confusion. CO symptoms are often described as “flu-like.”

If you breathe in a lot of CO, it can make you pass out or kill you. People who are sleeping or drunk can die from CO poisoning before they have symptoms.

Risk factors​

Everyone is at risk for CO poisoning. Infants, the elderly, and people with chronic heart disease, anemia, or breathing problems are more likely to get sick from CO.

Each year, more than 400 Americans die from unintentional CO poisoning not linked to fires, more than 100,000 visit the emergency room, and more than 14,000 are hospitalized.

 

[Cardgame]

IMO and JMO but it will be very interesting to find out who has benefitted from the will. Presumably, upon Gene's passing, Betsy would inherit.

Betsy was a young woman compared to Gene.

If anyone other than the offspring of Gene are beneficiaries, then that will be extremely suspicious. IE anyone who has had access to that property and to their papers, or to be in a position to influence them prior to their deaths.

There was a very sad case here in the UK of a young man in a village who went around influencing/coercing older vulnerable people to change their wills, and then he murdered one of them, using drugs in his drink.

The Sixth Commandment: The killer who duped victims into rewriting wills

The case of the murder of an author in a Buckinghamshire village is being retold in a BBC drama.

www.bbc.co.uk

Edited to correct my spelling of Betsy's name.

 

[Skigh]

Due to having 2 stepmothers that were nowhere near my age, I saw both of them distance my Dad from me. It would have been weird if they had also been my contemporary.

Not saying that his wife or anyone else distanced his kids from him. But they saw him being well taken care of, and GH may not have encouraged constant contact.

He was known to be a little gruff, see his interviews. Maybe he felt just fine with financing education, however he supported them. Loved them and didn't feel the need for constant contact. He wrote several books in his later years and spoke of the solitude and different type of focus he developed as an author, as opposed to being surrounded by so many opinions on the movie set.

It just seems so unfair and such a shame that two people who made a decision to walk away from the public gaze and live their lives privately now have their whole lives and relationships open to public scrutiny.

 

[Cardgame]

It can cause sudden loss of consciousness which seems like it could have been the case here.

Carbon Monoxide Poisoning Basics

From the attached article:

Symptoms​

The most common symptoms of CO poisoning are headache, dizziness, weakness, upset stomach, vomiting, chest pain, and confusion. CO symptoms are often described as “flu-like.”

If you breathe in a lot of CO, it can make you pass out or kill you. People who are sleeping or drunk can die from CO poisoning before they have symptoms.

Risk factors​

Everyone is at risk for CO poisoning. Infants, the elderly, and people with chronic heart disease, anemia, or breathing problems are more likely to get sick from CO.

Each year, more than 400 Americans die from unintentional CO poisoning not linked to fires, more than 100,000 visit the emergency room, and more than 14,000 are hospitalized.

Yes but at the onset of these symptoms, in two awake people, one of whom is vulnerable, surely one of them would call for help?

This is the bit that I'm struggling with. If you feel very ill, and you care for a 95 year old man, then you call 911.

If he feels ill, you call 911.

Younger people might ignore weakness, chest pain, vomiting. But you would never ignore those symptoms in a 95 year old man. And surely if CO poisoning, he would have suffered/struggled first?

If they had been found in bed, I would find this a more convincing explanation.

Or is it possible to feel no symptoms and then suddenly lose consciouness?

 

[Knox]

They weren't found by neighbors. They were maintenance men.

I have dogs, I also live in a high desert like GH and his wife. I have large bins of water auto filled. The dogs know where the main stash of food is. Just in case.

Doesn't scream coverup to me.

Doesn’t to me either lol … most of the circumstances being pointed out, have alternative explanations which don’t include foul play or M/S. But I guess it depends on the perspective of the person viewing them?

 

[K9Enzo]

Whatever has happened here, it seems that an 'unlikely' or 'unlucky' series of events has transpired.

Even if CO poisoning, they have to have died within such a short space of time that neither could call 911.

Isn't the reason CO poisoning kills people 'at the same time' because it usually kills you while you're asleep?

These people weren't in bed. They were up and about, in the bathroom, wearing sunglasses, walking cane etc.

Yes, and presumably moving about in and out of the house getting fresh air. This doesn't seem to point to CO lethal concentration levels that we see when people are sleeping and unaware. IMO

 

[mickey2942]

My husband and I live a quiet life, but I am pretty sure people would wonder about us after 48 hours of no contact. I doubt it would get to the point of decomposition.

Just odd to me, that they were so isolated from everyone that no one noticed their absence for days. Or longer.

 

[tree1]

It is not beyond the realms of possibility that the dogs were eating Gene and his wife to survive, sickening thought but when starving people/animals do whatever it takes, like those survivors of a plane crash that ate the deceased to survive

I remember seeing the film about that plane crash and being physically sick when I left the cinema!

 

[tree1]

My husband and I live a quiet life, but I am pretty sure people would wonder about us after 48 hours of no contact. I doubt it would get to the point of decomposition.

Just odd to me, that they were so isolated from everyone that no one noticed their absence for days. Or longer.

Makes me realise how blessed i am my daughter and Sister who both live some distance away would worry on the same day if they couldnt get hold of me.

 

[NuttMegg]

SBM

If they had been found in bed, I would find this a more convincing explanation.

Or is it possible to feel no symptoms and then suddenly lose consciouness?

Exactly. And a door was open. Apparently not the front door per 911 call, but one was open. How near either of the bodies?