General Theories and Motives Rehashed #1

[bessie]

I wanted to to show some transcrips of an early JVM show with PCSO SGT Schauland. Everyone always has their own view of what someone is saying but I think it is pretty clear early on. Schauland is saying "We don't know what happened and we don't know when it happened" He could not have stated it any clearer. See below and the transcripts are available for anyone to go back and read. He says Ron has an alibi for work during certain hours but we don't know what happened and we don't know when it happened. I think they suspected RC at that moment. MC was the key to helping them get the proof they needed. Unfortunately, they are in the same place. They need more proof and they definitely need more than MC as an eye witness.

When you back up a statement with a However or a but you are contradicting that alibi .... IMO See below..

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Just to follow up on that, Captain, quite often in other criminal cases, let`s say when a woman is murdered, usually immediately police look at the significant other, the husband or boyfriend.

And then as his alibi is verified and they find out yes, he was spotted at work at the time, and that person is formally excluded as a suspect, that`s what I`m talking about.

Obviously, for example, Ron`s alibi was that he was at work. And that`s firm, right?

SHAULAND: That`s correct. That is his alibi and he was at work. We were able to check that. However, again we don`t know what happened to Haleigh and we don`t when it happened.

Videow, I don't need a link, but the date would be nice. Thanks.

 

[Emma Peel]

:laugh:

Sorry I forgot to use spell check. Actually, I am sorry that I have forgotten how to spell.

thank u 4 the giggal.

 

[1Chump]

I agree. And since I also believe there was a slip up when Misty said she handed the phone to Ron and said the AC guy is here, I believe Ron and Misty were together at the time, somewhere other than the MH, and the AC guy was cleared because he can prove that no one was home when he made his call because he could not do any service at the MH.

I thought the same thing. LE said he had a "solid alibi." Since they do not know what time Haleigh went missing, how could he have a "solid alibi." IMO, it is because no one was home. He could show that by showing the number call list on his cell phone. Usually if no one answers the door, the service guy calls you directly rather than go through dispatch. .

Then the question begs why would Misty say she was home and give the AC guys name as an alibi. IMO, the 911 call was staged to make Haleigh disappear after 10 pm. The AC guy may not have been a thought at that time. But during question, Misty was asked about earlier, before Haleigh allegedgly disappeared. Misty may have mentioned the AC guy called then they had to change the story to include him. In setting up Haleigh to disappear after 10 pm, they may not have realized that LE would verify people who were at the MH prior to Haleigh's disappearance.

One thing I am sure of is that GGma Sykes did not see Misty at the MH that night. I just watched the voice stress video which I believe was in the summer time. Misty gave her story about the AC guy and Tommy but did not mention GGma Sykes. Misty never mentioned GGma Sykes being there until TN told the media that GGma Sykes was at the MH about 9 days after Haleigh disappeard. Misty keeps forgetting to include GGma Sykes coming by with the laundry.

I do believe Misty did have contact with both the AC guy and Tommy that day. I don't believe they were at the MH. I think the encounters were changed to the MH. Because those contacts are real memories, Misty is able to remember the story for those contacts.

 

[Emeralgem]

I thought the same thing. LE said he had a "solid alibi." Since they do not know what time Haleigh went missing, how could he have a "solid alibi." IMO, it is because no one was home. He could show that by showing the number call list on his cell phone. Usually if no one answers the door, the service guy calls you directly rather than go through dispatch. .

Then the question begs why would Misty say she was home and give the AC guys name as an alibi. IMO, the 911 call was staged to make Haleigh disappear after 10 pm. The AC guy may not have been a thought at that time. But during question, Misty was asked about earlier, before Haleigh allegedgly disappeared. Misty may have mentioned the AC guy called then they had to change the story to include him. In setting up Haleigh to disappear after 10 pm, they may not have realized that LE would verify people who were at the MH prior to Haleigh's disappearance.

One thing I am sure of is that GGma Sykes did not see Misty at the MH that night. I just watched the voice stress video which I believe was in the summer time. Misty gave her story about the AC guy and Tommy but did not mention GGma Sykes. Misty never mentioned GGma Sykes being there until TN told the media that GGma Sykes was at the MH about 9 days after Haleigh disappeard. Misty keeps forgetting to include GGma Sykes coming by with the laundry.

I do believe Misty did have contact with both the AC guy and Tommy that day. I don't believe they were at the MH. I think the encounters were changed to the MH. Buecause those contacts are real memories, Misty is able to remember the story for those contacts.

BBM...One thing I am certain of GGMS did NOT see Haleigh alive and well eating dinner on a screened in porch that evening between 7:00 and 8:00 pm...JMO

 

[Karen Anne RN]

I may be alone on this, but I don't care about Misty's pass or fail when it comes to the tests she has taken or will take if she does take anymore. I know a few people who failed yet told the truth to every question asked, and 2 that passed when they lied when answering a few questions. So for me the pass or fail means nothing when it comes to being told Misty failed all her tests. It's what she has said or has not said that I base my opinion on whether she is telling the truth or not.

I am thinking she may not even understand half the questions she is asked. Her 911 call keeps coming to mind.

My first husband took a lie detector test as part of a job application.
He was told afterwards that the LDT showed that he abused both drugs and alcohol.
Nothing could have been further from the truth. We took no drugs, no pot, and rarely drank a few beers.

A few days ago I read an interesting article. It said that 1/10th of 1% of abducted children are taken by non-family members. That's 0.001, or 1/1,000th. I was shocked.
For what it's worth, I don't believe that Misty was faking being under hypnosis. I don't recall her saying "um, uh, etc." She always had to stop and think, when she was interviewed. I watched the hypnosis tape, and never saw any of that. jmo...

 

[Karen Anne RN]

What kind of dad, (who's in serious trouble for her tardies), would take his daughter, miles out of the way, for a particular outfit? before school? I don't believe anything that comes out of his mouth.

If they picked up that outfit, and she wore it, it was obviously clean.

So if it was clean, why didn't they pick up ALL the laundry ? Why did GGMS have to bring over clean laundry that night ?

 

[1Chump]

BBM...One thing I am certain of GGMS did NOT see Haleigh alive and well eating dinner on a screened in porch that evening between 7:00 and 8:00 pm...JMO

I would disagree. According to GGma Sykes on Febery 23, 2009, she said that she did she Haleigh alive and 10 minutes later Haleigh was gone. Those were her words. 10 minutes after she got there, she was gone.

"He was asleep. I got there 10 minutes after we noticed she was gone. I had Junior, he said he didn't know anything...said he was asleep," Haleigh's great grandmother, Annette Sykes, told First Coast News on Monday."

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=132095

Someone suggested that GGma Sykes was talking about after Haleigh disappeared. However, GGma Sykes is not listed in the police report. She wuold have either been there before or right after LE. Yet there is no mention of her.

IMO, LE would have told us about GGma Sykes stopping by the MH that night around 7 pm if she was there to be questioned right after Haleigh disappeared. They told us about the AC guy and clearing him early on but did not mention GGma Sykes at all.

 

[Emeralgem]

I would disagree. According to GGma Sykes on Febery 23, 2009, she said that she did she Haleigh alive and 10 minutes later Haleigh was gone. Those were her words. 10 minutes after she got there, she was gone.

"He was asleep. I got there 10 minutes after we noticed she was gone. I had Junior, he said he didn't know anything...said he was asleep," Haleigh's great grandmother, Annette Sykes, told First Coast News on Monday."

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=132095

Someone suggested that GGma Sykes was talking about after Haleigh disappeared. However, GGma Sykes is not listed in the police report. She wuold have either been there before or right after LE. Yet there is no mention of her.

IMO, LE would have told us about GGma Sykes stopping by the MH that night around 7 pm if she was there to be questioned right after Haleigh disappeared. They told us about the AC guy and clearing him early on but did not mention GGma Sykes at all.

Don't know IF it's me or what since I am having a problem with fluid in my ear due to allergies from the pollen count being so high around here, but I'm not quite understanding what it is you are trying to convey..

IMHO.. GGMS did not see Haleigh eating dinner on the porch between 7:00 and 8:00 pm on the 9th of February...
Misty never stated in any of her interviews in the beginning that GGMS came by the MH that night...GGMS did not reveal she was at the MH that night until after the claims surfaced Misty was not there that night..JMO
And in all reality GGMS stating she was there never provided an alibi for Misty, however it did provide an alibi for her grandson who I believe had managed to get his rear into work by that time...JMO

 

[Wendy101]

I would disagree. According to GGma Sykes on Febery 23, 2009, she said that she did she Haleigh alive and 10 minutes later Haleigh was gone. Those were her words. 10 minutes after she got there, she was gone.

"He was asleep. I got there 10 minutes after we noticed she was gone. I had Junior, he said he didn't know anything...said he was asleep," Haleigh's great grandmother, Annette Sykes, told First Coast News on Monday."

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=132095

Someone suggested that GGma Sykes was talking about after Haleigh disappeared. However, GGma Sykes is not listed in the police report. She wuold have either been there before or right after LE. Yet there is no mention of her.

IMO, LE would have told us about GGma Sykes stopping by the MH that night around 7 pm if she was there to be questioned right after Haleigh disappeared. They told us about the AC guy and clearing him early on but did not mention GGma Sykes at all.

Wow! Think of this statement on a different timeline...
If Granny arrived and left before the LE got there .....I am speachless.
You are right, IF granny was there 10 min. after the LE arrived, it would have been noted in the paperwork. TN, is noted in the paperwork.

 

[Karen Anne RN]

Really good question, dodie20. That is a critical time, I believe, and it is also why we have Ron and his mom lying about his being the one to pick up HaLeigh.

How many go with the idea that when someone is lying they give too much detail?

That's something new to me (I mean reading about it, since becoming engrossed in Miss HaLeigh Cummings case). I would guess, like most things in this life, nothing is all black or white, and that this is just a "symptom" of some liars. What about those of us who have been told we give too much detail when telling about something that has occurred in our lives, while others know how to be concise and cut straight to the chase? Again, it must be that people are just different, yet there are certain traits that stand out, especially when looking for truth, that point to dishonesty.

Last Wednesday I had a tummy ache, and had to call the orthodontist to cancel my appointment.
It dawned on me afterwards, that I had given a whole lot more information than I needed to give. Even going as far as saying that I would probably feel better by Friday, and would call back then.

I realized later that I had done that, and it was because I felt guilty for cancelling the appointment.
Thinking about it further, I think I always talk too much. I'd be in deep doo-doo if someone tried to do statement analysis on me.

I also wonder how well it would work on people who can't seem to utter a complete sentence. Changing thoughts in the middle, as we've seen constantly with the Caylee and HaLeigh cases.

I also wonder how well it would work with people who routinely do not speak correctly. Misty is sometimes all over the place when she talks.
I think however, that it is due to her age, upbringing, and current circumstances. In her shoes, I would probably be a blubbering idiot.

I am also a person who does not name my husband or children when I talk about them if I am talking to someone who does not know them.
If my child were missing, and I started referring to everyone by their names, I would think that my audience would become confused as to who is who in my statements.

Also, saying "I love my son" or "I love my child," to me indicates a deeper conviction than saying "I love David, or Michael, etc." Maybe it's a southern thing.

 

[justus4all]

If they picked up that outfit, and she wore it, it was obviously clean.

So if it was clean, why didn't they pick up ALL the laundry ? Why did GGMS have to bring over clean laundry that night ?

Is it possible..that Haleigh and Jr spent the night before at GMS and that is the reason Ron rushed over to her house that morning to PICK UP Haleigh and get her to school on time...???Not for something for her to wear..

It is possible that R left Jr. with GMS..and only took Haleigh in his haste to get her to school on time and LATER GMS BRINGS Jr. back home..???Jr has been with GMS all day?????

Are these 2 thoughts...possible??? thanks....

 

[elle1919]

Wow, reading and re-reading these threads makes me weary.

The Air Conditioning Repairman was at the trailer around 5pm on the day that Haleigh disappeared but we do not know if he saw Haleigh because LE never once mentioned that he saw her. He could have seen her, or he might not have seen her...we just don't know. But the AC Repairman was at the trailer that day, that is a fact.

Misty does not say I handed the phone to Ronald, she said she gave the phone to Ronald to talk to the AC Guy. I thought all these points were debated a few threads ago. Here is one of them: Air Conditioner Repair Man and Nancy Grace video and transcription dated 3/16/2009. - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[bessie]

I thought the same thing. LE said he had a "solid alibi." Since they do not know what time Haleigh went missing, how could he have a "solid alibi." IMO, it is because no one was home. He could show that by showing the number call list on his cell phone. Usually if no one answers the door, the service guy calls you directly rather than go through dispatch. .

Then the question begs why would Misty say she was home and give the AC guys name as an alibi. IMO, the 911 call was staged to make Haleigh disappear after 10 pm. The AC guy may not have been a thought at that time. But during question, Misty was asked about earlier, before Haleigh allegedgly disappeared. Misty may have mentioned the AC guy called then they had to change the story to include him. In setting up Haleigh to disappear after 10 pm, they may not have realized that LE would verify people who were at the MH prior to Haleigh's disappearance.

One thing I am sure of is that GGma Sykes did not see Misty at the MH that night. I just watched the voice stress video which I believe was in the summer time. Misty gave her story about the AC guy and Tommy but did not mention GGma Sykes. Misty never mentioned GGma Sykes being there until TN told the media that GGma Sykes was at the MH about 9 days after Haleigh disappeard. Misty keeps forgetting to include GGma Sykes coming by with the laundry.

I do believe Misty did have contact with both the AC guy and Tommy that day. I don't believe they were at the MH. I think the encounters were changed to the MH. Because those contacts are real memories, Misty is able to remember the story for those contacts.

A solid alibi for the A/C man would require more than a phone call. It's more likely, imo, that he has eyewitnesses who saw him afterward, residents at his next service call, for instance. Nor would a phone call from the A/C guy to Ron prove that the MH was empty when he arrived. There have been several times over the years when service techs and repairmen have come to my house, and I've had to call my husband to answer a question that I couldn't.

I don't see the A/C guy as an afterthought, either. I think they knew very well what questions would be asked. TN was smart enough to present the photo of Haleigh immediately,and I'm pretty sure she was smart enough to know the procedure in a missing person investigation.

From the moment they arrived at the MH, LE would have attempted to establish a "last seen". They would've wanted to know who saw Haleigh that day, who was at the MH, and the times. The A/C guy was mentioned very early on. According to the AMW article I posted below, Merchant said he was cleared within an hour (presumably within an hour of the 911 call). That does seem a little quick to me, but look how fast TN moved that night. If LE questioned the A/C guy within hours of the 911 call, if not an hour, one has to ask how did LE know the A/C guy was there that afternoon. There are several possibilities:

1. Misty and/or the Croslins told them.

In that case, Misty and the Croslins knew the A/C guy would be questioned and they knew what he would say. From the beginning, any alibi would have to take into consideration the A/C guy's response. If no one was home, Misty would've offered an explanation for her absence.

Now, there's another possibility. Misty was not at the MH and neither she nor the Croslins knew the A/C guy had been there. So, then, how did LE know?

2. A neighbor who saw his truck told them.
3. The A/C man was aware of Haleigh's disappearance very soon and called LE himself.
4. The A/C company owner or manager was alerted very quickly and called LE, or
5. LE noticed an "attempt to service" tag on or near the door.

This would give LE reason to question Misty's claim that she was at the MH when the A/C guy arrived. By August, when Misty took the LVA and hypnosis exams, one would think she would have changed her story. But she didn't.

But the issue here is really whether or not the A/C guy called Ron and Misty answered, establishing that she and Ron were together. In that case, Ron and Misty did know the A/C guy was there. And they knew that the A/C guy's statement would place them away from home and together. To make a claim that Ron left the MH to go to work prior to 5 p.m and Misty was home with the children would have been senseless and downright stupid. When the stakes are as high as they are in this case, why offer an alibi -- and stick to it -- that puts you in one place when you know full well someone will say you were in another?

Having said ALL of that, I think it's quite possible that Haleigh was harmed before 5:00 and Ron's "werk" alibi is sketchy. In fact, I believe that to be at least part of the story. I just have a hard time accepting the notion of this alleged phone call.

All I can say is that this A/C guy had better be good looking because Lord knows, I've spent many nights going to sleep with him on my mind.

As for GGS, until I see evidence to support her story, I'm calling it "a crock".

 

[Wendy101]

I would disagree. According to GGma Sykes on Febery 23, 2009, she said that she did she Haleigh alive and 10 minutes later Haleigh was gone. Those were her words. 10 minutes after she got there, she was gone.

"He was asleep. I got there 10 minutes after we noticed she was gone. I had Junior, he said he didn't know anything...said he was asleep," Haleigh's great grandmother, Annette Sykes, told First Coast News on Monday."

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=132095

Someone suggested that GGma Sykes was talking about after Haleigh disappeared. However, GGma Sykes is not listed in the police report. She wuold have either been there before or right after LE. Yet there is no mention of her.

IMO, LE would have told us about GGma Sykes stopping by the MH that night around 7 pm if she was there to be questioned right after Haleigh disappeared. They told us about the AC guy and clearing him early on but did not mention GGma Sykes at all.

Ok, Granny got there with the laundry 7:00-7:30? HaLeigh would have been gone 10 minutes later.
So the earliest HaLeigh was gone was 7:10 to the latest 7:40. Right?
Now, what time did the phone calls start pouring in from Ronald. I think it was said a call went to Tommys house at 9:00 and the reason he called Tommy was because he had been trying to contact Misty becaseu they were "fighting " on the phone earlier and Ronald thought Misty wouldn't answer, so he called Tommy to see if Misty was there......

 

[nomoresorrow]

I would disagree. According to GGma Sykes on Febery 23, 2009, she said that she did she Haleigh alive and 10 minutes later Haleigh was gone. Those were her words. 10 minutes after she got there, she was gone.

"He was asleep. I got there 10 minutes after we noticed she was gone. I had Junior, he said he didn't know anything...said he was asleep," Haleigh's great grandmother, Annette Sykes, told First Coast News on Monday."

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/news-article.aspx?storyid=132095

Someone suggested that GGma Sykes was talking about after Haleigh disappeared. However, GGma Sykes is not listed in the police report. She wuold have either been there before or right after LE. Yet there is no mention of her.

IMO, LE would have told us about GGma Sykes stopping by the MH that night around 7 pm if she was there to be questioned right after Haleigh disappeared. They told us about the AC guy and clearing him early on but did not mention GGma Sykes at all.

1Chump I have to respectfully disagree with your interpretation of GGma Syke's statement. I watched the video and noted her exact words;

"He was asleep. I got there right after, well within 10 minutes after we found out she was gone and I had Jr. and he didn't know anything, said he was asleep." (end quote)

1. GGma states that Jr. was asleep when HaLeigh disappeared (well whatever occurred that led to her disappearance)
2. GGma claims she arrived at the MH 10 minutes after she was told that HaLeigh was missing.
3. GGma states that she "had" Jr, which IMO, based on the order in which she discloses this info, means that from the time that she arrived at the MH she had (had him in her care...) Jr.

GGma isn't referring to the night bfore, when she allegedly stopped by the MH with clean laundry - she is speaking of that morning, when she first received word of Haleigh's disappearance. JMHO ~

 

[Wendy101]

So it's only a 10 minute drive from GMS house to the MH?

Why the heck would Misty say they drove "all the way" when she was speaking of getting the clothes HaLeigh wanted to wear to school?

 

[bessie]

So it's only a 10 minute drive from GMS house to the MH?

Why the heck would Misty say they drove "all the way" when she was speaking of getting the clothes HaLeigh wanted to wear to school?

It's 8.2 miles according to Google. Guess TN learned to drive from her mother.

 

[nomoresorrow]

So it's only a 10 minute drive from GMS house to the MH?

Why the heck would Misty say they drove "all the way" when she was speaking of getting the clothes HaLeigh wanted to wear to school?

Per/Google, it's 8.2 miles/approx. a 16 minute drive from 202 Green Lane in Satsuma to GGma's in Welaka Zaha.

 

[nomoresorrow]

Sorry bessie, didn't see your post until after posting my response - :blushing:

 

[debs]

Why would Misty mention the A/C guy if she were not at the MH when he arrived? By bringing him into the story, she is presenting him as an alibi to corroborate her story. That makes no sense since he would be the one outsider with documented evidence (a written service report) to refute her claim that she was home with the kids at 5 p.m. If, in fact, she was not there, any "script" would have to include an explanation for her absence.

Ever had a teenager lie right to your face about something? You could have been there, seen whatever, and when confronted, that teen will lie to you about it and tell you that you're making it up. Misty has demonstrated a propensity of lying to save her butt. All lies Misty tells have a reason. Some of them are bad lies, some of them are effective in keeping the truth from being known. But lies they are, and lies they'll always be.

But in this instance, I don't think Misty had any script about the AC guy. She mentioned him in the initial contact with LE, since LE claims they talked to the AC guy within an hour of the 911 call. The question "Who was at the house?" could have garnered her response "Well, I know there was an AC guy who came by......" and what we eventually heard was that she was there with the AC guy.

Frankly, since the AC guy was cleared tuit suite, I'm going with Misty lied about some part of the story regarding his visit to the MH.