General theory thread and motives rehashed #3

[dodie20]

Yes, but her dad(HankSr.) was in a hospital in Jacksonville,due to an auto accident and her mom was up there with HankSr.. Misty would have had the home to herself. JMO

Do we have LE verification that HC, along with LC, was at the hospital the entire night. I've read that he was seriously injured, but then got out the next day. If he was that critical, why was he released? Also, and I'm not trying to point any kind of finger, but what difference would a few hours make? in the wee hours of the morning versus a little later. If my daughter called me in the wee hours, in that kind of jam, come he** or high water, I'd get to her, unless my husband was dying...and HC wasn't, because he was released or left a few hours later. MOO.i

 

[Emeralgem]

Em, I could go along with your theory, but I believe HC was at Hank & Lisa's house when she died. I also believe RC could have shot her being the BA that he was and is. However, didn't the LE search H & L's place? They would have, with luminal, found blood......unless....they didn't search it. OMG

But they could still find it with luminal even now...if they wanted too.

I believe Haleigh was at Hank Sr. and Lisa's residence too when the incident occurred. To my knowledge that residence was never checked in the beginning.. Hank Sr. and Lisa moved out immediately upon his return from the hospital. We don't even know IF that residence was even checked last April when Hardy stated he believed it was possible Haleigh had died in the Shell Harbor area..JMHO

 

[Emeralgem]

Do we have LE verification that HC, along with LC, was at the hospital the entire night. I've read that he was seriously injured, but then got out the next day. If he was that critical, why was he released? Also, and I'm not trying to point any kind of finger, but what difference would a few hours make? in the wee hours of the morning versus a little later. If my daughter called me in the wee hours, in that kind of jam, come he** or high water, I'd get to her, unless my husband was dying...and HC wasn't, because he was released or left a few hours later. MOO.i

In reference to Hank Sr.being released eventhough he was badly injured is no surprise to me considering how hospitals operate these days.. Even IF he had insurance from his place of employment, insurance companies want you out of the hospital even IF you are not ready to be released...JMHO

 

[krkrjx]

BBM I will not speak for Em, but i do not recall H & L house being subject to a search. H&L weren't home the night in question. I guess LE may have just assumed that there would be no need to search it. JMO

ITA about the luminol, they would still be able to see traces of blood splatter even if it isn't able to be seen with the naked eye. JMO

I do not think LC/HC Magnolia home was searched at the time or since. LE would have easily been able to do so then, but now would be a lot harder to do. LE would need a court order to search that property and to get that they would need a very good reason to search. Meaning, they would have to show a judge good reason, and they would have to list specific evidence they are looking for and explain why they believe it is there.

In the beginning, searching for a missing child would have been a slam dunk for a search warrant. But now, LE can't go to a judge and say they are searching for the child...unless the have a verifiable tip that such evidence might be there.

I think it would be extremely difficult at this late date to get a search warrant for Magnolia. Most likiely the only way LE could search now would be if the owner allowed it and it sounds to me like a lot of locals just do not want to get involved. Plus, extensive LE searches leave a pretty fair mess behind.

It is possible that LE's biggest error of the entire case was not searching that property at the onset of the investigation.

 

[Emeralgem]

I do not think LC/HC Magnolia home was searched at the time or since. LE would have easily been able to do so then, but now would be a lot harder to do. LE would need a court order to search that property and to get that they would need a very good reason to search. Meaning, they would have to show a judge good reason, and they would have to list specific evidence they are looking for and explain why they believe it is there.

In the beginning, searching for a missing child would have been a slam dunk for a search warrant. But now, LE can't go to a judge and say they are searching for the child...unless the have a verifiable tip that such evidence might be there.

I think it would be extremely difficult at this late date to get a search warrant for Magnolia. Most likiely the only way LE could search now would be if the owner allowed it and it sounds to me like a lot of locals just do not want to get involved. Plus, extensive LE searches leave a pretty fair mess behind.

It is possible that LE's biggest error of the entire case was not searching that property at the onset of the investigation.

Seems to me if anyone could get a court order it would be LE, that is IF they really wanted to find out the truth as to what really happened to Haleigh..
Sorry , but as I see it, seems to me they are not now or have ever been that interested in finding out what happened to Haleigh. Doesn't seem they are interested in revealing the truth as to what they may have discovered either..... JMHO

ETA..Think about it... It's been almost a whole year since the Shell Harbor search eventhough we have Greenwood now claiming "It's been clear from day one that the contradicting statements from the family members are not the truth..JMHO

 

[krkrjx]

LE has to have probable cause to get a search warrant. There has to be a reason to believe evidence is probably there...not just possibly there. And they have to know what evidence is probably there and specify that in their warrant application. Then they can go search for that evidence only, and nothing else. If they find something not listed in the warrant, they need a new warrant for that. It's not as easy for LE to get a search warrant as we might think. They can't get one just to snoop around; they have to be looking for something specific and they have to show why they believe specific items are there.

I was wrong in saying the landlord could allow LE in to search without a warrant. They can only do that if the property is vacant. If it's rented, the tenant alone has the right to give permission for their rented property to be searched. For outbuildings and other areas the landlord could authorize provided he/she is not leasing those areas at the time permission is given.

Bottom line is, it's too late now for LE to get a warrant to search the Magnolia property on a hunch. That might have been sufficient reason back in February 2009, though.

 

[stilettos]

I don't know where Misty was...
At a party, in the livingroom with Butterbean,
or asleep with both children.

Haleigh being Haleigh, IMO got a hold of the gun or drugs of Ronald's
(Ron is an intrevenous drug user...Shooting between his toes!)

Misty mentions "bleach cleaning" and washer/dryer cycles.
Although the blanket was never washed...only dried. Coverup?

Why were the 2 children supposedly sleeping in Ronald's bedroom?
Why has Butterbean's room never been shown in videos?

Was their sale/use/abuse of drugs their only concern?

Ronald marries Misty because she has "info on him"
and him the same.

(Ron is an intrevenous drug user...Shooting between his toes!)

I had heard this....do we know this to be true?

 

[dodie20]

LE has to have probable cause to get a search warrant. There has to be a reason to believe evidence is probably there...not just possibly there. And they have to know what evidence is probably there and specify that in their warrant application. Then they can go search for that evidence only, and nothing else. If they find something not listed in the warrant, they need a new warrant for that. It's not as easy for LE to get a search warrant as we might think. They can't get one just to snoop around; they have to be looking for something specific and they have to show why they believe specific items are there.

I was wrong in saying the landlord could allow LE in to search without a warrant. They can only do that if the property is vacant. If it's rented, the tenant alone has the right to give permission for their rented property to be searched. For outbuildings and other areas the landlord could authorize provided he/she is not leasing those areas at the time permission is given.

Bottom line is, it's too late now for LE to get a warrant to search the Magnolia property on a hunch. That might have been sufficient reason back in February 2009, though.

LE publicly named Tommy a suspect. According to Art Harris sources, Tommy was at that residence, when he took the call from Ron. Tommy, himself, admitted to then going to Ron's trailer. Then there's the vicinity of this residence to the last search, (on Tommy's testimony), and I believe some rope that connected back to Tommy and a brick that could be connected back to Ron's. If LE finagled their cards right, I think they could get a warrant, because there seems to be a lot of criss-crossing between the 2 residences. MOO.

 

[lonetraveler]

Wasn't Hope working as an exotic dancer during this period of time? It would be interesting to know what her hours/shifts were. It would also be interesting to know TN & GGMS whereabouts, but I doubt we ever will. Why is that do you suppose? WHY CAN'T WE FIND OUT WHERE THEY WERE THAT AFTERNOON AND NIGHT?

Something fishy, dirty and rotten down there, and there are higher-ups caught up it it!!

If, what TN's profession was really that (as pointed out on other websites,) I can see why alot of these "higher-ups" may not want this case to be solved.

Good point 4Jacy, does anyone know where Hope worked as an exotic dancer? Remember when Ron was reportedly seeing an exotic dancer? I'm wondering if he was really just going to see and talk with Hope? I really feel that Hope would do anything for Ron.

 

[lonetraveler]

I do not think LC/HC Magnolia home was searched at the time or since. LE would have easily been able to do so then, but now would be a lot harder to do. LE would need a court order to search that property and to get that they would need a very good reason to search. Meaning, they would have to show a judge good reason, and they would have to list specific evidence they are looking for and explain why they believe it is there.

In the beginning, searching for a missing child would have been a slam dunk for a search warrant. But now, LE can't go to a judge and say they are searching for the child...unless the have a verifiable tip that such evidence might be there.

I think it would be extremely difficult at this late date to get a search warrant for Magnolia. Most likiely the only way LE could search now would be if the owner allowed it and it sounds to me like a lot of locals just do not want to get involved. Plus, extensive LE searches leave a pretty fair mess behind.

It is possible that LE's biggest error of the entire case was not searching that property at the onset of the investigation.

Just my opinion here but I do not have any respect for the Putnam Co. LE at all, none, nada, nothing................there are a lot of places that everyone assumes that LE would have naturally searched. IMO, they didn't search these places, if they did, it would surprise me to hello and back. I do believe that if they had not had their proverbial head hidden from site that they would have searched the Sykes, Neves, and Croslins and definitely the Squires residences, owned land and hunting lands the on the 10th of February 10th as soon as daylight entered the world. As far as we know, only the Mobile Home and the dang van of Chelsea Croslin was searched, and add the woods immediately behind the MH until much, much later. PDM, as far as I know has never been searched. IMO, since PDM is Ron's workplace and "HE WAS AT WERK" that night, that entire plant site all the way beyond the water's edge should have been first priority! From the first hour on, people were allowed to enter the crime scene at will, the bed sheets were brought outside for the wind to blow all evidence all over the neighborhood, the dumpster was searched many days later in the dark of night, with people tramping all over any evidence, and then the ultimate insult: Bobcats (front-end loaders) were used to empty the dumpster, in the dark and guess what? They (LE) did not find a body!!!!!!!!!! Really?

 

[lonetraveler]

LE publicly named Tommy a suspect. According to Art Harris sources, Tommy was at that residence, when he took the call from Ron. Tommy, himself, admitted to then going to Ron's trailer. Then there's the vicinity of this residence to the last search, (on Tommy's testimony), and I believe some rope that connected back to Tommy and a brick that could be connected back to Ron's. If LE finagled their cards right, I think they could get a warrant, because there seems to be a lot of criss-crossing between the 2 residences. MOO.

Well, if Tommy was indeed at his parent's residence, how did he get to Ron's? His van was borrowed by his brother, Timmy. Lindsey was at school until around 10:00 pm so I would guess that Lindsey was driving the red pickup truck. So, Hank and Lisa Croslin's home was too far to walk there, so how did he get there? My guess is that the Croslins were already going to stay at Tommy's house and Tommy was at his own house. According to Lindsey, Misty ate dinner with them and Tommy cooked it. This was supposedly, prior to her leaving for school. I think that Ron called Tommy's residence (where Lisa and Hank were staying, already). Either Lindsey was lying about Misty eating with them and Misty was really sleeping it off at Hank and Lisa's house or Misty was at Tommy's house. I'm thinking that Lindsey is lying about Misty eating dinner with them. Misty was sleeping at her parent's house. I'm thinking that is why no one could reach her. IMO, either Timmy and/or Chelsea went over to wake her up and take her over to Ron's MH. They were most likely called by Tommy after Ron called and asked if she was there, at Tommy's house. I do believe that Misty knew absolutely nothing until she was dropped off at the MH at around 2 am.

 

[lonetraveler]

In reference to Hank Sr.being released eventhough he was badly injured is no surprise to me considering how hospitals operate these days.. Even IF he had insurance from his place of employment, insurance companies want you out of the hospital even IF you are not ready to be released...JMHO

Absolutely, hospitals now just patch you up, cast the leg, and send you home with pain meds. I do believe that some patients aren't even conscious yet before they are loaded up in the family vehicle for the ride home.

 

[dodie20]

Absolutely, hospitals now just patch you up, cast the leg, and send you home with pain meds. I do believe that some patients aren't even conscious yet before they are loaded up in the family vehicle for the ride home.

There's not much doubt that Misty's family has been relentlessly targeted so LE must have their reasons. Also, L claimed in court, that she tried to blackmail Misty. with what, IDK...I was curious about H and L because even if on the surface, they seem to have an airtight alibi for that night, I can't help but wonder. I don't think for a second they were in on a murder, but I do think it's possible that L left the hospital. Her needing to stay with H doesn't wash with me, because he supposedly got out a few hours later. Did she have a ride? IDK how they got to the hospital or how they left. moo

 

[4Jacy]

I believe Haleigh was at Hank Sr. and Lisa's residence too when the incident occurred. To my knowledge that residence was never checked in the beginning.. Hank Sr. and Lisa moved out immediately upon his return from the hospital. We don't even know IF that residence was even checked last April when Hardy stated he believed it was possible Haleigh had died in the Shell Harbor area..JMHO

Sooo, Em, why not? Why didn't they search the H & L residence? I have been with you from the beginning...something is very wrong in Denmark, but especially in Putnam County. :banghead:

 

[krkrjx]

LE publicly named Tommy a suspect. According to Art Harris sources, Tommy was at that residence, when he took the call from Ron. Tommy, himself, admitted to then going to Ron's trailer. Then there's the vicinity of this residence to the last search, (on Tommy's testimony), and I believe some rope that connected back to Tommy and a brick that could be connected back to Ron's. If LE finagled their cards right, I think they could get a warrant, because there seems to be a lot of criss-crossing between the 2 residences. MOO.

LE has never named anyone a suspect. The only time anyone was referred to as a suspect was in court for sentencing on a drug charge when Tommy was called a suspect by the SA. And IMO, he meant POI but misspoke.

And even if Tommy was a suspect, that's not a slam dunk reason for a search warrant on his parents' former residence. Even a judge in signing such a warrant has to abide by search and seizure laws. I do agree, though, with those who say LE doesn't seem interested enough in solving Haleigh's case to bother with searches anymore.

I believe that everyone and anyone in authority in Putnam County was royally pizzzed at the wild-goose chase they were sent on, supposedly on Tommy's tip, and when Werter had the gall to insist in court that Tommy had been helpful to the Haleigh investigation and should be rewarded with a light sentence, the SA just lost it.

I know I would have.

 

[4Jacy]

BBM I will not speak for Em, but i do not recall H & L house being subject to a search. H&L weren't home the night in question. I guess LE may have just assumed that there would be no need to search it. JMO

ITA about the luminol, they would still be able to see traces of blood splatter even if it isn't able to be seen with the naked eye. JMO

BBm - Just assumed. No police department "just assumed," unless they didn't want the true facts to become known. Shades of TN and "her" profession?

 

[dodie20]

Well, if Tommy was indeed at his parent's residence, how did he get to Ron's? His van was borrowed by his brother, Timmy. Lindsey was at school until around 10:00 pm so I would guess that Lindsey was driving the red pickup truck. So, Hank and Lisa Croslin's home was too far to walk there, so how did he get there? My guess is that the Croslins were already going to stay at Tommy's house and Tommy was at his own house. According to Lindsey, Misty ate dinner with them and Tommy cooked it. This was supposedly, prior to her leaving for school. I think that Ron called Tommy's residence (where Lisa and Hank were staying, already). Either Lindsey was lying about Misty eating with them and Misty was really sleeping it off at Hank and Lisa's house or Misty was at Tommy's house. I'm thinking that Lindsey is lying about Misty eating dinner with them. Misty was sleeping at her parent's house. I'm thinking that is why no one could reach her. IMO, either Timmy and/or Chelsea went over to wake her up and take her over to Ron's MH. They were most likely called by Tommy after Ron called and asked if she was there, at Tommy's house. I do believe that Misty knew absolutely nothing until she was dropped off at the MH at around 2 am.

Tommy has said that he was so high on xanax that he passed in and out of consciousness, so I doubt he cooked dinner. These people with their detailed family stories kill me. Ron and Misty sitting up all night to work out their problems...Misty cooking breakfast for the kids...Ron going out of his way, to get Haleigh's favorite outfit...Misty walking Haleigh all the way to class...Chelsea being upset because Ron wouldn't let her talk to Haleigh...Ron letting Haleigh drive home...AS doing the laundry so she could get the stains out...AS's visit...Misty being mature and the best gf Ron ever had...Haleigh wanting Ron and Misty to marry... Tommy cooking dinner...MOO. IMO, 99% of this stuff is false.

 

[Nonni Brenda]

Just my opinion here but I do not have any respect for the Putnam Co. LE at all, none, nada, nothing................there are a lot of places that everyone assumes that LE would have naturally searched. IMO, they didn't search these places, if they did, it would surprise me to hello and back. I do believe that if they had not had their proverbial head hidden from site that they would have searched the Sykes, Neves, and Croslins and definitely the Squires residences, owned land and hunting lands the on the 10th of February 10th as soon as daylight entered the world. As far as we know, only the Mobile Home and the dang van of Chelsea Croslin was searched, and add the woods immediately behind the MH until much, much later. PDM, as far as I know has never been searched. IMO, since PDM is Ron's workplace and "HE WAS AT WERK" that night, that entire plant site all the way beyond the water's edge should have been first priority! From the first hour on, people were allowed to enter the crime scene at will, the bed sheets were brought outside for the wind to blow all evidence all over the neighborhood, the dumpster was searched many days later in the dark of night, with people tramping all over any evidence, and then the ultimate insult: Bobcats (front-end loaders) were used to empty the dumpster, in the dark and guess what? They (LE) did not find a body!!!!!!!!!! Really?

:jumping::jumping::jumping:
Exatly, Lone. After 3 cadaver dogs hit on the dumpster...evidence probably was destroyed by those Bobcats. And let's not forget...Key witnesses/family members who LE say now that they have lied from the beginning, Why have they let them get away with those lies? As far as we know they haven't been properly questioned, at least not the important questions. If LE knew from the beginning that family members were lieing, why no pressure on those family members? As far as we know they weren't even asked to take LDT's. I don't understand LE in this area.:waitasec:

 

[krkrjx]

BBm - Just assumed. No police department "just assumed," unless they didn't want the true facts to become known. Shades of TN and "her" profession?

I have heard a few times that TN had been a SO file clerk, not a dispatcher. FWIW.

And absolutely!!! LE should not have assumed anything! They should have searched Magnolia for the simple reason that a little girl was missing and the person LE believed to be the last to see her was at least a part-time resident at that address.

 

[Nonni Brenda]

Sooo, Em, why not? Why didn't they search the H & L residence? I have been with you from the beginning...something is very wrong in Denmark, but especially in Putnam County. :banghead:

And, was that not the house the other 911 call came from. Why has that call never been talked about? And just a few minutes b4 the call from Green Ln. And they're not related???? My bet is they are very related in some kind of way!