IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #30

[Bootsctr]

I suspect a confession may be in the future. . . Maybe after the concert, maybe after Lizzie is laid to rest. . . after May 4th. ? Somebody's gotta be the fall guy, might as well be the one already behind bars.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Regarding whether there was a ransom note...

It's possible, but to give you an idea of the rarity of it: In 2009, there was an article about the 25th anniversary of a 3-year-old boy who was kidnapped, and a ransom note left behind:

"It's a very, very rare crime," said Gerald Nance, supervisor for the forensics services unit at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

Most cases of kidnapped children are driven by sexual purposes, and there are no ransom notes , Nance said.

"In 11 years, I think I've only dealt with maybe five cases (like Tosho's)," Nance said.

Currently, there is one case entered into NCMEC that involves a ransom note; Clark "Tosho" Handa.

 

[threecrazykids]

BBM

Is there any other reason that two female children are abducted and murdered?

Profit could be a reason children are murdered. Monetary or otherwise. The sex of the child would be indifferent.

 

[Bootsctr]

Regarding whether there was a ransom note...

It's possible, but to give you an idea of the rarity of it: In 2009, there was an article about the 25th anniversary of a 3-year-old boy who was kidnapped, and a ransom note left behind:

"It's a very, very rare crime," said Gerald Nance, supervisor for the forensics services unit at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

Most cases of kidnapped children are driven by sexual purposes, and there are no ransom notes , Nance said.

"In 11 years, I think I've only dealt with maybe five cases (like Tosho's)," Nance said.

Currently, there is one case entered into NCMEC that involves a ransom note; Clark "Tosho" Handa.

Interesting! Thank you. I always thought the phone message "found" on Drew's phone was the "ransom" call.

 

[Bootsctr]

Regarding whether there was a ransom note...

It's possible, but to give you an idea of the rarity of it: In 2009, there was an article about the 25th anniversary of a 3-year-old boy who was kidnapped, and a ransom note left behind:

"It's a very, very rare crime," said Gerald Nance, supervisor for the forensics services unit at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

Most cases of kidnapped children are driven by sexual purposes, and there are no ransom notes , Nance said.

"In 11 years, I think I've only dealt with maybe five cases (like Tosho's)," Nance said.

Currently, there is one case entered into NCMEC that involves a ransom note; Clark "Tosho" Handa.

I always think of the Lindbergh baby and of course Jon Benet when it comes to ransom notes.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Why would someone kidnap the girls when neither family is wealthy? We are assuming the kidnappers knew the families...right? With most ransom notes, there is the demand to not talk to anyone. So how would they expect the family to come up with the money? Obviously, we don't know how much the kidnappers would have even requested...but for the kidnap of two girls....It had to be a pretty high amount, right? I know that 100k is a lot of money to a lot of people, but I'm also thinking, for a crime like this, you feel like the kidnappers would ask for more like $1 million. But then how could they expect the families to come up with that amount of money?

 

[carbuff]

It's unlikely but possible that the girls were never abducted. It's possible -- and I say this only because I tend to be literal-minded about what evidence does and doesn't show -- that somebody grabbed one girl from behind and strangled her, for instance, and then got the other one when she came to see what was wrong with her cousin. That would be simple murder and body disposal.

 

[Marilynilpa]

BBM

Is there any other reason that two female children are abducted and murdered?

Jealousy; revenge/retaliation; personal gain.

 

[Marilynilpa]

It's unlikely but possible that the girls were never abducted. It's possible -- and I say this only because I tend to be literal-minded about what evidence does and doesn't show -- that somebody grabbed one girl from behind and strangled her, for instance, and then got the other one when she came to see what was wrong with her cousin. That would be simple murder and body disposal.

If the girls weren't abducted, how did they get to 7 Bridges? Even if they went willingly, it was still an abduction IMO.

 

[Bootsctr]

Why would someone kidnap the girls when neither family is wealthy? We are assuming the kidnappers knew the families...right? With most ransom notes, there is the demand to not talk to anyone. So how would they expect the family to come up with the money? Obviously, we don't know how much the kidnappers would have even requested...but for the kidnap of two girls....It had to be a pretty high amount, right? I know that 100k is a lot of money to a lot of people, but I'm also thinking, for a crime like this, you feel like the kidnappers would ask for more like $1 million. But then how could they expect the families to come up with that amount of money?

No, I would not consider either family wealthy, especially Morrissey. Drew, on the other hand, owns his own business, Heather drives a really nice Chevy suburban. Maybe they gave the impression they had money. It might be assumed he could raise at least $50,000. Or maybe the kidnapper waited until there was reward money available and asked for the reward money. It seemed like the reward got up pretty kinda quickly.

 

[Bootsctr]

After 3CK gave the links to the tree-farm business and the landscaping, tree-trimming business, I wonder if maybe Drew upset someone in the same business as he is in. Maybe he was under-bidding some of his competition on jobs and somebody didn't like it and they kidnapped and killed his kid. Lyric was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[Marilynilpa]

Why would someone kidnap the girls when neither family is wealthy? We are assuming the kidnappers knew the families...right? With most ransom notes, there is the demand to not talk to anyone. So how would they expect the family to come up with the money? Obviously, we don't know how much the kidnappers would have even requested...but for the kidnap of two girls....It had to be a pretty high amount, right? I know that 100k is a lot of money to a lot of people, but I'm also thinking, for a crime like this, you feel like the kidnappers would ask for more like $1 million. But then how could they expect the families to come up with that amount of money?

Perhaps the ransom wasn't a monetary one - maybe the perp wanted to manipulate one or more family member into doing something in exchange for the safe release of the girls?

I think I'll create an internet slang word - NNMO. It stands for "not necessarily my opinion". It might come in handy for those of us who like to play devil's advocate.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

No, I would not consider either family wealthy, especially Morrissey. Drew, on the other hand, owns his own business, Heather drives a really nice Chevy suburban. Maybe they gave the impression they had money. It might be assumed he could raise at least $50,000. Or maybe the kidnapper waited until there was reward money available and asked for the reward money. It seemed like the reward got up pretty kinda quickly.

But why take such a high risk for "only" 50k? I know that might seem like a lot of money to a lot of people, but that amount of money would not last you very long at all.

 

[carbuff]

If the girls weren't abducted, how did they get to 7 Bridges? Even if they went willingly, it was still an abduction IMO.

If they were killed at the lake or as they were taken from their bikes, it would have just been their bodies taken to Seven Bridges and left there. They wouldn't have been alive.

I'm not saying I think it happened that way, though I can think of a couple of scenarios that would fit the limited evidence.

 

[Bootsctr]

But why take such a high risk for "only" 50k? I know that might seem like a lot of money to a lot of people, but that amount of money would not last you very long at all.

NNMO, but desperate times call for desperate measures. . .

 

[carbuff]

Perhaps the ransom wasn't a monetary one - maybe the perp wanted to manipulate one or more family member into doing something in exchange for the safe release of the girls?

I think I'll create an internet slang word - NNMO. It stands for "not necessarily my opinion". It might come in handy for those of us who like to play devil's advocate.

Oh, yes, I can use that one Good idea!

 

[Bootsctr]

Oh, yes, I can use that one Good idea!

I love it! See above post! :floorlaugh: :great:

 

[Bootsctr]

Oh my! I hate to leave good company, but I'm beat! :bedtime: Can't wait to come back tomorrow! Before I leave, just want to get y'all's opinion on someone posting the notice of Lyric's funeral on the Angel's Park Memorial FB Page and somebody liking it and then checking back a little later and the notice being gone? That doesn't sound very nice does it? It seems as though they would want people to know that one of the little angels had been buried today.

 

[Marilynilpa]

After 3CK gave the links to the tree-farm business and the landscaping, tree-trimming business, I wonder if maybe Drew upset someone in the same business as he is in. Maybe he was under-bidding some of his competition on jobs and somebody didn't like it and they kidnapped and killed his kid. Lyric was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

These are the services listed on the Planetary Tree Service website:

Our Services...

Tree & bush trimming & removal
Stump removal
Brush clearing
Cabling & bolting

Snow removal
Sanding & salting

http://www.planetarytree.com/standard.html

I don't see Drew's business being in competition with a tree-farm business. JMO.

 

[B4igo2it]

Thank you for alerting me to the interview. I think you had mentioned it previously, but I just watched it. . . and it's just beyond bizarre. . . to me personally. I would use every chance I got to publically say I was still looking for the SOB that killed my child and my niece and that I would get you. . . like Diena Thompson, Somer Thompson's mother.

:cheers: "like Diena Thompson, Somer Thompson's mother"