ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 60

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  • #41
ADMIN NOTE:

Take notice folks ... Websleuths will not tolerate disparaging comments about other members.

If you engage in rude personal attacks against another member, you will receive a minimum 1 week Time Out. Depending on the consequences of such attacks, there may be a permanent loss of posting privileges.

Sillybilly
WS Admin
 
  • #42
  • #43
ADMIN NOTE:

The true crime community is inundated with discussion of the Daily Mail article about the Reddit posts by Pappa Rodger and InsideLooking possibly having been made by BK. That is still speculation with no confirmation from official sources. As there is a gag order in place, there is no new ‘official’ information for discussion.

Websleuths would not normally allow discussion of any Reddit posts UNLESS the social media account is known to belong to a victim or a POI/suspect. After discussion with Tricia, Websleuths is making a thread specific exception in this instance to allow discussion of those 2 accounts because it is being covered by MSM and our WS approved sources (Jennifer Coffindaffer and Hidden True Crime).

At all times members must remember that, although suspected to be BK, those accounts are NOT CONFIRMED to be made by him and information must be taken with a very large grain of salt.

For example ... the DM article indicates that PR’s posts stopped after BK’s arrest. There is a screenshot in the DM article where a Reddit Admin specifically states the PR account had been removed by Reddit the day before BK’s arrest.

This will give our members something to discuss and speculate about but please remember to take it all with that big grain of salt.

Any questions, please do not ask them on the thread. Just jump off any post to Report and ask and a Mod or Admin will get back to you as soon as possible. Thanks !!

 
  • #44
Continue here.
 
  • #45
You're both correct, I shouldn't have used thud. I meant the thudding around noises thought to be dog play could be the "thud" picked up by neighbors camera, IMO. Sorry for the misrepresentation, in my haste to be brief.
No worries!

I hadn't considered the thud being connected to what D thought was the dog, but it makes sense! I've always assumed what she interpreted as the dog was actually M and/or K being murdered. MOO
 
  • #46
Do ring cameras automatically change for daylight savings? or Does it depend on what type of camera system you have?
 
  • #47
If BK maintains the KA-BAR knife was stolen, does this become a circumstantial case? Yes, his car has been caught in the area on several occasions, but he might find some way to explain that away. Perhaps he could say he left his phone in the car (hence the tracking) and the knife in the car, and someone kept "borrowing" the car. I am wondering if there is any other DNA evidence that would tie him to the crime scene ...
 
  • #48
No worries!

I hadn't considered the thud being connected to what D thought was the dog, but it makes sense! I've always assumed what she interpreted as the dog was actually M and/or K being murdered. MOO
Most likely scenario. The room they were killed in was directly above DM’s room. What she presumed were sounds of Kaylee playing with Murphy in the third floor, we’re K & M fighting for their lives in that bedroom. Jmoo
 
  • #49
Do ring cameras automatically change for daylight savings? or Does it depend on what type of camera system you have?
Yea. I am certain I did not change anything when we moved the clocks in the fall. I LOVE my ring and external cameras. Worth every cent.
 
  • #50
If BK maintains the KA-BAR knife was stolen, does this become a circumstantial case? Yes, his car has been caught in the area on several occasions, but he might find some way to explain that away. Perhaps he could say he left his phone in the car (hence the tracking) and the knife in the car, and someone kept "borrowing" the car. I am wondering if there is any other DNA evidence that would tie him to the crime scene ...
I’m thinking there “is” more evidence forthcoming at trial. The evidence in the arrest warrant and affidavit reflect the necessary standard to apply such a charge. No investigative or prosecutorial team will divulge everything in their possession in such a manner. Even BK doesn’t know what they know, or WHAT else they may have. JMOO
 
  • #51
  • #52
If BK maintains the KA-BAR knife was stolen, does this become a circumstantial case? Yes, his car has been caught in the area on several occasions, but he might find some way to explain that away. Perhaps he could say he left his phone in the car (hence the tracking) and the knife in the car, and someone kept "borrowing" the car. I am wondering if there is any other DNA evidence that would tie him to the crime scene ...



I don't know if more evidence of that is forthcoming or not, but IMO as bloody as the murder scene was and then to travel in the car I would think there would be. Guess we have to play the waiting game to get that answer.
 
  • #53
I'm not sure we know that for sure. I am assuming she wasn't eating in the dark so I would think there was at least a TV on or some light unless she was eating in another room, where again, I would assume there would be some sort of light on there.
I agree. Could be something as diminutive as a low wattage “nightlight” in one of the lower kitchen wall sockets. I’m thinking that she probably ate her food in her bedroom, even as Ethan fell asleep on the bed. One can easily navigate a phone and eat some food without turning on any other light (I’ve done this myself!).

If there were any light turned on in the kitchen it would have more than likely illuminated DM as BK walked past. I do not believe any “light” was on in the kitchen at the time BK exited. Z may have even had her phone’s flashlight mode engaged as she navigated her quick route to the kitchen and back.

I believe she ran across him as she was returning to her bedroom (after dropping off her food bag now containing her trash and wrappers) in the kitchen. She heard him, and ran for her room speaking aloud the words which DM thought K had uttered. He launched his assault at the threshold of her bedroom, before gaining entrance and killing both of them inside the room.

It’s agonizing to think of what she may have experienced before being killed. Her existence “interrupted” by a killer intent on death and destruction. One moment she was on tik tok. The next she was fighting for her life next to Ethan (who was nightmarishly roused from his sleep when he was attacked). Make every moment count. Because…they really do. JMOO
 
  • #54
I see many posts discussing how long it took BK to kill everyone. Not to sound morbid, but I don't think it is that difficult if a person is sleeping and caught by surprise. To kill and incapacitate someone immediately, cutting the throat would make the most sense, especially if someone planned and researched ahead of time.

So sneak upstairs to kill one of the girls (surprise-both in the same bed) slit ones throat perhaps woke the other one up and was able to quickly slit the others throat.

Went to leave and realized someone was up, moving around (X.) Went through the house to her BR and there was some sort of struggle with X, confusion by E just getting woken up. (Who was it that had the worst wounds?) So he would have definitely had more of a struggle with X and E.

Question - is there any information as to whether or not the 3rd Floor bedroom door was locked and broken into?
 
  • #55
@OckhamsRazor22 from the last thread, you wrote "DM was not in his line of sight (which was also impeded due to the balaclava type of black mask/hood she confirmed he was wearing. BK was no longer in seek/destroy mode. He was in exit/survive mode."

Are you referring to the AA? or did I miss some new info?

C & P from the AA of DM's description didn't state anything about a balaclava type of black mask/hood:

D.M. stated she opened her door for the third time after she heard the crying and saw a
figue clad in black clothing and a mask that covered the person's mouth and nose walking
towards her.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case...it - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf bottom of pg 4
 
  • #56
I agree. Could be something as diminutive as a low wattage “nightlight” in one of the lower kitchen wall sockets. I’m thinking that she probably ate her food in her bedroom, even as Ethan fell asleep on the bed. One can easily navigate a phone and eat some food without turning on any other light (I’ve done this myself!).

If there were any light turned on in the kitchen it would have more than likely illuminated DM as BK walked past. I do not believe any “light” was on in the kitchen at the time BK exited. Z may have even had her phone’s flashlight mode engaged as she navigated her quick route to the kitchen and back.

I believe she ran across him as she was returning to her bedroom (after dropping off her food bag now containing her trash and wrappers) in the kitchen. She heard him, and ran for her room speaking aloud the words which DM thought K had uttered. He launched his assault at the threshold of her bedroom, before gaining entrance and killing both of them inside the room.

It’s agonizing to think of what she may have experienced before being killed. Her existence “interrupted” by a killer intent on death and destruction. One moment she was on tik tok. The next she was fighting for her life next to Ethan (who was nightmarishly roused from his sleep when he was attacked). Make every moment count. Because…they really do. JMOO
As far as the lighting issue goes, I often get up on the middle of the night and wander around the house without turning on lights. There is typically enough ambient light from things like street lights, digital oven clock, my cell phone, etc... I also remember seeing twinkle lights and neon signs around the house and not sure some of those might not have been left on as well.
 
  • #57
  • #58
I like that theory. If this was the case, what I'm curious about is LE's reasoning for excluding from the PCA a camera capture of the suspect vehicle driving east through Moscow. What are your thoughts re the basis for excluding a camera capture in Moscow prior to East Indian Drive capture? My speculations are that for the purposes of the PCA, inclusion might have been deemed unecessary; LE wanted only, at this point, to show how the suspect approached the King ST house prior to alleged entry, ie East Indian Drive at 3.26 to Styner at 3.28, cross Highway then carry on pretty much directly to King to be captured on Queen at 3.29am if that makes sense? ( As an aside, I noticed on a more careful reading of PCA that the author has a number of times confused the offical address of the house- referred to as the "King Street Residence"- with the access street - Queen Street. When suspect vehicle is referenced at driving east and west along "King Street" between 3.29 and 4.04, the author has to actually mean Queen Street - this is an understandable error - the address is a King Street address- but should be corrected if possible IMO).

I looked at routes on Google Maps from East Nevada Street Pullman (@2.53) to East Indian Drive. If LE has not witheld camera capture/s in Moscow between 2.53am and 3.26am owing to relevence to PCA, I speculated that BK/suspect vehicle could have reached East Indian Drive via Johnson/Sand Road to the South of Moscow which is the route LE believe BK used for the last part of his return journey according to the PCA. Sand Road crosses the Highway South of Moscow and from there BK could have connected with East Indian Drive. I'm not sure how to post Google maps here but using directions and just studying the routes myself, this route stood out to me as one BK might take if he wanted to avoid camera capture in Moscow. Still just thinking about his whereabouts between 2.53 and 3.26am. At that time in early morning google directions says c 12-16 mins from East Nevada Street Pullman to Sand Road/Johnson Cut Off Road immediately south of the Aboreal Gardens, Moscow. That would have BK on Sand Road, South of Residential Moscow at 3.05-3.09. From there it's another 5 mins to 700 Block, East Indian Drive.
These are good thoughts! For me, the question would then be why, if he was trying to evade camera capture on the way there, would he drive so far east, only to drive north and then west through a neighborhood before going to King Rd., especially if that isn't the route he took home. And, if he took Sand/Palouse Rd any farther east than the Conestoga Dr. mentioned in the affidavit, he would have passed many places likely to have CCTV, such as a couple businesses, industrial buildings, and storage facilities, before turning to go back west through the neighborhood.

When he was last seen in Pullman, he was on 270, which turns into 8. At one point, LE looked at businesses in Troy and Kendrick for surveillance footage. If BK took HWY 8 through Moscow heading east, and was seen on camera on the east edge of town, still going east, that would lead directly to Troy. Since LE wanted to look for footage there, it makes me wonder if the Elantra was already known about and they were trying to find out where it went. IMO, this didn't need to be included in the PCA because that only raises doubt as to if it was the same vehicle as later seen heading west, if that makes sense.

Here's just a random example. There is a state roads building along Hwy 8 east of Moscow that appears to have a camera. It's 20 minutes from Pullman to that building. That puts him there around 3:13. He then heads south through rural roads and comes out on Indian Hills Dr. Per Google, that would take around 8 minutes, so depending on what roads he takes and/or speed, ending up on 700 block of Indian Hills Road at 3:26 doesn't seem too implausible.

Regarding his exit after the crime, him leaving on Sand Rd, if he stayed on Sand Rd south, then turned east on Snow Rd, it eventually meets up with Hwy 95, just north of Blaine, where his phone was turned back on. That route would also have avoided cameras as it's very rural, imo.

This is probably a huge over-analysis on my part, but I have that tendency with maps. :)
 
  • #59
[…]


In addition to bulwarking security, many are bunkering from reporters who have descended on a normally sleepy community. A Washington Post reporter found the street outside the victims’ house in Moscow, about 11 miles from Kohberger’s Pullman apartment, still lined with news crews seeking answers on Saturday.

More than half a dozen people affiliated with WSU told The Post they could not talk or referred a reporter to Weiler. Some who were working or living at the university-owned Steptoe apartment complex said the school instructed them not to speak to journalists.

Emails from Kohberger have been removed from the university system, said a student who had Kohberger as a teaching assistant for an undergraduate criminal law class last semester.

“He’s still listed as a contact, but all our emails from him are gone,” the student said in a text message Saturday.

WSU also removed its online student directory for the criminal justice program, saying the action was meant to protect the graduate students’ privacy.

[…]

 
  • #60
I see many posts discussing how long it took BK to kill everyone. Not to sound morbid, but I don't think it is that difficult if a person is sleeping and caught by surprise. To kill and incapacitate someone immediately, cutting the throat would make the most sense, especially if someone planned and researched ahead of time.

So sneak upstairs to kill one of the girls (surprise-both in the same bed) slit ones throat perhaps woke the other one up and was able to quickly slit the others throat.

Went to leave and realized someone was up, moving around (X.) Went through the house to her BR and there was some sort of struggle with X, confusion by E just getting woken up. (Who was it that had the worst wounds?) So he would have definitely had more of a struggle with X and E.

Question - is there any information as to whether or not the 3rd Floor bedroom door was locked and broken into?
I agree that I don't find the timeline very hard to believe. It seems quite likely that 3 of the 4 victims were sleeping when they were attacked--whether or not they woke up during the attacks is less clear--but that's going to take much less time than attacking 4 people who were wide awake.

The only information we have on severity of wounds is from SG, who mainly claimed his daughter's wounds were different from M's, though he also claimed that a "battle" took place downstairs where X and E were killed. I found it hard to extrapolate whose wounds were worse from that information, but I do think X's dad's comments about her having defensive wounds and her potentially fighting back are quite likely since she was clearly wide awake right before the attack. MOO
 
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