ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 67

[Montecore1]

you guys, they found a glove and a bloody pillow

Police find 'blood' on items in apartment of suspected Idaho killer

Unsealed court documents reveal that police investigating the murder of four University of Idaho students discovered several 'blood stains' in suspected killer Bryan Kohberger 's apartment.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Oh no...not a single black glove again!! Im having OJ flashbacks

The phone data and DNA alone will bury him

I respectively and highly disagree...MOO what we "know" so far and what was on the PCA is all circumstantial. Any good defense attorney (and BCK has one) can certainly poke holes all in it and show reasonable doubt, many defense attorneys have resonated this in SM and even on WS.
For him to be buried in a conviction LE better have a lot more before the trial begins, I think they will.

 

[10ofRods]

Yeah, I'm not too hopeful on that one either. REALLY hope they found his laptop in PA. Would make sense for him to travel with it. JMO

Do we know he had a laptop or similar? I would bet that he does. And I agree that if he does, he took it to PA with him. Even if he wiped his "tower," that's evidence as well. It looks like he left a pretty stripped-down apt, almost as if he thought he would not be coming back. I am assuming he thinks he wiped the hard drive on the tower (but probably didn't think about the Fire Stick).

I think the FBI can recover a lot from the tower, but more important, every time he was on the internet, there is a log of it, somewhere.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

The date of that noise complaint is 08/16, not 08/21 from your link in bodycam video.

Sorry, deleted my post, it was 5 days before

 

[isabella88]

Do we know he had a laptop or similar? I would bet that he does.

I haven't heard confirmation but I'd be SHOCKED if he doesn't have a laptop.

 

[MassGuy]

Oh no...not a single black glove again!! Im having OJ flashbacks

I respectively and highly disagree...MOO what we "know" so far and what was on the PCA is all circumstantial. Any good defense attorney (and BCK has one) can certainly poke holes all in it and show reasonable doubt, many defense attorneys have resonated this in SM and even on WS.
For him to be buried in a conviction LE better have a lot more before the trial begins, I think they will.

Most cases are circumstantial. DNA is circumstantial. You’re very lucky to get direct evidence from a witness, and circumstantial evidence IMO outweighs someone who can be wrong.

 

[General wooster]

The sheath I'll give you. But it's a free country. MOO.

True. However, personal freedom issues are irrelevant to building an overall pattern of behavior in a murder case. The entirety of all evidence is what is important.

 

[SteveP]

If it turns out he never used sheets or towels or pillowcases, that will be very interesting. Otherwise, if I were the prosecutor, I'd ask the officer in charge of the warrant service to say there were no such things there. The defense would need to find someone not-Bryan to testify that this is how Bryan lives. Without towels, pillowcases or sheets.

But with a vacuum cleaner, a roku stick and a computer. I mean, I can see it too, but if he did try to socialize by inviting people over (there's one neighbor who thinks they heard a voice there at some point), he must have seemed a bit odd.

The towels, in particular, should still exist and be in the apartment. IMO. I find that rather suspicious. Still moaning about lack of info about them taking the plumbing apart.

Just because no bed linens were taken from his apartment, I see no reason to believe there were none on his bed. He could have washed the bedlinens and put clean ones back on the bed afterwards, that had no blood evidence or stains. That does not mean that the pillow that the case was covering didn't, as it seems LE took cuttings from it, and likewise, the mattress cover beneath the unstained sheets still had dried stains, and were taken away by LE. As for towels, I assume even a minimalist bachelor student has more than one or two. He could have disposed of a bloody towel and no one would know unless it was found. JMO

 

[isabella88]

Most cases are circumstantial. DNA is circumstantial. You’re very lucky to get direct evidence from a witness, and circumstantial evidence IMO outweighs someone who can be wrong.

Witnesses can be the worst. That's why I don't put much stock in what the surviving roommates have to say unless it's a lot more than what's in the PCA. Attorneys can do a number on witnesses and people don't always recall things the way things actually happened.

I also think LE has a lot more on BK than we know.

 

[kaen]

Oh no...not a single black glove again!! Im having OJ flashbacks

I respectively and highly disagree...MOO what we "know" so far and what was on the PCA is all circumstantial. Any good defense attorney (and BCK has one) can certainly poke holes all in it and show reasonable doubt, many defense attorneys have resonated this in SM and even on WS.
For him to be buried in a conviction LE better have a lot more before the trial begins, I think they will.

I don't think he will be found not guilty by the circumstantial aspects. From what I have seen in lots of cases (Teresa Sievers, Heather Elvis as just two), the circumstantial evidence tells a story ---a dot connected story. These data points and evidence will not be seen and evaluated individually but rather as a part of a sequence that keeps connecting to him, even if there is some evidence that is never found. It is all about putting together the story. And, I think that by the time this goes to trial there will be much more added. JMHO.

 

[Idaho transplant]

First post to this site - be kind, please.

From a legal standpoint, if evidence from his apartment ties to the victims and evidence from his parent's home
also points to his guilt, can the defense attorney refuse to continue with the case? Does the judge have any
discretion in discontinuing the trial? Yes, I understand the suspect has the right to a jury of his peers, but.......

From the perspective of an Idaho taxpayer, to proceed with such overwhelming evidence would be a total waste
of money. What has been the precendent is similar cases?

 

[veronica.mars]

I always felt like he left the car unwashed & dirty to disguise its whiteness when he knew they were looking for his exact car after the murders. Like the body cam videos from his stops, it was so dirty it almost looked grey! IMO.

I have a white vehicle. I think how his looked during a winter road trip doesn’t tell us how he kept it. IMO

 

[MassGuy]

Witnesses can be the worst. That's why I don't put much stock in what the surviving roommates have to say unless it's a lot more than what's in the PCA. Attorneys can do a number on witnesses and people don't always recall things the way things actually happened.

I also think LE has a lot more on BK than we know.

I want dna, surveillance, phone records, and social media data. You can’t get away with a crime like this any more.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

I wonder if he was lurking at the time that LE stopped by for the noise. Hell, maybe he's the one who called them. JMO

I wonder as well, but sorry -- I did post the wrong date -- it was 5 days after the noise complaint on 8/16 that BK was pulled over for something by LE and given a citation for not wearing a seatbelt on 8/21, and whatever else he was doing wrong that night (Idaho law says LE can not pull someone over fore just not wearing a seatbelt, the driver has to be suspected of breaking another law in order to pull someone over: Section 49-673 – Idaho State Legislature)

MOO

 

[Elley Mae]

In the newly unveiled filings, investigators described previously undisclosed evidence they were seeking, including blood, DNA, shoes with diamond-pattern soles and "data compilations" of information about the victims and the King Road house where they were killed.

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger search warrants unsealed

Newly unsealed search warrants shed light on what investigators found in University of Idaho quadruple murder suspect Bryan Kohberger's Washington State University apartment and office.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Ceska]

The more we learn about BK, the creepier he gets.

Bryan Kohberger 'messaged victim on INSTAGRAM before killings'

A new report indicates that suspected University of Idaho murderer Bryan Kohberger was 'persistent' in sending Instagram messaged to one of the victims in the weeks leading up to the attacks.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[r3d-ros3]

First post to this site - be kind, please.

From a legal standpoint, if evidence from his apartment ties to the victims and evidence from his parent's home
also points to his guilt, can the defense attorney refuse to continue with the case? Does the judge have any
discretion in discontinuing the trial? Yes, I understand the suspect has the right to a jury of his peers, but.......

From the perspective of an Idaho taxpayer, to proceed with such overwhelming evidence would be a total waste
of money. What has been the precendent is similar cases?

Welcome to WS!

I think that the prosecution offering (and the defendant accepting) a plea deal would be the only thing to prevent a trial. Since this is a death penalty case, I think a trial is inevitable. In the Parkland, FL mass school shooting, the case still went to trial after a plea because it was a death penalty case, for example -- so, the jury had to decide on life in prison or the death penalty for the defendant.

IMO, the evidence released so far is certainly incriminating, and it's likely BK is the perpetrator, but I think that creating reasonable doubt in this case is absolutely possible. I also don't see BK's defense attorney dropping him because she is a public defender and this is a high profile case. All MOO, someone please correct me if I'm wrong / feel free to add more information.

 

[ktm44]

So where are we disagreeing? I think you're missing the context for my response.

The person I responded to implied that LE is withholding information that only the true killer would be able to give them. A tactic that LE uses to VERIFY someone they suspect was the perp in a crime during a confession or accidental reveal during questioning. I was specifically addressing that.

We are past that point.

I wasn't addressing any other (cited as gamesmanship) means for withholding. Didn't challenge any of those. But if LE is holding on to information at this point hoping Bryan will accidentally corroborate it or reveal it during a confession then that's just silly LOL.

They are confident they have their guy. If they could have drawn a happy face on the PCA and submitted it, they would have.

I would think that if he chose at seek a plea bargain, it would hinge on a confession so it might be helpful to hold back a few details.

 

[MassGuy]

The more we learn about BK, the creepier he gets.

Bryan Kohberger 'messaged victim on INSTAGRAM before killings'

A new report indicates that suspected University of Idaho murderer Bryan Kohberger was 'persistent' in sending Instagram messaged to one of the victims in the weeks leading up to the attacks.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Yeah, I want confirmation on this, but if true, it’s massive. Regardless of if the victim he messaged was stabbed worse, which would add another powerful layer to the state’s case.

 

[esayer]

It’s a free country, but facts are facts. His DNA shouldn’t be there. His cell phone data shouldn’t have put him there months before, and the day after. His phone shouldn’t have been shut off. He shouldn’t be taking put trash and dumping it in his neighbor’s trash in the early morning hours, wearing gloves. He shouldn’t be cleaning his car that way that he was.

not to mention the times he was near their house were early am, so using normal business as an excuse doesn't work.

 

[10ofRods]

Oh no...not a single black glove again!! Im having OJ flashbacks

I respectively and highly disagree...MOO what we "know" so far and what was on the PCA is all circumstantial. Any good defense attorney (and BCK has one) can certainly poke holes all in it and show reasonable doubt, many defense attorneys have resonated this in SM and even on WS.
For him to be buried in a conviction LE better have a lot more before the trial begins, I think they will.

Most murder convictions in the US are circumstantial. Nearly all of the serial killers were convicted via circumstantial evidence. There are rarely eyewitnesses to murders. Sometimes the eyewitnesses are babies and small children, but people are convicted of domestic homicide all the time. On circumstantial evidence.

Do you have some examples of cases where the circumstantial evidence is already pronounced at the PCA stage and no conviction was filed?

I think we all believe LE will have way more evidence before trial, but the outlines of the case are already obvious and that's what the jury will hear first. They'll see his car cruising the area, tension building, as the time of the attack approaches. There will be almost no other cars, perhaps only the DoorDash guy. They will see his car turn into the parking areas of 1122 King at around 4:03, and there will be evidence that the murders occurred between 4:04 and 4:20.

The jury will get to ponder that for a day or two. Then, the prosecution will come on with the cell phone data, with him turning his phone off as he drives to the murder scene, turning it back on as he drives to a place where he could dispose of evidence, and which is *not* his direct way home. I believe they'll be able to show that he had never been down to Genesee or Clarkston, as far as his digital footprint shows. Then he goes home, and goes BACK to the crime scene the next morning (enter a forensic psychologist to talk about this).

And that's without the DNA evidence. Then there will be the testimony on his unusual pre- and post- crime behavior. All of that will occur (plus much else) and it will be hard for the defense to refute any of that.

What we all hope will happen is fiber or DNA evidence to remove ALL doubt. But that's not the legal standard.

We even have an eyewitness that can exclude all women, short men, very tall men and men lacking prominent or bushy brow areas.

But it will be his digital footprint that bakes him. The phone shenanigans alone are huge.