ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 28

[10ofRods]

I tend to think he wasn’t inside when they returned home. Or when the 2 surviving roomies returned.
Mainly because they weren’t harmed, and im not sure the closets even have doors. They didn’t appear to in Zillow. Perhaps someone added some. Idk. I have thought he could’ve been hanging out on that long balcony on the third floor, sitting in a dark spot until all noise subsided. All Moo

My view is that if this is a crime of "passion," then the emotional valence is revenge and hatred. Such feelings have to be carefully monitored inside the perp, or they will go ballistic and do something really obvious and be caught right away.

But, going inside the house and standing behind some closed door and listening to your enemies as they irritate the heck out of you with their late night revelry and their own happy friendships? That would get the killer revved up.

We don't know why this was done, but I can guarantee that the person was highly adrenalized and worked up - either merely because they were about to commit this terrible crime or because they thought they had a reason to kill and were avenging someone or some ideal.

 

[OckhamsRazor22]

I tend to think they weren’t inside when they returned home. Or when the 2 surviving roomies returned.
Mainly because they weren’t harmed, and im not sure the closets even have doors. They didn’t appear to in Zillow. Perhaps someone added some. Idk. I have thought he could’ve been hanging out on that long balcony on the third floor, sitting in a dark spot until all noise subsided. All Moo

Excellent. The dark corner, where only Murphy could possibly detect him (when let outside onto the balcony from the master slider). As friendly as Murphy is reported to be, he wouldn’t have barked or paid him much attention. I doubt he was let outside on the balcony on a cold night at 03:00. So he had that location all to himself and could watch from the curtain of darkness.

Of course, he did the same if they were all in the kitchen before separating to go to their rooms and sleep. I don’t think there was a curtain or blind visible on the slider off the kitchen. Anyone can stand outside the small circle of light cast onto the covered patio radiating from the illumination inside - and remain completely unseen by anyone inside. He watched, stepped back and watched some more, before entering. No one around would ever be suspicious of someone outside of that home at that hour. They regularly returned back in the wee hours of the night. This would never have stood out to anyone as suspicious or significant. He had so many things working in his favor.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

From the sheer professionalism of it all.
In & out, got the job done quickly and swiftly, with no noise, no evidence no trace.

A random psycho wouldn't manage that.

Now you've peaked my curiosity. If was a paid hit what's the motive? What could these kids have gotten too close to that cost them their lives?

 

[mendicant]

The longer it's unsolved, the more likely it is the solution will surprise.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Sharing this here because even if this killer is not a serial killer, reading it prodded some other thoughts, and because it's the FBI, I believe it's allowed:

Serial Murder | Federal Bureau of Investigation

www.fbi.gov

and an FBI BAU link:

Behavioral Analysts | Federal Bureau of Investigation

Making sense of the incomprehensible. That’s the specialty of the eight agents of the FBI’s Behavioral Analysis Unit-2, or BAU-2.

www.fbi.gov

What I don't understand is why local LE would call on the FBI BAU right away if there weren't some obvious concern. Bueller? Bueller?

Elite FBI unit joins probe into University of Idaho murders, students remembered

The Federal Bureau of Investigations Behavioral Analysis Unit is assisting local law enforcement in the search for the suspect who allegedly killed for students from the University of Idaho.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Angelcat13]

I’m trying to imagine the art of crime scene investigation before DNA analysis, cell phone data, and prolific security cameras. What would investigators be focused on if they didn’t have those tools to turn to? Would they be more interested in the “crimes with similarities” in neighboring states?

Since for the most part, that time period would have also been before the internet, networking with LE in other states looking for similar crimes was difficult at best, so not that common unless it was a big case and there was reason to try to reach out to other areas. We take for granted being able to research databases and reach out to multiple jurisdictions across the nation (and world) with the click of a button. Prior to the internet, this networking had to be done by making multiple phone calls or sending teletypes.

Perfect example is Richard Cottingham who was killing in NY & NJ at the same time (lived in NJ & worked in NY). It took quite awhile for the two states to realize they were dealing with the same killer, which only happened after a victim survived in NJ and reported she had been abducted from NY.

 

[annpats]

Why do you think there's no evidence?

Well, evidence leads to the perp.
And it's been a month now, with no arrests, or even a hint that LE are close.
So if there IS any evidence, it's not very strong.

Now they're asking about a white car.

It all just seems a bit scatter-gun. Like they're desperate trying to find something, somewhere.

 

[OckhamsRazor22]

I suspect outside, too, for a number of reasons, but it all comes down to easier escape/fear of being trapped, and that is jmo. for all I know, this killer loved being in their house and was confident enough to do so with a couple of Plan B scenarios.

Bottom line: risk verses reward.

In the midst of this deadly occurrence, the killer deemed the reward factor greatly outweighed and superseded the obvious HIGH risk(s) factor.

 

[techette]

I'm starting to lose hope that this will be solved anytime soon. I hope I'm wrong.

I just don't see anything really lining up or honing in yet.

I think we the public really are in the dark and I don't know if that is by design or because LE is also in the dark.

We have heard this was a "crime of passion", a "targeted attack" and now warnings that the perp could strike again and adding extra security to campus. Not sure whether this is just to calm public or if we should switch to thinking serial killer? Or at least not targeted?

We have heard the killer "left a mess" and heard it was a brutal murder using a fixed blade knife. But we really don't know what the mess was. We don't know if there was blood trail in house or not.

Front door closed and locked or wide open? Locks on individual rooms or not?

We hear it was a very quiet evening at the house. Then, weeks later, someone remembers hearing a scream.

Two roommates supposedly at a frat party for much of the evening and then a big missing chunk of time we find out about later. No info publicly on this.

A white car with occupants LE would like to speak to. We don't know how this was found out or even how many occupants or if VIN is known.

It feels like we really know very little and maybe even less than we thought we knew early on.

I do hope it is solved soon.

Everything here is just MOO.

 

[lucidium]

Is it possible they had major exams the next day and that’s why the supposed party house was quiet that night?

In my experience exams are rarely held on Sundays. On second thought this was irrelevant to your actual point.

Frankly, I question the whole 'party house' narrative. I've not seen any evidence to suggest this house hosted more parties than typical shared college housing. All I've read are a couple of supposed anecdotes from neighbors.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Sorry if I missed this, but do we know that the attic didn't have a built-in ladder? Mine does.

Out of curiosity, have you ever went up in your attic and closed yourself up there? How hard is it to get the ladder folded from up there? How hard is it to get yourself down from there with having to drop the ladder down?

 

[Bluebythec]

Here's what I think.

That was my thinking as well. They found the fibers at the crime scene and that lead to the search for the car. I think that's why they're asking for tips from BEFORE the crime to try to back track where it came from. Somebody knows but they're not talking, whether from a misguided sense of loyalty, fear of retaliation or worse yet being named as an accessory. Someone right now may be working through a lawyer for an immunity deal before they will talk.I'm not so sure the car is gone but for sure it's hidden. Maybe they rented a storage unit and hid the car in there? I think the killer is still around but poses no threat. MOO

They carefully collected tons of forensic evidence from all over the house, each designated as a different time phase in the crime. They found car carpet fibers on the stairs and on the bedroom floor (using many different vacuum bags and carefully labeling, taking over 4000 pictures of where they gathered this evidence).

They knew a Hyundai Elantra had passed by a Ring cam. So they went into the database of carpet fibers and lo and behold! The fibers on the feet of the alleged killer are from a Hyundai Elantra - but only from 2011-2013.

That Elantra is hidden someplace, IMO. Probably at a remote location, perhaps still with the killer. His family knows he has this car, but is silent (and LE knows who they are, too and are waiting to see if they are going to budge and give up where the car/person driving car might be).

I don't think that Hyundai is still in Idaho, myself. Nor is the killer. But if they find that Hyundai, they will find a person who is definitely worth interrogating.

 

[Mad Hettie]

It's basically reassurance that they'd rather you come forward with information than sit on something you saw because you were drinking underage or smoking pot. That you're not going to get in trouble because they'd much rather have the information. MOO

It's basically reassurance that they'd rather you come forward with information than sit on something you saw because you were drinking underage or smoking pot. That you're not going to get in trouble because they'd much rather have the information. MOO

How are you interpreting that? Its meaning is ambiguous to me (purposely I would say).

I’m not trying to be ambiguous. What I mean is that there may be something more frightening to these people than the thought of getting in trouble with the law. LE has been calling them forward, but what if they truly have reason to fear for their safety? What could make that happen?

 

[isabella88]

In regard to the town vs gown talk, I've lived on both sides of the equation on this. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the killer(s) come from Moscow or a local town and they hate the college kids that take over their town most of the year.

This is still a very broad demo of people but I could see it being someone under 40 whose life didn't work out so well in their eyes. No chance to go be a carefree college student like the four dead were able to be. No chance to get too far away from their small hometown. Someone whose world is very small, who enjoys weapons either via hunting or collecting. If they are involved in any type of group, it would be online or a small local group, but likely not.

This all just my opinion. And prob really obvious at this point. But I really hope LE has honed into some of the online groups the killer(s) may have frequented, as it seems we find out afterward that so many of them did.

JMO

 

[gcplayer19]

Off topic but I feel LE might have a really good idea who is responsible due to the the fact there has been no reward offered yet…or am I missing something?

 

[Bluebythec]

Here's what I think.

That was my thinking as well, that the found the fibers and worked backwards from there. They were asking for tips from BEFORE the crime to try and backtrack when it might have been seen and who was driving. It would explain why they have no plate listed and the year spread is 2011-2013 which may have been the years that specific fiber was used. Somebody knows but they aren't talking whether from a misguided sense of loyalty, fear. or even that they may be named as an accessory. Someone, right now, may be trying to arrange a deal for immunity. I think the car is still around but out of sight. Perhaps they rented a storage unit and are hiding it there? I think the perp is still around but poses no threat to the general public.

That was my thinking as well. They found the fibers at the crime scene and that lead to the search for the car. I think that's why they're asking for tips from BEFORE the crime to try to back track where it came from. Somebody knows but they're not talking, whether from a misguided sense of loyalty, fear of retaliation or worse yet being named as an accessory. Someone right now may be working through a lawyer for an immunity deal before they will talk.I'm not so sure the car is gone but for sure it's hidden. Maybe they rented a storage unit and hid the car in there? I think the killer is still around but poses no threat. MOO

They carefully collected tons of forensic evidence from all over the house, each designated as a different time phase in the crime. They found car carpet fibers on the stairs and on the bedroom floor (using many different vacuum bags and carefully labeling, taking over 4000 pictures of where they gathered this evidence).

They knew a Hyundai Elantra had passed by a Ring cam. So they went into the database of carpet fibers and lo and behold! The fibers on the feet of the alleged killer are from a Hyundai Elantra - but only from 2011-2013.

That Elantra is hidden someplace, IMO. Probably at a remote location, perhaps still with the killer. His family knows he has this car, but is silent (and LE knows who they are, too and are waiting to see if they are going to budge and give up where the car/person driving car might be).

I don't think that Hyundai is still in Idaho, myself. Nor is the killer. But if they find that Hyundai, they will find a person who is definitely worth interrogating.

Edit to add. I don't know why it cut off the post I was replying to and added my comment as though it was part of the original post and I don't know how to fix it !

 

[Zella]

what if they truly have reason to fear for their safety? What could make that happen?

Well I imagine 4 people being viciously stabbed in the community could have something to do with that. MOO

 

[lucidium]

Well, apparently - yes. The FBI has databases of car carpet fibers (not sure about upholstery, but will check).

https://projects.nfstc.org/trace/docs/final/williams_diane.pdf

I suppose that if they knew a Hyundai Elantra was in the area, it would be easy enough to get samples of the carpet that would have gone with the white model (likely only one or two choices). If that fiber then matches something found in one of the murder rooms or the stairs, then yep, it's critical to find that Elantra.

Anyway, right now, that's all that's making sense to me. LE must be feeling a great deal of satisfaction if they've gotten that far in this case. I think it's going along well.

First, let me say, I don't have any knowledge about fiber forensics in particular.

That said, there's been much deserved controversy in recent years regarding forensic disciplines which, as it turns out, were junk science. So-called experts accept money to appear in court on behalf of the prosecution or defense and make claims that are wildly outside the realm of possibility.

My opinion is that it's impossible to identify fibers at a crime scene as having come from a particular source (car, rug, etc.). You could merely conclude that they were consistent. That's a potentially tiny piece of circumstantial evidence. Personally, I think it's very weak evidence that has little value at trial, but could certainly provide a lead for investigators to follow.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Bottom line: risk verses reward.

In the midst of this deadly occurrence, the killer deemed the reward factor greatly outweighed and superseded the obvious HIGH risk(s) factor.

obviously, if the killer found that risk worth that reward. The waiting inside bit would have to have a big emotional/psychological payoff for the killer to take that bigger risk. IDK. I am probably too logical, and I'm not a homicidal maniac, but for me, waiting inside would have been huge risk/little reward, but that's JMO.

 

[Deleted member 110058]

Well, evidence leads to the perp.
And it's been a month now, with no arrests, or even a hint that LE are close.
So if there IS any evidence, it's not very strong.

Now they're asking about a white car.

It all just seems a bit scatter-gun. Like they're desperate trying to find something, somewhere.

Do understand that they're still processing the DNA? This is just how long it takes to investigate a case like this.