Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #26

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  • #161
Lori is 46.

Charles was 62 when he died.
Kay was his younger sister.
I took it from the phone interview GH did with larry. he stated that because him and kay were older that Charles is kays younger brother.
but I cant find kays age specifically.
in this article larry states he is almost 73 and that's the reason Charles and lori adopted JJ because they would make great parents being younger.

Due to the fact that I am almost 73 years of age and we felt that because of the age difference, the fact that Charles and Lori at that time were the absolute perfect parents,” says Larry Woodcock, ‘JJ’s grandfather.
Grandparents of One of the Missing Rexburg Kids Speaks to KPVI


moo
 
  • #162
They seem terrified of losing their temple recommends. I think they receive special visions in there or something. Not positive about that, just the impression I have gleaned bouncing around. Moo jmo

also to have secret sealings to have affairs. I believe it was Nate at EIN had an article about this last week.
 
  • #163
Oops, sorry I should have made my post more clear... I knew that already about Chads kids. That same article struck me b/c of the "bad things" comment... but thats another matter.

What I meant was, I wonder what the relationship of those two men sitting behind Lori was to her, because if they were not Chads kids, and sitting in the second row usually reserved for close friends and family who were they. Just curious, b/c their reactions were so strong.
Would they have been the FBI? They looked a little young to me, but then so did the pitbull in heels and she had at least ten years of experience under her belt. MOO
 
  • #164
But on a positive note, that probably means that he doesn't have a mortgage on the house. (If he does then I'm going to bet if they didn't pay the property taxes that he's way behind on mortgage payments as well.)

MOO[/QUOTE
From a public webs
CD has a mortgage balance of $138K on his property in Rexburg. I’m guessing that he’s spent the last few days rallying the troops for this very scenario, a reduced bail whereby they have the money ready to go.
 
  • #165
Ooooooooo, Adam's on the case... found his own exploratory niche with Hector Sosa, Julie Rowe, etc... soon he'll be joining Justin and Nate in Rexburg. Also grateful to him for linking this up:

According to divorce papers obtained by FOX 13 in January, Lori Vallow believed she was married to James the Just in a previous life.

Julie Rowe confirmed with
@fox13
that Chad Daybell told her he has lived multiple lives on other planets... and that one of his previous lives was as "James the Less" aka "James the Just."

Truly a folie a deux Wow IMO
Thanks @squareandrabbet
 
  • #166
But on a positive note, that probably means that he doesn't have a mortgage on the house. (If he does then I'm going to bet if they didn't pay the property taxes that he's way behind on mortgage payments as well.)

MOO

CD has a mortgage balance of $138K on his property in Rexburg. I’m guessing that he’s spent the last few days rallying the troops for this very scenario, a reduced bail whereby they have the money ready to go.
MOO
 
  • #167
What I meant was, I wonder what the relationship of those two men sitting behind Lori was to her, because if they were not Chads kids, and sitting in the second row usually reserved for close friends and family who were they. Just curious, b/c their reactions were so strong.
I thought they were part of Lori's legal team. When reading the first count of the charges the judge said that Lori was facing 4 (not 14) years in prison for child abandonment. IMO they reacted to that mistake.
 
  • #168
Meeting for DARG (Doomsday Addiction Recovery Group).

It has been an intense and emotional day for all of us. So I propose that we all take some time to decompress, over the next day or two. Here are some ideas that I suggest:

Listen to some music to help with coping with the emotions. For those adventurous souls, I suggest the following songs, that seem appropriate for this case (you decide):

1- Disturbed - Hold On To Memories [Official Lyrics Video]

2- AD INFINITUM - Marching on Versailles (Official Video) | Napalm Records

Next, find an activity that helps you get that stress out. That can be running, taking a hot bath/shower, reading a book, or something that works best for you.

For myself, I think I am going to play a little Grim Dawn, to get out some of that pent up frustration out. It's very therapeutic for me. :D

Tell someone that you are thankful for them today. This can be your spouse, child, family, or friend.

Hope that helps everyone have a great day. Then we can come back, refreshed and feeling much better. Any cool experiences, please share. :)

MOO
 
  • #169
BBM: JMO … but both are too narcissistic to off themselves, especially Lori.

:) MOO

The problem is, Psycho/ Sociopathic Narcissists DO commit suicide, they see this as a way out of facing any consequences for their actions, and have a complete disregard for the family and friends who love them and would be deeply hurt by it.

Off the top of my head I can think of two just in the past few yrs. Epstein and Israel Keyes.... although both of them were already in jail when they did it... so really I suppose it could happen there too.
JMO, I hope I'm wrong!
 
  • #170
I thought they were part of Lori's legal team. When reading the first count of the charges judge said that Lori was facing 4 (not 14) years in prison for child abandonment. IMO they reacted to that mistake.
BBM I thought so too. I thought maybe I mis-heard and I didn't go back to listen again.
 
  • #171
I think bond company, is considering big pay now, but what about their future business? Are they gonna lose business because bonded her out?? Just a thought.especially if something happens because she got out, but I'm sure someone will eventually do it.
They will not lose any business by bonding her or anyone else out. None their clients are paragons of virtue. Someone will probably do it, but she and CD don’t have the best track record when dealing with LE and court requirements. They don’t have a lot of money or other assets after attorney fees and this 100k that is basically flushed down the toilet. And they are in the middle of nowhere. It may take a day or two for an interested bondsman to get there. Although there is some money to be made, these two are untrustworthy almost broke losers who think they are smarter than everyone else. I don’t think bondsmen will be rushing to Rexburg.
 
  • #172
Meeting for DARG (Doomsday Addiction Recovery Group).

It has been an intense and emotional day for all of us. So I propose that we all take some time to decompress, over the next day or two. Here are some ideas that I suggest:

Listen to some music to help with coping with the emotions. For those adventurous souls, I suggest the following songs, that seem appropriate for this case (you decide):

1- Disturbed - Hold On To Memories [Official Lyrics Video]

2- AD INFINITUM - Marching on Versailles (Official Video) | Napalm Records

Next, find an activity that helps you get that stress out. That can be running, taking a hot bath/shower, reading a book, or something that works best for you.

For myself, I think I am going to play a little Grim Dawn, to get out some of that pent up frustration out. It's very therapeutic for me. :D

Tell someone that you are thankful for them today. This can be your spouse, child, family, or friend.

Hope that helps everyone have a great day. Then we can come back, refreshed and feeling much better. Any cool experiences, please share. :)

MOO
Lol You are so awesome! <3
 
  • #173
The problem is, Psycho/ Sociopathic Narcissists DO commit suicide, they see this as a way out of facing any consequences for their actions, and have a complete disregard for the family and friends who love them and would be deeply hurt by it.

Off the top of my head I can think of two just in the past few yrs. Epstein and Israel Keyes.... although both of them were already in jail when they did it... so really I suppose it could happen there too.
JMO, I hope I'm wrong!
How about Fotis Dulos? I think Lori isn't at the point yet when she sees no way out. IMO she's confident she'll get off.
 
  • #174
MSM is finding out about things you guys on WS taught me last week;-)

Right? :D

You know how we have discussed over and over how the LDS Church isn't going to publicly come out and make a statement on this case..? In my opinion, this is how I think LDS Church is going to handle it. Call all of these people in to and ask them what they are doing and how they are involved with this bizarre fringe doctrine. Then they will be told continue and you lose you church membership and you will be excommunicated. <snip>

Lots of people who participate on these forums use anonymous names, throw-away emails, and utilize VPN. They're already worried about government agents watching them, so it'd be pretty difficult for the church to figure out who everyone was. There will also be a lot of fringe-type believers who lie if they are ever questioned directly as they believe fervently that god has shared with them special, secret things, not to be revealed to someone lower on the ladder... even a bishop or a stake president.

Wow. Basically "destroying the evidence." Of course those "unscrupulous local church leaders" could possibly use the internet wayback machine to find the people who need to be excommunicated.

MOO

See my comment above. When you're already living with extreme paranoia, you're not using your real name and identifiers on these forums... at least not unless you're a published author or speaker.

Why do they stay in a religion that they feel they are above?? Why not give up the farce and start their own. Especially when they are claiming that their leaders are using unrighteous dominion?

Because at the core, they believe the LDS church is the true, restored church. If they splinter (or get excommunicated), they lose clout with their communities. It's not just a financial decision. Being LDS is far more than belonging to a church. It's a way of life that saturates everything. Even leaving the church once you've lost your faith isn't a straight-forward decision. You can lose your job, your social standing, affect your kids, and fracture your family. Obviously Chad and Lori don't care about a lot of those things, but leaving is not simple. There's a huge, huge core belief that roots folks to the church. Add a business model that includes LDS books and a subscription forum? You definitely don't want to leave.

My family members passionately believe the LDS church is the true and everlasting church. They just believe that there are problems, and that it's under condemnation. They also believe they will be the ones called up to fix it in the last days. And finally, they believe that all their previous lives have led up to this moment in time where they are covenant members... they aren't going to give up that position easily.

Here’s an interesting article for anyone who is curious. It addresses JR by name and other doomsday preppers and self proclaimed visionaries like HS and CD (though not by name) with quotes from LDS leaders and other thoughts. It’s not a statement from the church on this case, but it does include the stance the Church has taken over time toward these groups. I liked this paragraph for example:

If the call to be prepared to build tent cities was so important wouldn’t this come to the prophet to tell us so that all could know, instead of to a single individual whose influence could only reach a few? Is that the way the Lord loves his faithful children—warn just those who happened to read a book?

I hope this source is allowed. Sorry if I’m in the wrong.
MOO

Why Do Some Latter-day Saints Flock to False Prophets of Doom?

Sorry, but the same question can be asked to the LDS church at large. Only a tiny percentage of the world's population belongs to the Lord's one true and everlasting church. If the call to belong to this church is so important (eg: the only way to get to the highest level of heaven), why wouldn't the Lord announce it to a broader audience, instead of to a small group whose influence may only reach a few? Is that the way the Lord loves his children? Warn only those who happened to read a book?

I know you'll disagree with me. I am still a member on record though I'm struggling to sort out the differences in theology with how I was raised (extreme end of days type) vs mainstream LDS, but this is one of the many issues I have with the church's truth claims. Add the mainstream teaching that there isn't progression through kingdoms and one life only is pretty bleak, even if members manage to baptize everyone in the millennium.

I'm going to guess that starting their own religion would put them too far out there which would be a bad business move and make it obvious how far out there the are to their prime set of potential new customers.

MOO

People splinter and start their own religions when they believe the mainstream church is too far gone or corrupt, or when they believe god or angels told them to do so. They absolutely lose clout with the mainstream body of the church and often only manage a few thousand members of support. The new church can't sustain itself financially, and eventually fails. There are lots of reasons to stay under the umbrella of the mainstream church, the primary one being that the fringe groups we're talking about don't consider themselves fringe at all. They still believe in the truth claims of the LDS church, but believe they are given extra important information and they'll be rewarded when Jesus comes again.

They seem terrified of losing their temple recommends. I think they receive special visions in there or something. Not positive about that, just the impression I have gleaned bouncing around. Moo jmo

Members do believe in personal revelation and fostering a personal relationship with god. I'd say that MOST members do not visit the temple to receive special visions. I grew up in an extreme version of mormonism and my parents having visions was not the norm. Not unheard of, but definitely not the norm, if that makes sense. Members do visit the temple to pray for comfort or seek specific answers to questions: Who should I marry, should I serve a mission, should I take this job offer, should I have another baby, etc.

But yes, I think Chad would find it tragic to be cut off from temple attendance... but he also might feel himself above temple attendance or justify a nature temple like Moses on Mt. Sinai. I actually have no idea if Lori has ever been endowed. She doesn't wear the temple garment and I don't think any of her previous marriages were temple marriages. She and Chad moved far too quickly to seek approval for a sealing there, so any sealing they may have had would have been an unauthorized one by Chad.
 
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  • #175
No offense intended, but this appears to me to be how all religions have started. Speaking as an atheist, it’s all crazy to me. MOO
To me the question is, did Lori and Chad use their (relatively hidden) religious beliefs to justify multiple murders?
 
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  • #176
Oops, sorry I should have made my post more clear... I knew that already about Chads kids. That same article struck me b/c of the "bad things" comment... but thats another matter.

What I meant was, I wonder what the relationship of those two men sitting behind Lori was to her, because if they were not Chads kids, and sitting in the second row usually reserved for close friends and family who were they. Just curious, b/c their reactions were so strong.

Oh, Ok. I have no idea who they were.
 
  • #177
Oh oh. I'm not sure how I got singled out here. :) But yes. This gives them plausabile deniability (or something like that) in that they can say, "they aren't Mormons." But they also aren't making a big public statement which, to be fair, if they did it would make it more likely that people would think of them when they hear Mormon. For those old enough, think in terms of Charles Manson and Scientology (since he claimed to be a member). Which isn't to say that Scientology (or any other church) doesn't have issues, but Scientology's issues are different from Manson's.

MOO

Oh no!!!! Does Charles Manson make me OLD?! Jeeze it was bad enough when I read people here didn't know about Jonestown! <<<<to be clear im 39... and will be forever now>>>> :D
 
  • #178
I hope she's sitting there like she's waiting for a date that doesn't show up.

I am actually hoping the date does appear.
Just not the date she was expecting.

More like a few LE with a subsequent warrant ;)
 
  • #179
Meeting for DARG (Doomsday Addiction Recovery Group).

It has been an intense and emotional day for all of us. So I propose that we all take some time to decompress, over the next day or two. Here are some ideas that I suggest:

Listen to some music to help with coping with the emotions. For those adventurous souls, I suggest the following songs, that seem appropriate for this case (you decide):

1- Disturbed - Hold On To Memories [Official Lyrics Video]

2- AD INFINITUM - Marching on Versailles (Official Video) | Napalm Records

Next, find an activity that helps you get that stress out. That can be running, taking a hot bath/shower, reading a book, or something that works best for you.

For myself, I think I am going to play a little Grim Dawn, to get out some of that pent up frustration out. It's very therapeutic for me. :D

Tell someone that you are thankful for them today. This can be your spouse, child, family, or friend.

Hope that helps everyone have a great day. Then we can come back, refreshed and feeling much better. Any cool experiences, please share. :)

MOO

And also, potatoes. Yummy potatoes help
 
  • #180
Right? :D



Lots of people who participate on these forums use anonymous names, throw-away emails, and utilize VPN. They're already worried about government agents watching them, so it'd be pretty difficult for the church to figure out who everyone was. There will also be a lot of fringe-type believers who lie if they are ever questioned directly as they believe fervently that god has shared with them special, secret things, not to be revealed to someone lower on the ladder... even a bishop or a stake president.



See my comment above. When you're already living with extreme paranoia, you're not using your real name and identifiers on these forums... at least not unless you're a published author or speaker.



Because at the core, they believe the LDS church is the true, restored church. If they splinter (or get excommunicated), they lose clout with their communities. It's not just a financial decision. Being LDS is far more than belonging to a church. It's a way of life that saturates everything. Even leaving the church once you've lost your faith isn't a straight-forward decision. You can lose your job, your social standing, affect your kids, and fracture your family. Obviously Chad and Lori don't care about a lot of those things, but leaving is not simple. There's a huge, huge core belief that roots folks to the church. Add a business model that includes LDS books and a subscription forum? You definitely don't want to leave.

My family members passionately believe the LDS church is the true and everlasting church. They just believe that there are problems, and that it's under condemnation. They also believe they will be the ones called up to fix it in the last days. And finally, they believe that all their previous lives have led up to this moment in time where they are covenant members... they aren't going to give up that position easily.



Sorry, but the same question can be asked to the LDS church at large. Only a tiny percentage of the world's population belongs to the Lord's one true and everlasting church. If the call to belong to this church is so important (eg: the only way to get to the highest level of heaven), why wouldn't the Lord announce it to a broader audience, instead of to a small group whose influence may only reach a few? Is that the way the Lord loves his children? Warn only those who happened to read a book?

I know you'll disagree with me. I am still a member on record though I'm struggling to sort out the differences in theology with how I was raised (extreme end of days type) vs mainstream LDS, but this is one of the issues I have with the church's truth claims. Add the mainstream teaching that there isn't progression through kingdoms and one life only is pretty bleak, even if members manage to baptize everyone in the millennium.



People splinter and start their own religions when they believe the mainstream church is too far gone or corrupt, or when they believe god or angels told them to do so. They absolutely lose clout with the mainstream body of the church and often only manage a few thousand members of support. The new church can't sustain itself financially, and eventually fails. There are lots of reasons to stay under the umbrella of the mainstream church, the primary one being that the fringe groups we're talking about don't consider themselves fringe at all. They still believe in the truth claims of the LDS church, but believe they are given extra important information and they'll be rewarded when Jesus comes again.



Members do believe in personal revelation and fostering a personal relationship with god. I'd say that MOST members do not visit the temple to receive special visions. I grew up in an extreme version of mormonism and my parents having visions was not the norm. Not unheard of, but definitely not the norm, if that makes sense. Members do visit the temple to pray for comfort or seek specific answers to questions: Who should I marry, should I serve a mission, should I take this job offer, should I have another baby, etc.

But yes, I think Chad would find it tragic to be cut off from temple attendance... but he also might feel himself above temple attendance or justify a nature temple like Moses on Mt. Sinai. I actually have no idea if Lori has ever been endowed. She doesn't wear the temple garment and I don't think any of her previous marriages were temple marriages. She and Chad moved far too quickly to seek approval for a sealing there, so any sealing they may have had would have been an unauthorized one by Chad.

Thanks @idaidaidaho !
 
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