Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, stepfather found* #15

[BigAl16]

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

Hmm. I've never heard of these things. If they existed when I was a teenager then I'm very lucky my dad was too cheap to pay for such a thing. MOO

 

[jjenny]

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

And why exactly wouldn't Chad and Lori say so to the police? Police asked them for proof of life. If kids are in reform camp, special school, or whatever, what would prevent Lori from saying so?

 

[KonaHonu]

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

This is very interesting. I don't think we have any credible evidence that this is the situation but it would sure explain a lot. If their lawyer reported that to the court in response to the demand to see the kids and it was verified somehow, that would explain why no contempt charges etc. It would also explain why L&C are acting so nonchalant.

 

[BigAl16]

always, always my question...Where is the money coming from. The only one who even seems to be working is IP, new husband of MBp. Unless it is underground money coming from somewhere...

I suppose if you only have to make the money last until July that some assests you'd usually try to keep intact for the moment (401k or other retirement plans, etc) might be okay to go wild with instead. Take credit cards to the max (maybe one of Lori's hit that point or something since the payments for the storage unit wouldn't go through).

 

[BigAl16]

This is very interesting. I don't think we have any credible evidence that this is the situation but it would sure explain a lot. If their lawyer reported that to the court in response to the demand to see the kids and it was verified somehow, that would explain why no contempt charges etc. It would also explain why L&C are acting so nonchalant.

If the lawyer reported that to the court and they verified it then it wouldn't fit CPS and the court in Idaho proceeding with their actions though.

 

[jjenny]

I suppose if you only have to make the money last until July that some assests you'd usually try to keep intact for the moment (401k or other retirement plans, etc) might be okay to go wild with instead. Take credit cards to the max (maybe one of Lori's hit that point or something since the payments for the storage unit wouldn't go through).

They don't think world actually ends in July, or where are they going to lead the 144,000 people?

 

[squareandrabbet]

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

It's not impossible at all, IMO.

Unfortunately, I don't think we have any idea if LE has had the thought already or not.

 

[Redvines86]

Which

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

Good question, but no. I happen to know a little bit about the legal side of those kind of places, LE has access to all those records. As well, those guys don't make enough money to risk OJ problems. Anyway, everybody in the Intermountain West knows about Tylee and JJ now, no school or camp is keeping them hidden. Nothing in it for them to do so. MOO.

 

[BigAl16]

They don't think world actually ends in July, or where are they going to lead the 144,000 people?

True. Could everyone but the 144,000 die then? At that point I'd think money would not be an issue any more. MOO

 

[DoctorAttorney]

And why exactly wouldn't Chad and Lori say so to the police? Police asked them for proof of life. If kids are in reform camp, special school, or whatever, what would prevent Lori from saying so?

A lot of things would prevent the parents from revealing it. These camps have incredibly bad reputations publically, but very lax educational standards and oversight in a structural sense. You survive one and you're a bright kid, you can get out and into college and pretty much be the valedictorian because you'll end up grading yourself with no proper teachers. That means the parents and the kids have an incentive to lie; they can say they went to "private school" instaead of "reform school." And the parents get to pretend they didn't have their kid drug off for being a pain, they can pretend they sent their kid off for "tough love."

The schools lie because money. These reform schools cost hundreds of dollars a day per kid, and while the kid is in their custody, they might not be legally compelled to surrender them without a court order of a parent or guardian. The courts of Idaho have ordered Lori to present the kids, but if they were in Utah or another state, she might not be legally compelled to do so.

 

[Redvines86]

A lot of things would prevent the parents from revealing it. These camps have incredibly bad reputations publically, but very lax educational standards and oversight in a structural sense. You survive one and you're a bright kid, you can get out and into college and pretty much be the valedictorian because you'll end up grading yourself with no proper teachers. That means the parents and the kids have an incentive to lie; they can say they went to "private school" instaead of "reform school." And the parents get to pretend they didn't have their kid drug off for being a pain, they can pretend they sent their kid off for "tough love."

The schools lie because money. These reform schools cost hundreds of dollars a day per kid, and while the kid is in their custody, they might not be legally compelled to surrender them without a court order of a parent or guardian. The courts of Idaho have ordered Lori to present the kids, but if they were in Utah or another state, she might not be legally compelled to do so.

It doesn't work like that, but I wish it did so Tylee and JJ had a chance at being in a safe place. I love the thinking, but no school would risk their school for this.

 

[holsen]

Private planes cost a lot of money.

It depends on how much money you have and how much is "a lot of money" to you. It's different for everyone. I believe for $10-20k, you could get a one-way flight on a PJ to Hawaii. Maybe I'm wrong. MOO

 

[jjenny]

It depends on how much money you have and how much is "a lot of money" to you. It's different for everyone. I believe for $10-20k, you could get a one-way flight on a PJ to Hawaii. Maybe I'm wrong. MOO

Well, that might be nothing for someone with a lot of $$$$$, but Lori didn't get her hands on Charles' life insurance.

 

[DoctorAttorney]

Good question, but no. I happen to know a little bit about the legal side of those kind of places, LE has access to all those records. As well, those guys don't make enough money to risk OJ problems. Anyway, everybody in the Intermountain West knows about Tylee and JJ now, no school or camp is keeping them hidden. Nothing in it for them to do so. MOO.

I could be off base, but I've read about these school doing much, much riskier and much more illegal things for less. I hope these kids are safe too but I wouldn't call those places "safe."

 

[Ohmeohmy]

Actually, I should be honest. I did join for a reason. I had a question that has been bugging me.

Have the police, MSM, friends, or anyone else looked into the possibility that Lori stashed the kids in one of those Utah LDS reform camps for troubled kids and teens? I don't have any evidence this could have happened at all but one of my LDS friends got sent to one in high school, and when she came back, she said that a lot of kids only got sent to them by their very religious parents or even in some cases, the state, because their care givers just wanted to be rid of them but still pay lip service to conservative values. If Lori and Chad really wanted to get rid of the kids, and they have money to burn, I could see them paying to send the kids away for a time rather than risk some more drastic action.

I don't know if this has any credence to it, but I just was wondering if it's came up as a possibility or not.

Interesting...They have them all over especially in Southern UT. . . I listened to podcast with both a former DA and a criminal defense attorney speak to the theory of people hiding them... The attorneys both come to the consensus that you have to have a lot of people "willing" to keep this quite. If you have them tucked into anything at all you rely on people to stay in lock step and not to anonymously report. I also think as we have watched these 2 in Hawaii, those who would be hiding children might be a little over it since they are with a 7 yr little boy without his service dog and a normal teenager needing a normal like with friends. MOO

 

[CuriousQuiet1]

Well, that might be nothing for someone with a lot of $$$$$, but Lori didn't get her hands on Charles' life insurance.

But she probably did get her hands on his checking account, his retirement accounts, his real estate, his cars, etc because Arizona is a community property state (so is Texas, where he lived). They were married so own everything jointly, he dies and she gets control of it all. She could have gotten a bunch of money outside of the life insurance.

 

[Redvines86]

Interesting...They have them all over especially in Southern UT. . . I listened to podcast with both a former DA and a criminal defense attorney speak to the theory of people hiding them... The attorneys both come to the consensus that you have to have a lot of people "willing" to keep this quite. If you have them tucked into anything at all you rely on people to stay in lock step and not to anonymously report. I also think as we have watched these 2 in Hawaii, those who would be hiding children might be a little over it since they are with a 7 yr little boy without his service dog and a normal teenager needing a normal like with friends. MOO

Exactly, it would require so many people willing to go to prison, just no way. Especially in this situation, with these kids, and I am certain it's not worth it for anybody, definitely not after the new oversights that are in place. MOO.

 

[Gardener1850]

Slowly responding to the notifications I have, I'm not up to date in terms of Websleuths so if anyone has any questions they'd like to ask me please @ me so I can find your question.

@Gardener1850 I saw your post showing concern for my well being, don't worry I'm alive and well. You were right that some of my last public activity talked about being sick, but I've long since recovered and am more-or-less living life normally. (I think the stress of doing daily updates combined with everything else going on then made my immune system much weaker than usual).

@tealrose forgive me if this has already been answered but you previously asked: "Did @Maxxer500 say why they were saying they 'betrayed their family'? That seems like such an odd thing to say..." in reference to this quote from me: "I'm of the impression that the Daybells cut contact with us at Chad's request, there's talk that he's been telling them we betrayed their family, but I'm not too sure on this."
I don't know why the Daybells were told that their Douglas relatives were betraying them. I'd love it if they would talk with us so everyone could figure out what the heck is going on, but it seems they won't talk to anyone right now. I could speculate why but it wouldn't change anything to do so.

I'll make sure to respond to any @s you guys send me, but I can't promise to do much more right now. Without much new around the case there's little reason for me to stir the pot and upset someone again. Before I sign off though, I'll mention some recent developments in the Douglas family.
•Local LE showed up to my house recently after a (anonymous? I don't know) tip was called in saying JJ and Tylee were seen on my yard and might be living in my house. The household was cooperative with them and showed them the tip was false. I'm a little nervous of the implications this event might have, but there's no reason to suspect anyone is at risk right now.
•Based on recent family discussion it sounds like no Douglas will be making public statements or doing anything with any media. Despite the fact everyone has had reporters show up on their doorstep. My activity on Websleuths may be the most the family will tolerate.
•For privacy reasons I won't go into details but it's been made known to me that Chad has contacted people more-or-less saying: "The Second Coming is happening this July". It's been remarked that none of the pre-Second Coming prophecies Chad made have happened yet, and him saying this directly opposes the LDS teaching/doctrine of "no one will know when the Second Coming will happen".

Thank you, thank you so much for coming back to post that you are okay, Maxxer! I've never been so worried about a VI as I am about the VI's in this case. There are too many dead people from unexplained causes and the POI's are still walking free. Although they are still in Kauai and I assume you are not on the island with them, I feel there is a real risk to safety of anyone they feel has crossed them. I hope you don't mind my saying that I'm praying for you and your family daily-- In addition to praying JJ and Tylee get found and Justice will be served on earth for any crimes committed.

That is SO wrong that someone claimed you had the kids. But I'm glad LE followed up and no harm was done to your family over that false claim. Swatting is no joke and that sounds like what happened-- someone probably figured out who you were and then called in a false tip, just to be obnoxious. That's serious, and if it was a prank, I hope LE figures out who made a false report against your family. Please take good care of yourself and your family. Don't feel like you have to post often, but I really appreciate the check in, and I'm sure many others are relieved to know you are alive and well.

MOO.

 

[Teche]

Did Lori’s brother have a life insurance policy? If so, could she have been the beneficiary?

 

[fred&edna]

Wouldn't those LDS reform camps be worried about hiding children... Wouldn't they be worried about legal action being taken against them?

Or are they non-law-abiding camps???