IL IL - Debbie Fijan, 10, DuPage County, 11 Feb 1966 - #1

[shadowangel]

I purchased the book My Life Among the Serial Killers by H Morrison, which details her conversations with Richard Macek. Not much new in the way of timeline, but I did find one interesting thing....Pictured below is the same year, style and color of car Macek was driving the night in 1972 when he killed Sally Kandel, not far from where Debbie was found in 1966:

1964 Chevy Impala, original cream color​

 

[shadowangel]

Cubby-
I think its great that you visited the area, to get a "feel" for it. Did you visit the spot where Debbie was found? I'm curious, if it remains anything at all as it did then, as to how well hidden her body would (or could) have been.

 

[Cubby]

I purchased the book My Life Among the Serial Killers by H Morrison, which details her conversations with Richard Macek. Not much new in the way of timeline, but I did find one interesting thing....Pictured below is the same year, style and color of car Macek was driving the night in 1972 when he killed Sally Kandel, not far from where Debbie was found in 1966:

​

1964 Chevy Impala, original cream color​

So Macek had a 1964 white car in 1972. I wonder when he purchased the car.

ETA: What was the description of the white car that Debbie was seen near?

 

[Cubby]

Cubby-
I think its great that you visited the area, to get a "feel" for it. Did you visit the spot where Debbie was found? I'm curious, if it remains anything at all as it did then, as to how well hidden her body would (or could) have been.

I don't know exactly where Debbie was found on Lies, but immediately east of Fair Oaks, Lies is flat there..... There are currently no ditches along either side of Lies at least until where the new Catholic church was built. I wasn't local enough to remember the immediate area... I'm a few towns away.

ETA: I looked for evidence of what once might have been a driveway to the Schofield family farm but was unable to see anything resembling a driveway. I also looked at the older brick home on the west side of Fair Oaks on what was once the farm property. It wasn't built after the county bought the land. It might have been the family home. If so, it's a bit of a distance from Lies... far enough anyway. The home is at the intersection of Fair Oaks and Big Horn Trail. I couldn't figure out where the neighbor to the north mentioned in the media article might have been located.

OT- but it was a nice enough place, lake with piers and a giant mound of stones that I will definately take my son to visit. Also saw two mules or donkeys, small ones on St. Charles just west of Fair Oaks. The area is beautiful. The homes on Wynn and in that immediate area are absolutely beautiful. Saw some people out walking.... imo, a very very nice area. Countryish but still within the burbs of Chicago, so very very nice.

 

[Abbey5]

(bolded by me) This would be consistent with a right-handed person holding Debbie around the neck and face with his (or her) left hand, from behind, and swinging the blade upward and back (holding the blade "overhand"). I can't readily wrap my mind around upward thrusts otherwise.

The fact that her overcoat was not penetrated could indicate that either she was not wearing it at the time (the attack took place indoors, in a place she felt comfortable enough to take her coat off) or that her coat was unfastened and open.

I just don't know what to think about the upward thrusts, but what you are saying makes perfect sense to me.

It is really odd that her coat wasn't peneterated. I remember reading an article that the majority of the stab wounds were to her chest, one on her neck and one on the back of her neck and one in each eye. So, maybe her coat was open at the time.

 

[Cubby]

I forgot to mention Lies Rd asphalt is newer... the other roads were older, pot holes etc... but that intersection at FO and Lies has been replaced and widened... so any ditches that might have been there in 66 were most likely graded when the intersection was widened.

ETA: There are some guard rails on both sides of Fair Oaks in front of where the farm was, it gets that low on each side of the road......

 

[shadowangel]

So Macek had a 1964 white car in 1972. I wonder when he purchased the car.

By '72, Macek said the car was pretty beat up with "the doors caved in". I have a feeling he may have had it for a while.

The real trouble with Macek began in early '66, after the death of his father. So far, I've found an obit for an Edward Macek, who died February 3rd. The obit was posted Feb 7th; it appears he had a son named Richard. (The obit is from our old friend The Chicago Tribune, so of course its pay to view...And the blurb from the obit posted on Google archive is pretty garbled).

 

[Cubby]

or someone had it for awhile and it was beat up when Macek purchased it.

Ay yi yi.... there had to be a description of the car Debbie was seen near.

and there has to be a record of when Macek purchased the car.

 

[shadowangel]

or someone had it for awhile and it was beat up when Macek purchased it.

Ay yi yi.... there had to be a description of the car Debbie was seen near.

and there has to be a record of when Macek purchased the car.

I know, the little bits and pieces of info here and there can be exasperating and aggravating, but I look at it this way...We've pulled together information on another, at the least remotely viable, suspect in this case. That's more than appears to have been done in over 40 years.

I also think its very possible that in the intervening years, more information on what part LS played in Debbie's death has become available. It's just up to us to keep digging and put the pieces on the table.

 

[Cubby]

So true Shadow. I just wish we could find more about Macek online....

 

[shadowangel]

As I change the search parameters, I'm finding a few bits and pieces here and there... I found an article (a blog entry, actually) mentioning a presentation by a McHenry County historian discussing crime in the area just a couple of weeks ago. The murder of Sally K was mentioned, as was the involvement of Macek.
I'm not sure of the accuracy of the historian's sources, though, as its stated that Macek is still imprisoned.

 

[rpipergirl]

The stab wounds went through her blouse but not her overcoat and virtually all were made with a upward thrust. HU! Upward thrust! Could she have been killed by a young person. Someone posted that the school has up to 8th grade.

I copied and pasted the snippet above from another post because I do not know how to quote a piece of a post.

 

[Abbey5]

Here is why I mention the map. This is a snippet from a pay to view Chicago Tribune article.

SEEK KNIFE IN DEBBIE DEATH

[SIZE=-1]Pay-Per-View - Chicago Tribune - ProQuest Archiver[SIZE=-1] - Feb 16, 1966[/SIZE]
[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Mrs. Stark said the night Debbie was murdered she re- membered seeing the Schofield car in the driveway of the Scho- field home about 6 p. m. ... [/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]All 11 related[/SIZE] - [SIZE=-1]Related web pages[/SIZE]



there is one other article where she is quoted I need to go back and find.

Here is the other article:

SEEK KNIFE IN DEBBIE DEATH

[SIZE=-1]Pay-Per-View - Chicago Tribune - ProQuest Archiver[SIZE=-1] - Feb 16, 1966[/SIZE]
[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Mrs. Warren Stark, who lives with her husband and nine chil- dren just north of the Schofield home, described the teacher as "a very good, religious man ... [/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]All 11 related[/SIZE] - [SIZE=-1]Related web pages[/SIZE]


Who were the Stark family, and why don't they appear on the 1964 or 1968 maps?

In both the 1964 and 1968 Maps it looks like there are two squares indicating buildings or homes ( not sure if they marked all buildings or just the main residence on these maps) on the Schofield family farm. Could the Stark family have lived in the residence which appears on the area marked SUB on the 1968 map and the square which is more north of the two on the farm in 66?

From this article (Seek Knife in Debbie Death) Mrs. Stark goes on and on about how good of a guy LS was. The one thing she said that I hadn't heard before was that LS taught her son in first grade at St. Lukes Elementary School in Carol Stream. I thought that LS's teaching position at the Benjamin school was his first teaching position.

And Mrs. Stark said the night Debbie was murdered she remembered seeing the Schofield car in the driveway of the Schofield home about 6:00 p.m. Just from reading this I would think it meant JS's car considering that LS doesn't live there anymore but who knows maybe LS went there all the time on his way home. The only thing it says in the article is that her and her husband along with their 9 children live just north of the Schofields. It was quite strange how this article pushed the fact that LS and his family were really liked in the community. It even goes as far as to say that many of the people in Carol Stream declined to discuss this case and pulled down their blinds and refused to admit newsmen.

 

[shadowangel]

I wonder how she felt about LSs own statements that he was sick, had sexual problems, shouldn't be out on the street, etc... Considering that she had 6 girls herself (from a 1995 pay to view article blurb, discussing two of the daughters who were state softball hall-of-famers).

 

[Abbey5]

A brief summuary from the Chicago Tribune article "Coroner's Inquest Is Informed How Debbie Met Her Death" Feb. 20, 1966.

Her death was officially entered into Dupage County records as a homicide by persons unknown.

LS was only mentioned briefly at the inquest because he was the last one to see her...between 5:10-5:20 p.m. He was not at the inquest because he was being held in a basement cell of the county jail.

Debbie was found about 10:35 p.m.

LS was Debbie's teacher the previous year.

AV, a sophomore at Univ. of Wisc. told of finding the body after he joined the search when he heard around the neighborhood that Debbie had been picked up by someone in a white car.

Det. Robert Wilson stated that Debbie's finger and palm prints had been taken along with a sample of her hair.

It did snow that Friday night and Saturday. The search was stopped and Sheriff Lynch did not know when they would resume. He did say that any clues in open fields may be wiped out by melting snow.

LS was spending time reading a Bible and other books his wife sent to him.

 

[Cubby]

The stab wounds went through her blouse but not her overcoat and virtually all were made with a upward thrust. HU! Upward thrust! Could she have been killed by a young person. Someone posted that the school has up to 8th grade.

I copied and pasted the snippet above from another post because I do not know how to quote a piece of a post.

To answer your question..... when you want to quote a snippet, you can do one of two things. Either hit the quote button on the bottom of the page which will quote the entire post. Then you can cut the area's you want to cut. ( sometimes I will add respectfully snipped when I do that ) Just make sure the [/quote] is still at the beginning and end of what you want quoted.

or, just cut and past the area you want to quote... and where the choices are for bold underline etc.... the 3rd choice from the right is the quote box.. you can highlight what you want quoted and hit that box. Then above the qoute add the user name.... That is how I do it.... I never ever did figure out how to use the multi quote this message...

Adding this here instead of off the forum so others who have the same question might see it.

TY!

 

[Cubby]

From this article (Seek Knife in Debbie Death) Mrs. Stark goes on and on about how good of a guy LS was. The one thing she said that I hadn't heard before was that LS taught her son in first grade at St. Lukes Elementary School in Carol Stream. I thought that LS's teaching position at the Benjamin school was his first teaching position.

And Mrs. Stark said the night Debbie was murdered she remembered seeing the Schofield car in the driveway of the Schofield home about 6:00 p.m. Just from reading this I would think it meant JS's car considering that LS doesn't live there anymore but who knows maybe LS went there all the time on his way home. The only thing it says in the article is that her and her husband along with their 9 children live just north of the Schofields. It was quite strange how this article pushed the fact that LS and his family were really liked in the community. It even goes as far as to say that many of the people in Carol Stream declined to discuss this case and pulled down their blinds and refused to admit newsmen.

BBM. In a small tightknit community as this certainly was, I can see this happening. JS married into the Klein family.... I am going to guess, that some of the mistrust of LE from the City of Chicago carried over to the burbs.... This is interesting to know, because it is very likely that when LE went to investigate this case they met the same reception as newsman did. It would help explain why we didn't see much happen after not getting the indictment.

I've heard of St. Lukes. It might have been LS was a part time teacher or a sub there... in any case, still good info to have.

TY!

 

[Cubby]

From Abbey's post above:

LS was only mentioned briefly at the inquest because he was the last one to see her...between 5:10-5:20 p.m. He was not at the inquest because he was being held in a basement cell of the county jail.

Just to tell you all how sleep deprived I am at the moment. Instead of reading 'basement' cell of the county jail, I read amusement cell of the county jail. I can only imagine how amused LS must have been during his visit.... ok, I think I am getting slap happy and need some sleep.

 

[Cubby]

As I change the search parameters, I'm finding a few bits and pieces here and there... I found an article (a blog entry, actually) mentioning a presentation by a McHenry County historian discussing crime in the area just a couple of weeks ago. The murder of Sally K was mentioned, as was the involvement of Macek.
I'm not sure of the accuracy of the historian's sources, though, as its stated that Macek is still imprisoned.

Here is a link to the article.

http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we...rpage=10&p_sort=YMD_date:D&xcal_useweights=no

I haven't had time to register and read it yet, but I think we should still see what kind of research was done on Macek.

Imo there are too many similiarities between Sally K's murder and Debbies murder to not explore this possibility.

-They were murdered and found two miles apart, both on Lies Road - despite the murders occuring 6 years apart. .

-Both girls had stab wounds to there eyes.

-The person convicted of murdering Sally K, Robert Otto Macek, had a white car. The last person Debbie was seen talking too had a white car.

-The timeline of Maceks criminal history coincide with the year of Debbies murder. The guy was already in trouble prior to 1966. He was also 18 in 1966 so we can't rule him out as being too young to have committed Debbies murder in 1966.

-The ages of Maceks victims range from 3 to adult, so can't rule him out based on the age range of his victims.

I would like to know if DuPage ever compared Debbies case to Sally's. Sadly, I have a gut feeling they may not have compared the two.

1)Because they were convinced LS was the perp, so I don't know what if any other possiblities they explored.

2)Because there was almost no news regarding Debbies case in the media after the failure to indict LS. the only further news was regarding the libel/slander lawsuit LS filed.

3)I think if Debbies murder was compared to Sally's we would have found evidence of that in the media articles regarding Sally's case.....

I would like to discuss this with DuPage.... and I going to call them and see if I can't find the name of the person Jack spoke to so while the person who is reviewing the case, can put ROM on the radar here too.

 

[Cubby]

I put a call into DuPage, got a name but have to call back after 3 because the person I need to speak with isn't in yet. Will do that later this afternoon.