Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #122

[Charlot123]

Do you think he got angry enough to kill them because they 'dissed' him? Do you think he found them lacking in respect for him and that's what infuriated him and prompted him to kill them? Kind of like, 'oh, you think I'm a wuss, well, I'll show you', that sort of thing?
That sounds plausible to me.
Did they diss him longterm or do you think it was more spur of the moment? Just asking for your opinion/impression.

A very interesting question, and I am on the fence here. He seems to be wearing strange stuff under his clothes, someone said, “a deer kill kit”. If a person appears dressed this way on a bridge, it means, contemplation. So, not random. And yet I don’t know if he targeted the girls, or just wanted to kill someone that day, or merely role played.

And this is exactly the part that seems to be “the twist” to me. If I were to tell a story to myself, I’d say, BG dreamed of being a serial killer, collected the clothes, walked in them around his house, wore them when hunting animals, maybe even developed signatures when training on animals. Then one sunny day, he took his attire out of mothballs, to air it, so to say, the girls maybe laughed and took a video of this scarecrow, he got mad and killed them. He is a lunatic to start with, and then, succumbs to anger when he is ”dissed”.

And yet, the local sheriff said directly that the episode was “isolated to the persons”. Targeted. Some other elements vaguely indicate the same. (Libby resetting her phone, for example, so close to the murders in time).

It is as if two different plot lines, a guy pretending to be a serial killer with random victims, and a very real, targeted, attack, converged that day on Monon High Bridge.

JMO - it might change, but this is how it feels.

ISP should clean the neighborhood.

 

[Ozoner]

When I read stories like this, I have to take the possibility that BG could be a cop or former cop seriously. That profession does attract some sadistic people, although most are weeded out soon enough.
2 IMPD officers arrested on separate incidents

 

[tresir2012]

POI are always online hunting for kids, wherever kids have access to programs to chat or interact with others that is an opportunity to do this and groom them then meet up with them. My daughter used to be on ROBLOX and I would pull up a chair beside her, she would just stare at me, I knew that she was up to something and there was more than likely pimps of sex trafficking on these sites trying to groom these kids or girls into the sex trade, then bully and threaten them if they tell or leave they can get pics of them and blackmail them. Better to not allow this kind of communication and if you do educate your kids on POI online and sex trafficking. My daughter grew out of Roblox but I could see how that and other programs like that, that are popular could create issues with safety. Parents should always be present when kids are on the internet and if they cant be certain programs should not be used. These predators are professionals when it comes to luring and grooming kids especially online, as they pretend they are kids themselves.

I think you probably mean not POI but I agree with you.

 

[California Sunset]

When I read stories like this, I have to take the possibility that BG could be a cop or former cop seriously. That profession does attract some sadistic people, although most are weeded out soon enough.
2 IMPD officers arrested on separate incidents

Yes, you'd hope they get weeded out, but they don't.Not enough of them and not soon enough.
Someone told me about a friend married to a surgeon. That guy was sadistic. We talked about doctors, surgeons in general, and apparently they get a 'God complex'. Once she and I talked about surgeons, I ran across more information.
I wouldn't rule out doctors, and I don't know if anyone suggested that profession or not, but honestly? In my honest opinion, you cannot rule out any profession.

 

[Ozoner]

Yes, you'd hope they get weeded out, but they don't.Not enough of them and not soon enough.
Someone told me about a friend married to a surgeon. That guy was sadistic. We talked about doctors, surgeons in general, and apparently they get a 'God complex'. Once she and I talked about surgeons, I ran across more information.
I wouldn't rule out doctors, and I don't know if anyone suggested that profession or not, but honestly? In my honest opinion, you cannot rule out any profession.

Certain professions seem to attract psychopaths. Many surgeons, cops, ministers, politicians, entertainers, and college professors are psychopaths, to give a few examples.

 

[tresir2012]

That, or they could have gotten down to the road and simply walked to Abby's home or a neighbor's house on C.R. 625.

They didn't know how close they were to Abby's house, according to interviews.

I don't believe they did not know how close they were to Abbey's house. These girls were 13 and 14 and had to know this IMO. Abby was not supposed to be on the bridge yet she was on there and photographed by Libby.

 

[PingTheRouter]

Certain professions seem to attract psychopaths. Many surgeons, cops, ministers, politicians, entertainers, and college professors are psychopaths, to give a few examples.

power and control

 

[SAMS]

Hmmmm, I don't know what to say other than in my experience, Chicago/Wisconsin/Upstate New York all sound the same to me. Western Massachusetts sounds similar to this accent, to me. Western Mass doesn't have the same accent as Eastern Mass/Boston. I'm former military, and a linguist. I lost most of my accent in language school, and living all over. But some people that pay attention can figure out where I grew up. Pittsburgh does not have the same accent as Wisconsin/Chicago/Illinois. I don't remember much about Michigan, but yeah, Indiana has that too. It's a lake accent, I think. It goes along the southern Great Lakes. I don't know how it compares to the states south of those.

MOO I’m from Chicago and live in NY. I can tell you the accents are no where near close IMO

 

[MistyWaters]

I love this, but this was posted in 2018. I am confused, have they mentioned anything about it since then? ty

Not that I’ve noticed. But the crime scene and forensics collected at the time haven’t changed since 2018. I’d be surprised if all the same investigators and other specialists within the multi-agency task force have been in place over the 3+ year period. Why this case isn’t solved yet isn’t due to the fact that the murders occurred outside a small town, lack of experience or access to modern forensic tools etc IMO.

But what I do wonder - for example, Carter is superintendent of ISP based in Indianapolis, obviously chosen as the public spokesperson of the multi-agency task force. I’m curious if all the other independent units involved (Sheriff and Prosecutor Carroll County, Delphi Police Chief, FBI, etc) are as collectively cohesive in their theories and direction of the investigation as it might appear.

 

[IceIce9]

I was raised in western Michigan. As a grown adult I have lived in southern Michigan for 48 years. I worked with a man from Findley, Ohio....this man has been deceased for quite some time. The minute I heard BG's voice...I thought it sounded like the man raised in northern Ohio. Having spent lots of time in Fort Wayne...I feel he could also be from northern Indiana. I do not hear southern Michigan.
MOO

I’ve lived in Indiana, northwest Ohio (actually worked in Findlay) and Illinois. I hear Indiana or Ohio in his voice, not so much Illinois.

 

[IceIce9]

Hmmmm, I don't know what to say other than in my experience, Chicago/Wisconsin/Upstate New York all sound the same to me. Western Massachusetts sounds similar to this accent, to me. Western Mass doesn't have the same accent as Eastern Mass/Boston. I'm former military, and a linguist. I lost most of my accent in language school, and living all over. But some people that pay attention can figure out where I grew up. Pittsburgh does not have the same accent as Wisconsin/Chicago/Illinois. I don't remember much about Michigan, but yeah, Indiana has that too. It's a lake accent, I think. It goes along the southern Great Lakes. I don't know how it compares to the states south of those.

I’ve lived in Chicago and I frequently work in Wisconsin. A Wisconsin accent is totally different than a Chicago accent, IMO.

I’ve often thought about how different Chicago and Milwaukee residents speak, for two cities that are not too far apart.

 

[flashy09]

I’m from northern lower Michigan, and BG’s accent is normal midwestern. He sounds like anyone I know.

So I am from a state that is one of the most neutral in accents and any accent really jumps out at me. It's definitely a "country" midwest accent IMO. That might sound snooty, but I hear this accent all day. I now live near Indiana and also spend a lot of time in northern Michigan...I didn't think Michigan hearing him, to me he has more of a southern sound...not a deep "y'all" type southern, but rural Indiana, Kentucky. He sounds exactly like I would expect someone from a small town in Indiana to sound like. The only thing that doesn't match with me is the new sketch and his voice. I hear thick jowls, years of smoking, age.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Not that I’ve noticed. But the crime scene and forensics collected at the time haven’t changed since 2018. I’d be surprised if all the same investigators and other specialists within the multi-agency task force have been in place over the 3+ year period. Why this case isn’t solved yet isn’t due to the fact that the murders occurred outside a small town, lack of experience or access to modern forensic tools etc IMO.

But what I do wonder - for example, Carter is superintendent of ISP based in Indianapolis, obviously chosen as the public spokesperson of the multi-agency task force. I’m curious if all the other independent units involved (Sheriff and Prosecutor Carroll County, Delphi Police Chief, FBI, etc) are as collectively cohesive in their theories and direction of the investigation as it might appear.

I've been watching the DNA forensics on another case, and the reality is that it is a very loooong process. There is all sorts of bureaucracy, and with precious few resources and the expense, it has to be justified an approved by multiple layers of officials. Familial testing, which one would think is fast and cheap, would be the first path; but it isn't. It seems to take a congressional act to get it done.

We have the technology, we need to cut through the bureaucracy, considering it's a public safety issue. We know the violence of this crime suggests this wasn't his first, nor will it likely be his last (unless we apprehend him ASAP).

If any of Libby or Abby's family is reading this - perhaps this is a new bill that you can help advocate for; automatic familial DNA testing in murder cases.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Alphafuzz]

I've been watching the DNA forensics on another case, and the reality is that it is a very loooong process. There is all sorts of bureaucracy, and with precious few resources and the expense, it has to be justified an approved by multiple layers of officials. Familial testing, which one would think is fast and cheap, would be the first path; but it isn't. It seems to take a congressional act to get it done.

We have the technology, we need to cut through the bureaucracy, considering it's a public safety issue. We know the violence of this crime suggests this wasn't his first, nor will it likely be his last (unless we apprehend him ASAP).

If any of Libby or Abby's family is reading this - perhaps this is a new bill that you can help advocate for; automatic familial DNA testing in murder cases.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Well said as always. Let's help make it so.

 

[Charlot123]

Yes, you'd hope they get weeded out, but they don't.Not enough of them and not soon enough.
Someone told me about a friend married to a surgeon. That guy was sadistic. We talked about doctors, surgeons in general, and apparently they get a 'God complex'. Once she and I talked about surgeons, I ran across more information.
I wouldn't rule out doctors, and I don't know if anyone suggested that profession or not, but honestly? In my honest opinion, you cannot rule out any profession.

I did. I even looked up hospitals and medical departments around Delphi. To my surprise, there were enough.

I come from the family of doctors in several generations. And the ones who could not be doctors, because they were uneducated farmers, ended up self-taught vets, so I can observe the traits running through generations. First, they say that about 1/4 of medical school students have OCD, and it makes sense. For the job, it is good. But OCD is tightly linked with the fear of losing control, so think of where it leads you from there.

About surgeons, they have not “God complex”, but “Savior’s complex”. It is different, because this is what probably prompts people to become surgeons, but they can get a chip on the shoulder, too. Your friend’s acquaintance’s husband is extreme, but it is an interesting area to discuss.

 

[sunshineray]

It was actually from a channel called Michael Katt. The video is called "CeCe Moore Delphi Indiana Needs Your Help!!" He has been making observations about the case for a while and this was a direct plea to her to which she responded positively. I hope something comes of it. Im really glad to hear they sent more evidence. Let's hope for the best. Thanks for posting the information.

It was an article about CeCe Moore I saw and also Dr. Barbara Rae-Venter has also taught LE the gene detection methods Moore uses also. Edit: I think it was Dr. Rae-Venter who pioneered those methods.

 

[sunshineray]

With Indiana Packers processing 17,300 pigs per day....swine is brought in from all over the country.......not just from the nearby pig farmers. MOO

Man that's a lot of bacon!! Has that plant re-opened yet, if you know?

 

[crhedBngr]

Man that's a lot of bacon!! Has that plant re-opened yet, if you know?

Yes, it has.

Indiana Packers to reopen Delphi meat processing plant

 

[JnRyan]

Do you think he got angry enough to kill them because they 'dissed' him? Do you think he found them lacking in respect for him and that's what infuriated him and prompted him to kill them? Kind of like, 'oh, you think I'm a wuss, well, I'll show you', that sort of thing?
That sounds plausible to me.
Did they diss him longterm or do you think it was more spur of the moment? Just asking for your opinion/impression.

I've thought of that. One scenario that occurred to me is that they may have giggled about something totally unrelated to him at the time and he took it to mean they were talking about him - his mannerisms, dress or whatever. In that respect, the crime scene might appear as if the murder was personal even if he had never seen the girls before. I do believe it is possible he saw them earlier elsewhere on the trails and they saw him. It is possible that if they saw him earlier and then on the bridge his demeanor was entirely different this could have been what bothered Liberty.

 

[JnRyan]

When I read stories like this, I have to take the possibility that BG could be a cop or former cop seriously. That profession does attract some sadistic people, although most are weeded out soon enough.
2 IMPD officers arrested on separate incidents

The East Area Rapist/Original Night Stalker (EAR/ONS, now called the Golden State Killer) was a police officer at one time.