Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #12

[SouthAussie]

Full list of Israeli-held prisoners to be released is published. Names, ages & offences list Example attached below.

***Note**** I had to hit the "translate" button 4 times before it did it.

https://www.gov.il/he/Departments/DynamicCollectors/is-db?skip=0

View attachment 462954

Not too many of them have actually been prosecuted. Lots of "under arrest" ... some for extended periods of time, some are relatively new-ish arrests.

imo

 

[Mex]

"British-Israeli whose father, 83, ​

is held by Hamas blasts 'psychological torture'​

of the terror group's partial hostage release and says she fears her parent won't​

'last much longer'."​

View attachment 462957

British-Israeli whose father is held by Hamas blasts terror group

Sharone Lifschitz has been waiting like the families of the other 239 hostages held for news of an agreement which will bring an end to their unbearable heartache.

www.dailymail.co.uk

It is the unjustness of war with innocents becoming pawns. The only solution is an inclusive peace .

A four day suspension of hostilities proves it can be done if the motive is strong enough. And if the killing can be interrupted if for four days logic dictates it can be done for much longer than that if the motivation is peace.

 

[margarita25]

Not too many of them have actually been prosecuted. Lots of "under arrest" ... some for extended periods of time, some are relatively new-ish arrests.

imo

Interesting.

 

[Vern]

Not too many of them have actually been prosecuted. Lots of "under arrest" ... some for extended periods of time, some are relatively new-ish arrests.

imo

I'm gathering that:
Prisoner type: Judging
Means they've been convicted.

Those showing Prisoner Type: Detained as not having been convicted, but the vast majority of them have arrest dates within the past 12-13 months. Most of them are much more recently.

Perhaps that's how long it takes a case to make it's way through the Israeli system? I've no idea their standard arrest to court/trial time, but if that were here in Canada we'd consider it speedy.

I do see a couple who've been "Detained" longer --- with Affiliation being listed as "HZ" (Hezbollah) or Hamas with terrorism, explosive & similar type charges against them.

One specifcly also has "entering the country illegally" with an "HZ" affiliation. Does this mean that Lebanon is going to see some of it's terrorists released too?? If so, I find that very concerning.

 

[SouthAussie]

I'm gathering that:
Prisoner type: Judging
Means they've been convicted.

Those showing Prisoner Type: Detained as not having been convicted, but the vast majority of them have arrest dates within the past 12-13 months. Most of them are much more recently.

Perhaps that's how long it takes a case to make it's way through the Israeli system? I've no idea their standard arrest to court/trial time, but if that were here in Canada we'd consider it speedy.

I do see a couple who've been "Detained" longer --- with Affiliation being listed as "HZ" (Hezbollah) or Hamas with terrorism, explosive & similar type charges against them.

One specifcly also has "entering the country illegally" with an "HZ" affiliation. Does this mean that Lebanon is going to see some of it's terrorists released too?? If so, I find that very concerning.

The ID types are interesting also. Some are "territories", some are "blue". Are the blue IDs the ones with the most serious crimes? I notice some of those crimes are terrorism, serious bodily harm, weapons.

And they show their organizational affiliations .... GAP, Hamas, 'with no' (presumably meaning unaffiliated?).

 

[Vern]

I've gone through all 300 on the list now.

There's only 9 on the entire list whose sole offence is "stone throwing" and all seem to be recent.

There are a lot of other "stone throwing" charges on the list though so apparentl a common thing to do there, but it would be a misnomer to infer that these were all a majority of young kids locked up for solely for "stone throwing".

Most of them have other charges as well:
- Stone Throwing/Rioting/Throwing Incindiary Devices
- Stone Throwing / Laying an IED
- Stone Throwing / Posession of ammunition and weapons
- Stone Throwing/Throwing of Bombs and Incidiary Devices
- and ... a mere 14 year old: Stone Throwing/Manufacturing of Explosives

14yo. SMH.

 

[margarita25]

I've gone through all 300 on the list now.

There's only 9 on the entire list whose sole offence is "stone throwing" and all seem to be recent.

There are a lot of other "stone throwing" charges on the list though so apparentl a common thing to do there, but it would be a misnomer to infer that these were all a majority of young kids locked up for solely for "stone throwing".

Most of them have other charges as well:
- Stone Throwing/Rioting/Throwing Incindiary Devices
- Stone Throwing / Laying an IED
- Stone Throwing / Posession of ammunition and weapons
- Stone Throwing/Throwing of Bombs and Incidiary Devices
- and ... a mere 14 year old: Stone Throwing/Manufacturing of Explosives

14yo. SMH.

Yeah, several weeks ago, iirc it was before Israel conducted their ground operation, I saw a news video, likely posted upstream, of young males throwing stones at the Israeli soldiers, towards the base, I think it was along the border, iirc. I saw some of those stone throwers get shot.

One might say, seems a little harsh, well what else do you expect to happen when you attack military in the middle of a war…it’s just like outwardly attacking a cop in the US, be prepared to get shot.

 

[Vern]

Yeah, several weeks ago, iirc it was before Israel conducted their ground operation, I saw a news video, likely posted upstream, of young males throwing stones at the Israeli soldiers, towards the base, I think it was along the border, iirc. I saw some of those stone throwers get shot.

One might say, seems a little harsh, well what else do you expect to happen when you attack military in the middle of a war…it’s just like outwardly attacking a cop in the US, be prepared to get shot.

They did shoot one of them.

Here's my military perspective: I want to go home too. I always have the right to self-defence.

That kid threw 3 before he was shot and he was moving closer to the troops as he did ... how was the IDF suposed to know the next one wasn't a grenade? One actually has to be within a close range for the grenade to do damage ... so if you're moving in and throwing stones at me to make me feel "comfortable that they are just stones" ... what happens to me when the one you throw when I allow you to get close enough - isn't.

War sucks. It does. The fact we aren't all born with ESP for things like this sucks even more.

 

[Dotta]

"Israel will receive first freed Gaza hostages tomorrow as part of​

four-day truce -​

but its own politicians warn deal is​

'a dangerous precedent' that plays into Hamas's hands."​

Anguish for families as they wait to learn if children will be freed

Israel will receive the first set of hostages from Gaza tomorrow during a four-day truce with Hamas, Israeli Foreign Minister Eli Cohen said.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[SouthAussie]

Yeah, several weeks ago, iirc it was before Israel conducted their ground operation, I saw a news video, likely posted upstream, of young males throwing stones at the Israeli soldiers, towards the base, I think it was along the border, iirc. I saw some of those stone throwers get shot.

One might say, seems a little harsh, well what else do you expect to happen when you attack military in the middle of a war…it’s just like outwardly attacking a cop in the US, be prepared to get shot.

One 18 year old got a year and 2 months in prison for "handing stones" (that was the only charge). I guess he was supplying the stones?

The stone throwing seems to be a super common part of the offences. Just like during the Troubles in Ireland .. stone throwing, and homemade bombs.
I just read a piece (in the previously mentioned book) about the IRA placing 13 bombs in a busy district at 2pm on a sunny arvo, timed to go off 3 minutes apart, one after another. You can imagine the mayhem those bombs caused. Some people ran from one bomb right into another bomb minutes later.

imo

 

[sds71]

Israeli news anchor reads the names of Israelis on a list of 50 hostages set to be released during a 4 day truce, beginning tomorrow.

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[Vern]

One 18 year old got a year and 2 months in prison for "handing stones". I guess he was supplying the stones?

The stone throwing seems to be a super common part of the offences. Just like during the Troubles in Ireland .. stone throwing, and homemade bombs.
I just read a piece (in the previously mentioned book) about the IRA placing 13 bombs in a busy district at 2pm on a sunny arvo, timed to go off 3 minutes apart, one after another. You can imagine the mayhem those bombs caused. Some people ran from one bomb right into another bomb minutes later.

imo

Perhaps he had previous conviction(s)?

The charges listed are what they are currently being held under. Given the tender ages of some of the incindiary device throwers, the IED Placer/ST (16) and the Explosives Manufacturer/ST (14), it wouldn't shock or surprise me if the 18yo you speak of had priors and ergo the sentence.

 

[Katrinepa]

SBM

I assume you mean WWIII, as WWII has been over since 1945.

If Hamas had not “pushed across” Israel’s border, we wouldn’t be having to have this conversation. IMO Israel is pushing back, as they must after Hamas breached their sovereign border in order to commit atrocities against innocents. Innocents who were unaware and couldn’t protect themselves or their families.

It is in fact similar in some ways to Putin. Are you upset that the Ukrainians are fighting back, too?

imo

WWIII absolutely. As for Borders, look at the map of the region before Israel was created. The IDF has pushed back the agreed lines, and kicked Palestinians out of their homes, taking over their land, for some years now under Netanyahu. There is a very long sad and violent history here. Ukraine is another story, and Putin is evil. Ukraine has a long history of 'ownership', and of course they should be allowed to govern themselves, as a European country-not Communist. Choosing War is horrific and everyone loses in the end.

 

[JennieM]

BREAKING​

Pause in fighting to start at 10am tomorrow, BBC understands​

Tom Bateman
Reporting from Jerusalem

The BBC understands the agreement is for the pause in fighting to start tomorrow at 10:00 local time (08:00 GMT), with the first release of hostages taking place around noon.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-67481139

 

[JennieM]

This is not war, this is terrorism, says Pope of Israel-Hamas conflict​

Davide Ghiglione
Reporting from Rome

Pope Francis held separate meetings with Israeli families of hostages held by Hamas and Palestinians with relatives in Gaza.

He said the Israel-Hamas conflict had gone beyond war, becoming “terrorism”, and emphasised that “both sides are suffering.”

Speaking at his weekly general audience in St Peter’s Square, shortly after the meetings in his residence, the pontiff said: ”They suffer so much and I heard how both sides suffer.”

He added: "Please let us go forward for peace... My blessing goes to all."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-67481139

 

[margarita25]

9 hours ago:

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[margarita25]

Israeli news anchor reads the names of Israelis on a list of 50 hostages set to be released during a 4 day truce, beginning tomorrow.

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Oh my goodness!! Please let this materialize.

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——

As Israel and Hamas Move Toward Hostages’ Release, Families Wait With Hope and Fear (Published 2023)

Families don’t yet know if their loved ones will be returned when the planned cease-fire takes effect.

www.nytimes.com

“As Israel and Hamas indicated that they were preparing a cease-fire to free 50 hostages, some families of those abducted to Gaza last month were grappling with conflicting emotions: a growing optimism that their loved ones would return that was chilled by a gnawing fear that the deal might collapse — or worse, that they might be left behind.

“If we’ve been on a roller coaster, now we’re going up,” said Gili Roman, whose sister Yarden Roman was taken hostage from Be’eri, a Gaza border kibbutz, during the Hamas-led attack on Oct. 7. “The fear is that the higher we go, the farther we’ll fall. There’s a lot of anxiety.”“

*more at link, Bibas family member speaks

 

[JennieM]

7m ago

The Syrian army said on Wednesday that Israel launched aerial strikes on outposts in the vicinity of Damascus but that nobody was injured or killed.

The statement said the rockets were fired from the Golan Heights. Reuters reports that the statement gave no further details, and that the Israeli military declined to comment.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-67481139

 

[margarita25]

These teenaged boys throwing stones is not something to be minimized.

Teenagers who throw stones at Israelis easily grow to become men who murder Israelis.. It’s the identical impulse to commit violence against those whom they’ve been trained to hate since birth.

Remember that in Biblical times, people were stoned to death.

It’s not a harmless prank or just kids being mischievous. It’s kids being trained.

IMO

Not to mention it really can hurt you and is considered a weapon/assault. I had a man chasing me one time, my violent domestic abuser ex, trying to kill me actually. He was gaining on me so I picked up a stone and threw it at him as hard as I could. It broke his rib and he went down.

 

[Dotta]

Not to mention it really can hurt you and is considered a weapon/assault. I had a man chasing me one time, my violent domestic abuser ex, trying to kill me actually. He was gaining on me so I picked up a stone and threw it at him as hard as I could. It broke his rib and he went down.

OMG!
Thank goodness you didn't kill him.
Imagine spending life in prison!!