Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #5

[Chimera]

Very good stuff here. I hope it is not lost on world media.

@PrairieWind : Thanks for the link.

So what I'm understanding is the reluctance comes from people of Gaza wanting permanent settling in Egypt, and not those who have dual citizenship and want to return to their countries of origin ?
That's why I mentioned some countries maybe fearing more trouble or unrest if they permanently house Palestinians who do not have dual citizenship with another nation ?
Omo.

 

[Friday Fan]

Confusion Over Gaza Hospital Blast Shows Challenge for Journalists Covering Israel-Hamas Conflict

News outlets have issued guidelines over how to describe Hamas and the Oct. 7 attack on Israel.

www.wsj.com

New York Times, Washington Post issue guidelines over how to describe Hamas and Oct. 7 attack on Israel​

​

On Tuesday, the New York Times and The Wall Street Journal put out alerts saying a blast at a Gaza hospital was caused by an Israeli airstrike, killing more than 500 people, citing Palestinian officials.

It soon became clear it wasn't going to end there.

I can't access the article myself.

Paywall, but you can listen to 2 minute audio

 

[Momoffourboys]

An overwhelming number of bodies passed through the IDF's casualty identification center. Now, the volunteers are trying to speak about the terrifying sights they were exposed to

https://x.com/kann_news/status/1714943278842368152?s=20

 

[Cedars]

There is something else going on here that may have been answered in my response to another post : Some countries seem to fear these people; maybe due to the actions of some of them, but not all ?
Omo.

Definitely not. Arab countries support the cause of the Palestinians to have their own state, as was intended 75 years ago. They fear that residents of Gaza will be driven off their territory and never be able to return.

"President Abdel-Fattah El-Sisi said Thursday that the Palestinian people in the Gaza Strip must stay steadfast and "remain on their land," warning of "the liquidation" of the Palestinian cause...The Palestinian cause is the issue of all Arabs"
https://www.sis.gov.eg/Story/187293...oing-for-de-escalation-in-Gaza-war?lang=en-us

This is known as the "two state solution", where both Israel and Palestine have their own countries. It's been the subject of international attempts at negotiation for decades.

JMO

 

[Chimera]

Definitely not. Arab countries support the cause of the Palestinians to have their own state, as was intended 75 years ago. They fear that residents of Gaza will be driven off their territory and never be able to return.

"President Abdel-Fattah El-Sisi said Thursday that the Palestinian people in the Gaza Strip must stay steadfast and "remain on their land," warning of "the liquidation" of the Palestinian cause...The Palestinian cause is the issue of all Arabs"
https://www.sis.gov.eg/Story/187293/Sisi-Palestinians-must-'remain-on-their-land',-contacts-ongoing-for-de-escalation-in-Gaza-war?lang=en-us

This is known as the "two state solution", where both Israel and Palestine have their own countries. It's been the subject of international attempts at negotiation for decades.

JMO

There has to be some apprehension in other nations that do not want Palestinians, if Hamas is allowed to thrive within the Palestinian residents -- and tbh despite this recent terrible conflict I do not see Palestinians turning against Hamas. Silence from the people of Gaza, so far.
This is what is not changing and it's sad.
The Palestinians can believe in their cause; without supporting any violent organizations like Hamas or independent groups that are causing so much suffering.
Not saying it can't turn around.
The people find strength to turn against their oppressors-- Hamas and co.

Still ... many countries don't seem to want to create a space within their own country for the Palestinians to live there ?
They would not be liquidated if they lived in Jordan, for instance.
The Palestinians could coexist in Jordan and be a thriving member of that nation.
Or other Arab countries could help them by allowing them to create their own area within that country ?
Gaza is small and cramped for that many people; there'd be more space elsewhere.
Omo.

 

[Momoffourboys]

At one New Jersey Jewish school, four families mourn relatives killed in Israel​

Deep ties between Diaspora and Israel highlighted as US Jews feel trauma of family members, friends, former community members and alumni affected by October 7 Hamas massacre​

At one New Jersey Jewish school, four families mourn relatives killed in Israel

Deep ties between Diaspora and Israel highlighted as US Jews feel trauma of family members, friends, former community members and alumni affected by October 7 Hamas massacre

www.timesofisrael.com

 

[Vern]

Is that according to Hamas? We know that Hamas stores weapons in residential areas, and that they are firing their hand made weapons from residential areas. It's quite likely that the missile that fell into a parking lot is not the only faulty Hamas missile.

We know that as soon as Hamas bombs their own people, they immediately released a statement both exaggerating the damage and blaming Israel.

I linked in early this morning a couple of Israeli releases where they took out Hamas Leaders in Rafah. A woman leader in Hamas was one of them.

Another was a man who was also high up on the "Military" wing of Hamas. They took out his apartment in a targetted assasination.

So, legitimate targets.

Here they are again:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714870920479691101

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714883084485525585

 

[cottonweaver]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715022826594283665

 

[Friday Fan]

After Hospital Blast, Headlines Shift With Changing Claims​

After Hospital Blast, Headlines Shift With Changing Claims (Published 2023)

The fast-moving events highlighted the difficulty of covering the war between Israel and Hamas.

www.nytimes.com

From the paywalled article:

Most Western journalists have evacuated the area.
News organizations are not able to be on the ground for eyewitness reporting
The war has generated vast amts of false information
There are so many untrue claims, that people question the true claims.
Media organizations need to be “exceptionally careful” in dealing with news around the Israel-Hamas conflict

 

[Momoffourboys]

Arab diplomats ‘horrified’ by Hamas onslaught but critical of Israel’s response​

Two senior officials say sympathy for Israel dissipated amid IDF operation, fume over Israeli proposals for Egypt and Jordan to take in Gaza refugees​

A pair of senior diplomats representing Arab countries that have ties with Israel told The Times of Israel that their governments were horrified by the scenes that came out of southern Israel after the shock Hamas onslaught on October 7, during which gunmen slaughtered over 1,400 people.

The comments were made on condition of anonymity, as the vast majority of the Arab world has refrained from condemning the Hamas assault, instead preferring to censure attacks on civilians in a general way. Only the United Arab Emirates issued a specific condemnation of Hamas.

While the two diplomats insisted that there is wall-to-wall disapproval among Israel’s Arab allies and beyond of the atrocities committed by Hamas on October 7 — one of them saying his government was “horrified” — they said the attacks prove the failure of Israel’s long-maintained strategy of “ignoring the Palestinian issue.”


MORE: Arab diplomats ‘horrified’ by Hamas onslaught but critical of Israel’s response

 

[cottonweaver]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715019650902245452

extract:

'The volunteers tasked with getting much-needed humanitarian aid into the Gaza Strip from Egypt are holding a sit-in at the Rafah border crossing.

In front of the gates, young men dressed in all black hold up a sign with the words "stationed until relief" painted across it. The day passes as they wait for the green light to come - even praying in the sun as war rages beyond the wall.

As the trucks line up on the sides of the long road that goes straight to Gaza, they make calls back and forth to aid coordinators in Cairo who share their frustration'
One of them is Heba Rashed, the CEO of the Mersal Foundation. Her organisation has been permitted to send trucks with critical care medication, surgical supplies, baby milk and body bags into Gaza.

Days have passed and nothing has got through.

Heba says she watches videos of hospitals brimming with casualties and cries every night knowing the aid is stuck at the border

What is happening at the Gaza-Egypt border?

As trucks line up on the sides of the long road that goes straight to Gaza, they make calls back and forth to aid coordinators in Cairo who share their frustration. They have been told "today or tomorrow" until the border opens for five days.

news.sky.com

 

[Momoffourboys]

Nine British nationals confirmed dead​

Nine British nationals have been confirmed dead and a further seven are missing after Hamas's attacks on 7 October, a Downing Street spokesperson has said.
Some of the missing "are feared to be among the dead or kidnapped", the spokesperson said.
The latest figures come one day after the UK government said at least seven British nationals had been killed in the conflict.

Israel-Gaza latest: 'Some of world's best urban fighters' waiting for Israel - as health crisis on 'brink of explosion' in Gaza

A humanitarian organisation has said the Gaza "health crisis is on the brink of explosion" - as military analyst Philip Ingram tells Sky News that "some of the best urban fighters in the world" are awaiting Israel if and when the ground offensive starts.

news.sky.com

 

[Chimera]

Last video of Harry Potter fan singing a month before Hamas killed her

Noya Dan, a 12-year-old autistic child, and her 80-year-old grandmother Carmela, were among the hundreds of civilians killed when Hamas terrorists attacked Israel on October 7.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Noya Dan - who was autistic - and her 80-year-old grandmother Carmela were among the hundreds of civilians killed by Hamas gunmen when they attacked Israel on October 7.

The video of this young girl singing is heartbreaking.

Rest in peace, Noya and Carmela !

 

[Momoffourboys]

Man attacks woman in possible antisemitic attack inside Manhattan train station: police​

MIDTOWN, Manhattan (WABC) -- Police are looking for a man they say attacked a woman in a hate crime incident in Manhattan.

It happened Saturday, October 14 inside of the 42nd Street and Lexington Avenue Subway Station in Midtown, where authorities say a 29-year-old female was punched in the face by an unknown male.

According to authorities, when the victim asked the attacker why he punched her, he responded, because "you are Jewish" before fleeing the scene.

The victim suffered minor injuries.

The NYPD Hate Crimes Unit is investigating.

Man attacks woman in possible antisemitic attack inside Manhattan train station: police

According to authorities, when the victim asked the attacker why he punched her, he responded, because "you are Jewish" before fleeing the scene.

abc7ny.com

BBM Yes. Very POSSIBLE anti semitic. {eye roll}

 

[Vern]

I believe that the Egyptians are afraid that a trickle will turn into a flood- and that Israel would accelerate the flood like in the past

In 1948, millions of Palestinians left their homes in the course of a war- some voluntarily, some "voluntarily" and others out right expelled by officially tolerated groups of Israeli irregular extremist militias such as the Stern Gang and Irgun.

- Then toss in that nobody really wants refugees anymore.

- Then blend in that and that over the last 80 years, bored, drifting- and heavily armed Palestinian groups have pulled enough big and small "stunts" in neighboring countries to have worn out the welcome mats

Oh I get why no one wants to take in more Palestinians due to the historical issues they've caused in their host nations.

Those are not the people that I'm speaking of in my post.

Egypt is not allowing
Foreign Nationals (non-Palestinans) or
Dual-Palestinian-Foreign Citizens (Palestinians also holding another nations citizenship & passport).

Those two groups above are quite separate and do not fall under the "forced relocation of Palestinians" that Egypt is citing. Nor should "repairs to the Gaza side of the border crossing still being underway" impede persons of these two groups from leaving. It's the road that's damaged. They can walk through the gate. Well, they could --- if Egypt would actually allow them to.

That's my question - why is Egypt making those persons stay in the Gaza?

 

[Momoffourboys]

World Jewish Congress head meets pope to issue plea for Gaza hostages​

The head of the World Jewish Congress meets with Pope Francis in the Vatican, asking the leader of the Catholic Church to help secure the release of hostages held in the Gaza Strip.

The audience between Ronald Lauder and Francis comes as Israel revises up to 203 the number of Israeli and foreign hostages believed held by Hamas, amid the escalating war in Gaza.

“We ask Your Holiness to use your power, to use your strength, to get these hostages released,” the WJC quotes Lauder as telling the 86-year-old pontiff, in a statement. “You may be the only person who has the moral authority to do this.”

World Jewish Congress head meets pope to issue plea for Gaza hostages

* * *

www.timesofisrael.com

 

[cottonweaver]

I like to get my news from lots of sources and BBC is usually among those sources. I know they have been a bit biased against Israel in the past but still I would read they material. But with this incident, the BBC coverage has not just been biased but incredibly inaccurate. I would be outraged if I was British to see what happened to their news service.

Populists and underfunding by the Govt definitely factors in what I see as deficits in their output but you & I may differ in our idea of what the deficits are

 

[Vern]

With dual citizenship, couldn't Egypt then expel them to the other country of citizenship ?
There is something else going on here that may have been answered in my response to another post : Some countries seem to fear these people; maybe due to the actions of some of them, but not all ?
Omo.

They wouldn't have to 'expel' dual-citizens as those waiting and trying to get out of Gaza are trying to get to their homes elsewhere.

For some reason, Egypt has yet to allow them, or any foreign nationals who were in Gaza working on 7/10, to depart the Gaza. That's 12 days ago. I can't figure out why they can't leave as footage show that the gate is clearly accesible and traversible by foot.

There is, I fear, another agenda at play here.

 

[cottonweaver]

Usual cautionaries apply

It's unsourced and I wouldn't want to be a hypocrite by claiming that anonymous briefings to media should be taken as facts

People can argue the toss as to whether Le Point or WashPo are being respnsible in relaying anon briefings that haven't been substantiated, or not....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715029129685270690

 

[Cryptic]

Still ... many countries don't seem to want to create a space within their own country for the Palestinians to live there ?
They would not be liquidated if they lived in Jordan, for instance.
The Palestinians could coexist in Jordan and be a thriving member of that nation.
Or other Arab countries could help them by allowing them to create their own area within that country ?

As with anything in the Middle East, it gets pretty "complex":

- Collectively, Arab countries have accepted several million Palestinian refugees. These refugees have lived in their host nations for generations.

-But today, nobody wants anymore refugees- period. The answer is still "no" even if the refugees are culturally and religiously similar to the potential host nation.

- Palestinians have pulled enough stunts over the years to cause welcome mats to be rolled. Big stunts have included trying to overthrow the Jordanian government.

Some medium stunts were culture clashes. Open alcohol and hash sales, bars, and prostitution were permissible to secular PLO leadership- but very offensive to conservative Shia muslims in Lebanon. PLO leaders also exempted fighters from local prosecution under Lebanese law (sounds provacative, but the US has done that as well) and also exempted them from Lebanese taxes.

Small stunts are what occur the world over when thousands of armed, bored and loosely supervised 18-35 year old men congregate: Some drift into criminal activity, some simply become "unproductive humans", and some just act like jerks.