Jodi Arias Trial: the weekend discussion

[BritsKate]

I also have heard that LWOP easier on victims families since they don't have the appeal process

Perhaps, but Travis' sister has been very outspoken about wanting Jodi to receive the death penalty, fwiw.
http://www.hlntv.com/slideshow/2012/09/25/victims-sister-i-hope-jodi-arias-dies

 

[popsicle]

Since when does an adult female wearing pigtails turn into "the guy is into younger females"? Must have missed that memo! I guess NCIS should stop having Abby wear her hair like this, because any guy that thinks she looks cute is into younger females.
I just asked two of my male friends (in their 20's) what they thought of her hair, they both said its cute. I'm sure just about every guy their age (and not) would say the same thing. It doesn't mean any of them are into younger females!

Crap I think it is cute and I am not into female let alone young females!

 

[popsicle]

I hope not Gitana,I think if the opinions on this forum would give clues to how the jurors might feel ,it is clear that even the ones that DO believe Jodi was used and had a right to be angry at Travis (such as myself) want her to be prosecuted and want justice for Travis.I don't care how much you hate men I don't think there could be anyone on the planet that could believe what Jodi did was justified.Like someone on these threads said awhile back .....slash his tires,not his throat....

Gitana's key words were "never able to get over it". That would hang the jury. IMO especially with all those men on the jury. Here is to hoping they did a really good job at screening this jury.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Bingo! Nope not once in all her version did she ever say a bad word about Travis, as a matter of fact, she said glowing things about him in those interviews with LE

Its amazing to me how these poor wittle 'innocent' women are willing to stay in jail for years when they say it wasnt their fault and are innocent. Oh wait they have to get with their lawyers so they can make something up.:floorlaugh:

Ya know you would think if true they would have rushed to tell LE that huh? But nope.........they are perfectly content to stay behind bars for years.

They really must think most people are stooopid.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I also have heard that LWOP easier on victims families since they don't have the appeal process

Of course it may be easier but if the family wants the defendant to receive death and they do in this case then they are aware that it will go through the appeal process (which will be unsuccessful in this case with so much overwhelming evidence proving guilt.)

What she did and how she did it cries out for the death penalty and that is what she deserves and I hope the jury concurs.



IMO

 

[zoey]

Of course it may be easier but if the family wants the defendant to receive death and they do in this case then they are aware that it will go through the appeal process (which will be unsuccessful in this case with so much overwhelming evidence proving guilt.)

What she did and how she did it cries out for the death penalty and that is what she deserves and I hope the jury concurs.



IMO

ITA. Thatdeach scene was horrific

 

[Keebler]

I hope not Gitana,I think if the opinions on this forum would give clues to how the jurors might feel ,it is clear that even the ones that DO believe Jodi was used and had a right to be angry at Travis (such as myself) want her to be prosecuted and want justice for Travis.I don't care how much you hate men I don't think there could be anyone on the planet that could believe what Jodi did was justified.Like someone on these threads said awhile back .....slash his tires,not his throat....

I do not believe that Travis used Jodi; rather, I think he he had never encountered anyone with behavior as strange as hers. He probably thought he had been clear with her about where their relationship stood but she kept coming around for the occasional 'roll in the hay' and he obliged (like most red-blooded males would do).

He also didn't recognize her creepy behavior as a sign of worse things to come. Those of us on this forum are well aware that this was stalking and that it was a sign that Jodi was unbalanced and probably dangerous. We have seen in countless other cases that things are likely to escalate and become violent.

Travis probably didn't spend a lot of time on WS ;o) and didn't have our perspective. He was in way over his head with a dangerous woman but he had no idea. It's like watching a horror movie and we are all telling the protagonist to run away, don't go in there..but he doesn't see it and walks right into that dark basement.

 

[DenverClipper]

I do not believe that Travis used Jodi; rather, I think he he had never encountered anyone with behavior as strange as hers. He probably thought he had been clear with her about where their relationship stood but she kept coming around for the occasional 'roll in the hay' and he obliged (like most red-blooded males would do).

He also didn't recognize her creepy behavior as a sign of worse things to come. Those of us on this forum are well aware that this was stalking and that it was a sign that Jodi was unbalanced and probably dangerous. We have seen in countless other cases that things are likely to escalate and become violent.

Travis probably didn't spend a lot of time on WS ;o) and didn't have our perspective. He was in way over his head with a dangerous woman but he had no idea. It's like watching a horror movie and we are all telling the protagonist to run away, don't go in there..but he doesn't see it and walks right into that dark basement.

Well said. I agree completely.

 

[claudicici]

Gitana's key words were "never able to get over it". That would hang the jury. IMO especially with all those men on the jury. Here is to hoping they did a really good job at screening this jury.

I really think it would have to be a psychopath like Jodi on the jury that would think not getting over being used justifies murder.I just don't think there is any way the defense can prove self defense and isn't that what the jury will have to look at? No matter how hurt and angry Jodi was when she over-killed Travis , her own life was not in jeopardy before she did what she did.The dropped camera and Travis getting angry story is nonsense IMO and there is no way they can make a jury believe it IMO ( but unfortunately I thought the same about George fishing a dead Caylee out of the family pool as well....)

 

[popsicle]

BritsKate

Yeesh! I think I need to start pulling all nighters just to keep up with the lot of you!

No kidding, which just means we will have to spend more time here to keep up with your great posts and links and well...you get my point!

I think they have the journals in evidence. Defense wanted their handwriting expert to examine them according to Maricopa minutes. http://www.courtminutes.maricopa.gov/docs/Criminal/092010/m4391050.pdf

Thank you for that link!

I just have to say while I feared my ex (he threatened to kill me several times) I honestly never thought he would really hurt me. Until I left. Sometimes I think people can be afraid and still not realize the extent others will go to hurt us. Now I am absolutely petrified of him and fully believe he would murder me in a heartbeat if ever given the opportunity. (One of the reasons I'm living abroad. )

I felt the same way. After I had already lost consciousness, someone interrupted my in-progress murder, now I am a believer. So, my questions are how many times did JA tell Travis she was going to kill him and how far in advance of the murder?

I don't believe her only motive was to kill him until at least the middle of May 2008. I think she wanted his life and all it could offer her. I think she wanted charismatic, charming, gregarious, wealthy, and successful Travis. For me there's an awfully big difference love and obsession. Disordered people (and abusers) very often 'morph' into what their victims greatest desires are to lure their prey. (The 'Prince Charming' personality of many abusive people.)

She wanted those things. That day she came planned and prepared. Well prepared before hand and for afterwards.

I don't believe she was a or either but I do believe she used sex as manipulative tool.

I think she was a total and complete for Travis in trying to seal the deal for a life long commitment with him. I do not know enough to pass judgement on the part. There are all those cash deposits still up in the air for one.

Much of what Travis either did or did not do could be attributed to many who are subjected to abuse. Myself included. It isn't a question of innocence or sainthood but rather if someone was manipulated, coerced, gaslighted, blackmailed, stalked, etc.
(That isn't to say I didn't make poor choices myself or that I was an angel. But many of my decisions made and the very fact I stayed were part and parcel of the psychology behind being abused. Those factors shouldn't negate that I was.) IYKWIM

He was a man who was brutally murdered who was also subjected to psychological abuse perpetrated by a predator in my opinion. No battery is necessary to abuse another.

:banghead:
I can hear the jury already...
"He didn't deserve to die BUT he should have/shouldn't have..."

Respectfully snipped to only address certain points.

I can hear the jury too...
"your Honor, we find the defendant GUILTY" "May we proceed directly to the death chamber from here?" Oh sorry, I dozed off.

All of this is jmo and thoughts.

 

[popsicle]

I really think it would have to be a psychopath like Jodi on the jury that would think not getting over being used justifies murder.I just don't think there is any way the defense can prove self defense and isn't that what the jury will have to look at? No matter how hurt and angry Jodi was when she over-killed Travis , her own life was not in jeopardy before she did what she did.The dropped camera and Travis getting angry story is nonsense IMO and there is no way they can make a jury believe it IMO ( but unfortunately I thought the same about George fishing a dead Caylee out of the family pool as well....)

While I do understand your point, I believe once a person gets hung up on one thing they simply cannot move past that to accept anything else. That is why the other jurors are :banghead: trying to convince them of all the other facts in the case. jmo

 

[Keebler]

I think I read that within about a month and a half after T and J started dating she was baptized into the Morman church. That was a big red flag. That is way too soon to have been able to make such a decision.

She was a chameleon. Adopting the interests of others as her own..."you like Atlas Shrugged? So do I.".."you write motivation messages in your blog, so do I"..."you're a Morman, I'll become one too."

What is that?

 

[claudicici]

Thinking out loud... She "allegedly" slashed his tires WHILE he was visiting a love interest.

Why slash the tires?
To threaten him or the girl? As in lady you are next?
OR don't get involved with him I'm the psycho x?
He cheats on you with me?

IMO end result he gets to spend MORE time with new girl!
He can't exactly leave. and JA looks like a fool.
(man if I did that I'd for sure be arrested! I'd flub up big time.)
I'd think to go and
Slash his tires BEFORE he is supposed to see the other girl!
(unless you know you will get caught)

Wasn't she driving a car he sold her?
How did she know he wouldn't call the cops and refund her $
and take the car back?


Guess it's a good thing I was always too scared to exact revenge on anyone. :blushing:
Well at least until I reached my 40's! lol

OH ~snap! I am no door mat these days!!! :dervish:
I blame it on the HOT FLASHES!!!:steamed:



I kinda side with you. I am not against you in any way.

"Dirty Little Secret" by Linkin Park plays in my head!
~it probably was not even released until after his death.

My ISSUES are (how I personally am understanding it)
JA was just out of a 4 YEAR relationship with a ?divorced man with a child
JA knew Mormon rules/laws/recommendations (sorry not sure what term
to use) I mean no offense.
JA knew they were "friends with benefits" ~ does that ever work?
JA was not a naive "young" girl. ~20
JA was never invited to become a resident at TA's address
JA broke several Laws "allegedly" (if anything we have heard is true)

TA knew Mormon rules and followed them to his satisfaction
TA planned on marrying a Mormon by birth
TA allowed JA to overstay her welcome
TA underestimated her odd visits and did nothing to prevent her
them
TA sold her a car thereby entered a legal contract with
her that "kept her in the picture" for a future
TA was either very "clueless" or afraid to stand up to her
and say enough is enough!

TA was a motivational speaker.
maybe it was him really trying to help her
but YA CAN'T MIX business and pleasure...

I can not understand why he tolerated her!
I just keep thinking she had something on him.
OR she claimed she did and he believed her

Something that kept him from alerting LE and he still allowed her to
come around and played nice with her.

IMO the JA/TA pics seem forced.
maybe I am seeing things.
The body language is not one of
a new couple...
But maybe he can't be too mushy
due to his job and/or faith.

Even the Army gets funny about PDA...

According to Jodi she broke up with him because he was cheating on her.According to Travis he broke up with her.According to Travis in the one public myspace comment on Jodi's wall,she is the hottest thing ....I really think neither one of them was letting go ,Travis because of the sex and Jodi because she kept hoping the sex would eventually lead to more.Travis was conflicted because of his religion thinking what they were doing was "bad" and therefore mad at himself and disrespectful to Jodi.I think he really does not want to be in the pictures with her while she seems thrilled and happy.He wanted her behind doors,not out in the open IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

This is a casebook example of domestic violence homicide. The myth needs to be put to rest that males cannot be abused, psychologically, physically or sexually abused. It happened here in this case.imo.

How many times have we read about cases where the victim told someone else 'he is going to kill me' and it happened? Too many times. And how did they know? Because the abuse and violence was esculating just like in this case with Jodi slashing tires and stalking and winding up sneeking into his home and into his bed while he was sleeping.

Jodi Arias for whatever reason used sex as a tool to control the one she really wanted. Was it because she loved Travis? I highly doubt it. Psychopaths want ownership and dominance not love. After murdering him she goes onto another smuck coyly hoping she will be able to dominate him.

Maybe she knew Travis had never experienced some of the things she so willingly did and new experiences can and often are very exciting since all human beings respond to human touch. Imo she pulled out ever sex trick in the book. Thats all Jodi had and she used it trying to gain ownership of Travis but even the kinky sex didnt work for her and she had nothing more.

Many women and men have lost their good senses when raw sex comes into play. Women have even left very good husbands and their children behind to run to a very bad man that didnt care about her but just the sex. That is why the grass is greener on the other side of the fence because most of the time it is fertilized with nothing but BS. So some men and some women are alike in some aspects.

I understand Travis. I was like him and also a victim of domestic violence at one time by my ex. I shamefully admit, I did have sex with him when he demanded it. I hated it and I did it out of fear and the desperate need to appease a monster who would rage if I did not. It even continued after I moved out and had separated from him. I was just too fearful at that time to say 'no.' He too was stalking me. I knew at that time he was capable of anything. Near the end this was Travis's life with Jodi too imo. He had come across a situation with a dominant overbearing obsessive female who would not take 'no' for an answer no matter how many times he tried to tell her it was over and to leave him alone.

IMO

 

[BritsKate]

I think I read that within about a month and a half after T and J started dating she was baptized into the Morman church. That was a big red flag. That is way too soon to have been able to make such a decision.

She was a chameleon. Adopting the interests of others as her own..."you like Atlas Shrugged? So do I.".."you write motivation messages in your blog, so do I"..."you're a Morman, I'll become one too."

What is that?

Seen their myspace pages yet? They're not exactly the same but the similarities are more than striking, or coincidental, imo.
Jodi: http://www.myspace.com/jodiarias
Travis: http://www.myspace.com/tvalexander

 

[popsicle]

According to Jodi she broke up with him because he was cheating on her.According to Travis he broke up with her.According to Travis in the one public myspace comment on Jodi's wall,she is the hottest thing ....I really think neither one of them was letting go ,Travis because of the sex and Jodi because she kept hoping the sex would eventually lead to more.Travis was conflicted because of his religion thinking what they were doing was "bad" and therefore mad at himself and disrespectful to Jodi.I think he really does not want to be in the pictures with her while she seems thrilled and happy.He wanted her behind doors,not out in the open IMO

I really am not calling you out but can you please link the post for the "hottest thing" comment? I read it before and would like to know the time frame for it as it is important to know for discussion, Than you so much if you know it.

 

[alwaysonmymind]

I've seen some comments like this on JA's MySpace photos. I believe they were around May 08.

I question if this was really him or if she was logging in as him and posting them.

I would link to them but I'm on my phone and not sure how to do it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[popsicle]

This is a casebook example of domestic violence homicide. The myth needs to be put to rest that males cannot be abused, psychologically, physically or sexually abused. It happened here in this case.imo.

How many times have we read about cases where the victim told someone else 'he is going to kill me' and it happened? Too many times. And how did they know? Because the abuse and violence was esculating just like in this case with Jodi slashing tires and stalking and winding up sneeking into his home and into his bed while he was sleeping.

Jodi Arias for whatever reason used sex as a tool to control the one she really wanted. Was it because she loved Travis? I highly doubt it. Psychopaths want ownership and dominance not love. After murdering him she goes onto another smuck coyly hoping she will be able to dominate him.

Maybe she knew Travis had never experienced some of the things she so willingly did and new experiences can and often are very exciting since all human beings respond to human touch. Imo she pulled out ever sex trick in the book. Thats all Jodi had and she used it trying to gain ownership of Travis but even the kinky sex didnt work for her and she had nothing more.

Many women and men have lost their good senses when raw sex comes into play. Women have even left very good husbands and their children behind to run to a very bad man that didnt care about her but just the sex. That is why the grass is greener on the other side of the fence because most of the time it is fertilized with nothing but BS. So some men and some women are alike in some aspects.

I understand Travis. I was like him and also a victim of domestic violence at one time by my ex. I shamefully admit, I did have sex with him when he demanded it. I hated it and I did it out of fear and the desperate need to appease a monster who would rage if I did not. It even continued after I moved out and had separated from him. I was just too fearful at that time to say 'no.' He too was stalking me. I knew at that time he was capable of anything. Near the end this was Travis's life with Jodi too imo. He had come across a situation with a dominant overbearing obsessive female who would not take 'no' for an answer no matter how many times he tried to tell her it was over and to leave him alone.

IMO

Every single word is so so true. Thank You.

 

[KMouse]

This is a casebook example of domestic violence homicide. The myth needs to be put to rest that males cannot be abuse, psychologically, physically or sexually abused. It happened here in this case.imo.

How many times have we read about cases where the victim told someone else 'he is going to kill me' and it happened? Too many times. And how did they know? Because the abuse and violence was esculating just like in this case with Jodi slashing tires and stalking and winding up sneeking into his home and into his bed while he was sleeping.

Jodi Arias for whatever reason used sex as a tool to control the one she really wanted. Was it because she loved Travis? I highly doubt it. Psychopaths want ownership and dominance not love. After murdering him she goes onto another smuck coyly hoping she will be able to dominate him.

Maybe she knew Travis had never experienced some of the things she so willingly did and new experiences can and often are very exciting since all human beings respond to human touch. Imo she pulled out ever sex trick in the book. Thats all Jodi had and she used it trying to gain ownership of Travis but even the kinky sex didnt work for her and she had nothing more.

Many women and men have lost their good senses when raw sex comes into play. Women have even left very good husbands and their children behind to run to a very bad man that didnt care about her but just the sex. That is why the grass is greener on the other side of the fence because most of the time it is fertilized with nothing but BS. So some men and some women are alike in some aspects.

I understand Travis. I was like him and also a victim of domestic violence at one time by my ex. I shamefully admit, I did have sex with him when he demanded it. I hated it and I did it out of fear and the desperate need to appease a monster who would rage if I did not. It even continued after I moved out and had separated from him. I was just too fearful at that time to say 'no.' He too was stalking me. I knew at that time he was capable of anything. Near the end this was Travis's life with Jodi too imo. He had come across a situation with a dominant overbearing obsessive female who would not take 'no' for an answer no matter how many times he tried to tell her it was over and to leave him alone.

IMO

Very good post. I hope the jury understands it this way. The prosecution needs to lay this out over and over for them.

I think that's all she had to offer was the sex. They only dated a short time and it sounds like it didn't take long for Travis to realize the relationship wasn't going anywhere.

Think about any dating relationship any of you have had. It takes you a while to get a know a person and Travis and Jodi didn't even live in the same town which makes that more difficult.

Red flags were her dumping the live in boyfriend so quickly, moving to be near Travis after knowing him such a short time. Creepy! Converting to Mormanism (even creepier. The converting, not the religion). I find that to be very overbearing. That's not a normal dating relationship that's in it's infancy. Add to that the crawling through the doggie door and just showing up. Who the heck does that?

I get that people meet and know they are meant to be together, love at first sight etc. This wasn't the situation in this case.

 

[popsicle]

"I am at a night club right now and it helped me to come to the conclusion that you are one of the prettiest girls on the planet"

From April 20 2008 on https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0Ak0vUAK8UbSndFl4X1V3YkZXazU0X25pQndhNVVmbXc&output=html

This is what I have seen.

ETA it says it is a text from J to T