Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.21.17 - Day 19

[Night_is_Mine]

The cell tower is 400m not “a mile or two”.
They’re not dog bones.
It has to be reasonable doubt, not just doubt.

“I will hurt her and remove her from our lives”.

That text could easily mean Laura you are fat and nobody likes you. Hurt? Check. Here's 10k cash go away. Removed from our lives? Check.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

Pretty long list of 'evidence' that can be explained away. One by one they can be explained away. All together - a pretty long list of coincidences happening all at once for two people.

 

[lclabtech]

Pretty long list of 'evidence' that can be explained away. One by one they can be explained away. All together - a pretty long list of coincidences happening all at once for two people.

This.

That’s what a circumstantial case is.

 

[Oreck]

How come the crown didn't ask AM about that What did you do?? Text

I think that when they don't ask the questions, it is because they don't like the answers.
You can bet they think about everything they say long and hard.
They are looking to win. They are not going to ask a question that helps the Defence.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

That text could easily mean Laura you are fat and nobody likes you. Hurt? Check. Here's 10k cash go away. Removed from our lives? Check.

Here are all the coincidences that occured to DM that you have to explain away:
- The girl (LB) he said he was going to hurt and remove from their lives disappears
- All of her last contacts are to DM
- All of her last cell phone pings are right with DMs phone
- The date LB disappears just happens to occur days before an incinerator you ordered is to be delivered
- You exchange text messages about testing the incinerator and needing to test it on bones when you have no reason for it to destroy bones
- You have pictures on your phone that an expert says look like human female bones in the incinerator
- You are 'testing' the incinerator but don't want MM to look at what you are doing.
- You've saved a screenshot on your phone the night of the burning about the temerature needed to creamate a person.

There is probably more. But that's a pretty long list of coincidences that would have had to have occured for DM at least to be found not guilty.

 

[lclabtech]

Here are all the coincidences that occured to DM that you have to explain away:
- The girl (LB) he said he was going to hurt and remove from their lives disappears
- All of her last contacts are to DM
- All of her last cell phone pings are right with DMs phone
- The date LB disappears just happens to occur days before an incinerator you ordered is to be delivered
- You exchange text messages about testing the incinerator and needing to test it on bones when you have no reason for it to destroy bones
- You have pictures on your phone that an expert says look like human female bones in the incinerator
- You are 'testing' the incinerator but don't want MM to look at what you are doing.
- You've saved a screenshot on your phone the night of the burning about the temerature needed to creamate a person.

There is probably more. But that's a pretty long list of coincidences that would have had to have occured for DM at least to be found not guilty.

Thanks for this. I find it completely bizarre to say no real evidence. I’ve followed many trials before where people are convicted on less than that.

 

[deugirtni]

How come the crown didn't ask AM about that What did you do?? Text

It was DM who asked AM 'what did you do'.. so that could be why the Crown didn't ask AM, since he wasn't the one who said it?

 

[Stumper]

I beg to differ. I have a teenager and I see what is said in jest versus actively planning missions to steal (MH, AM, SS, DM, MS), destroying evidence (CN, MB, MH, AM) purchasing illegal arms (DM, MS, Isho..CN and MM tagging along), dealing drugs and creating trailers with secret compartments to take drugs across provincial borders...MM being asked to wear a false pregnancy belly across an international border to smuggle ammunition...it goes on and on and on. I have to be honest I don’t know any teens or 20-something’s who would find this to be normal behaviour MOO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What evidence did anyone destroy besides CN and the trailer?

The rest in your list is stuff DM and MS or I should did or asked people to do. I'm not saying they are normal.

SS and his activity are on this list. I don't consider him part of the young people involved.

For the rest of the list:
Hide evidence - don't know what was hidden but assuming you mean the drugs and toolbox that was directed by MS
Stalk LB by request - AM was in Winnipeg, its not like he was hiding in the bushes.
Smuggle letters - that was DM's lawyer and mother.
Remove drugs/murder weapon - they didn't know it was a murder weapon and I don't think that trying to avoid trouble is an uncommon move

The rest is SS actions or DM led activity.

Either way - there is nothing frightening about them being outside of prison. They aren't dangers to the public.

Well then your teenage years and mine were obviously different. “I lied about, hid and got rid of the murder weapon and drugs cause my physopath friend directed me too” just didn’t fly in my house. Neither did incredibly convient amnesia for any reason.. and God knows I tried that route once or twice in desperation

MH ask DM specifically when he was informed of a tool box on route “what’s in it guns?”

Had it been my teen kids on stand admiting to bobcat thefts I would have ensured that charges were laid.

 

[Night_is_Mine]

Question. Has the "When I return her she will be a dirty girl " text presented as evidence? I know it was excluded in the TB trial because it was unrelated to that case. So if it hasn't been introduced here is it because the gun was meant for WM?....but if it has then forget this post and carry on lol

 

[Yendys]

It was DM who asked AM 'what did you do'.. so that could be why the Crown didn't ask AM, since he wasn't the one who said it?

We've struggled on here with what "What you'd do?!" means. Perhaps AM isn't sure what DM meant when he texted that and his thought on the matter is just speculation.

 

[matou]

Laura Babcock’s accused killer portraying himself as a thoughtless jerk: DiManno

It was a question intended to belittle and embarrass.


"How do you spell the word hangar?"


Honest to God, this reporter, for one, was silently urging the witness to shoot back with a hyphenated obscenity: ---- Y-O-U.


Crown attorney Jill Cameron was promptly on her feet, objecting. Justice Michael Code agreed


Witness testifies about bad blood between Dellen Millard and Laura Babcock


Millard claimed he bought incinerator for pet cremation business, uncle says story false


Smoke, crackling sound coming from incinerator in 2012, Smich’s ex tells Babcock trial
"I can't see the relevance," he said.


Move on.

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...raying-himself-as-a-thoughtless-jerk-dimanno/

 

[brightii]

Thanks for this. I find it completely bizarre to say no real evidence. I’ve followed many trials before where people are convicted on less than that.

There is so much evidence to think about but it just occurred to me that the simple fact that DM / MS were in possession of LB's iPad, is one of the most damning pieces of evidence, IMO. And then when SL contacted DM to ask him if he had any information about LB's disappearance, DM doesn't offer up that she left her iPad with him?? Any innocent person would have done so, IMO and even if DM didn't want LB around, if he had a clear conscience he would have absolutely no reason not to assist SL by providing him with LB's iPad. Also, MS knew he and MM had LB's iPad so there is no excuse for him either if he was innocent for not giving it up to LE once it was public knowledge that she was missing and yet he didn't. Damning IMO for both DM and MS.

IMO, it is not logical that LB would leave the iPad that was only on loan to her by SL with anyone else and just go off into oblivion and then shut off her phone and have no way to connect with others.

I hope the many little pieces of evidence lead the jury to make the big decision to convict both DM and MS of M1. The more I think about it all tonight, the more confident I feel that the proper verdicts will be delivered soon.

ALL MOO

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

Laura Babcock’s accused killer portraying himself as a thoughtless jerk: DiManno


https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...raying-himself-as-a-thoughtless-jerk-dimanno/

Its hard to say if DM is just completely clueless to how this stuff is being viewed by the jury or if he's using this as a final chance to take shots at people. Making the jury hate the defendant is about the worst defense strategy I've seen.

 

[brightii]

Laura Babcock’s accused killer portraying himself as a thoughtless jerk: DiManno


https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...raying-himself-as-a-thoughtless-jerk-dimanno/

[FONT=&quot]' "I never had a conversation ... nothing."[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They'd all been friends and now the young woman had vanished. Surely there would have been some concern for her?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Apparently not, in this self-absorbed coterie of the heartless.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Michalski: "Just because we didn't think highly of her at that time." '

Thanks for posting this article, Matou. I like Rosie DiManno's description. bbm[/FONT]

 

[matou]

MANDEL: Accused killer Dellen Millard can't bully her anymore

He hit on her. He slapped her behind. He made her feel stupid. Five years later, Marlena Meneses isn’t going to be pushed around anymore.

She may be petite, and looks young, but after a year spent in the company of two men now charged with first-degree murder — one being ex-boyfriend Mark Smich, the other his co-accused “brother” and benefactor Dellen Millard — she was determined to testify against them both.


When it came time to be cross-examined by Millard, acting as his own lawyer, she didn’t flinch at all.

http://torontosun.com/news/crime/mandel-accused-killer-dellen-millard-cant-bully-her-anymore

 

[Grey-St]

Its hard to say if DM is just completely clueless to how this stuff is being viewed by the jury or if he's using this as a final chance to take shots at people. Making the jury hate the defendant is about the worst defense strategy I've seen.

I couldn't agree more. His narcissism shone brightly today. He tried to paint MM in a bad light, and his attempt to shame her, embarrass her, and bully her was all for his own personal satisfaction. His cross did nothing for his defense, but he couldn't resist, he had to torment her. I think it was more damaging to him to bring up his additional gun acquisitions, as well.

Keep burying yourself, DM.

 

[Oreck]

I couldn't agree more. His narcissism shone brightly today. He tried to paint MM in a bad light, and his attempt to shame her, embarrass her, and bully her was all for his own personal satisfaction. His cross did nothing for his defense, but he couldn't resist, he had to torment her. I think it was more damaging to him to bring up his additional gun acquisitions, as well.

Keep burying yourself, DM.

One gun or ten. What does that matter?
He proved she's a liar under oath.
He can use that in his appeal.
He has many hours to think this all out.
Not a lot of distractions. Like should I make for sup,should I run down to the pub,have a few friends over,roll a splif, etc,etc,etc.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

One gun or ten. What does that matter?
He proved she's a liar under oath.
He can use that in his appeal.
He has many hours to think this all out.
Not a lot of distractions. Like what's for sup,should I run down to the pub,have a few friends over,roll a splif, etc,etc,etc.

A lie that you correct like 1 minute later on your own is not going to weigh on the jury. If she had insisted on it and then he had a photo, sure her credibility is shot. If two questions later you admit you were wrong I think this girl is willing to admit to her wrong doings and move on.

And it was zero proven guns that the jury had seen and now its one.

 

[Woodland]

MANDEL: Accused killer Dellen Millard can't bully her anymore


http://torontosun.com/news/crime/mandel-accused-killer-dellen-millard-cant-bully-her-anymore

Meneses is 23 — the same age as Babcock when she disappeared in July 2012. She never knew her, but as Meneses passed her grieving family in court, she looked at them in sympathy, the tears streaming down her face.

She’s done what she could.

Nice exit MM.

 

[Grey-St]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what the crown established today with AM's testimony. Am I missing something? He was asked to keep tabs on LB's whereabouts (we already knew that), he sent DM the missing persons report (we also already knew that), there was animosity between DM, LB, and CN (we also already knew that) and he basically gave no further insight to any of it.

It saddened me greatly to hear him say "they didn't think very highly of her", as if that's an appropriate reason to dismiss and disregard someone's disappearance. It broke my heart a little bit, for Laura and her family.

As the crowns case is coming to a close, I can't help but share the sentiment of others here that it's been rather anticlimactic, and I'm concerned. With only two more "quick" witnesses left, can anyone speculate as to who they might be?