Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.23.17 - Day 21

[deezep2m]

By the way DM tries to play this off about Cocaine I've been having this gut wrenching feeling, he laced her with drugs and poisoned her to death..... From his house to Kipling station is maybe 15 minutes/20 with traffic.... I'm almost certain in the car ride he plotted this.

Keep in mind also he told MS to also not be outside! ie thinking he was bringing her body into the house or something with him!

 

[THXGuru]

The DM to CN letters today are important to anyone on the jury who may have had lingering doubts about whether or not LB could still be alive. IMO, they will be now relieved of any such doubts.

All MOO

I followed the blog today from CBC. What did the letter actually reveal ? It was very vague unless I missed something.

 

[Horror]

Lisa Hepfner‏ @HefCHCHNews
2m2 minutes ago
Millard makes analogy between sailing and standing trial. Tells Noudga " this is what happened; the night Laura disappeared I came over to your house, I tapped on your window... Laura was in the basement doing coke with Mark... You and I don't like coke..."

Way behind again but wow !


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[andreww]

He is not smart. I think he will call her, or MS will, he has to try something to explain away those letters. To not call her would be to let the jury decide. If he thinks CN is still on his side, he will call her. Thats why the crown didn't want to call her I bet, she is probably still his cover. Going to be interesting for sure.

Smich won't. If he wasn't already in jail, he'd be going home soon. Its a travesty that they were even allowed to bring a M1 charge against him with so little evidence. Waste of taxpayers money.

 

[lawstud]

One thing that still bothers me in both trials. In the TB trial, police found that large flat wood board in the barn on DM's property which appeared briefly in pictures then was gone and did not appear as evidence in the TB trial. It appeared to have a stained outline on it which could resemble a body. IMO. Then it disappeared. Thought it might be used in this trial perhaps for DNA evidence. Any comments on this. I am still wondering what it was and why it was not introduced as evidence.

 

[Grey-St]

Really? I suspected he wouldn't have that kind of access.

I think CN was following the cases in the media.

 

[Horror]

This is gold.

Yes !


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[JuneBug67]

You may be right. It will be useful to hear it from the judge though in his charge to the jury.

It's not really in dispute. If they're only charged with murder 1, which I think is the case, then the lesser included offences of that charge are specifically laid out in the CCC. It's not something there is latitude on at all. The following basically says that if you're charged with murder 1, but that is not proven but murder 2 is, you can be convicted of murder 2. If you're charged with murder 1, but that is not proven but manslaughter is, you can can be convicted of manslaughter. But that is the end of the line. "...but shall not on that count find the accused guilty of any other offence."

http://criminalnotebook.ca/index.php/Murder_(Offence)#Lesser_Included_Offences

 

[67shelby]

Me too. I really didn’t think the crown had a very strong case, but the letters changed things for me.

I know most people here hate DM, but I just think it is so sad someone with so much potential and opportunity would throw it away like this. MS was always going no where in my opinion, but DM was highly intelligent, bilingual, etc. It’s really sad to me.

 

[Jealoushe]

Really? I suspected he wouldn't have that kind of access.

I thought he wasnt in jail yet when he wrote those...maybe wrong though

One things that still bothers me in both trials. In the TB trial, police found that large flat wood board in the barn on M's property which appeared briefly in pictures then was gone an did not appear as evidence in the TB trial. It appeared to have a stained outline on it which could resemble a body. IMO. Then it disappeared. Thought it might be used in this trial perhaps for DNA evidence. Any comments on this. I am still wondering what it was and why it was not introduced as evidence.

Most likely removed in legal arguments?

 

[Jealoushe]

Me too. I really didn’t think the crown had a very strong case, but the letters changed things for me.

I know most people here hate DM, but I just think it is so sad someone with so much potential and opportunity would throw it away like this. MS was always going no where in my opinion, but DM was highly intelligent, bilingual, etc. It’s really sad to me.

He is far from intelligent in my opinion.

 

[JuneBug67]

Here's an interesting line from the link I provided in my last post:

Where the Crown proves an intent to kill but fails to prove causation, the lesser included offence of attempted murder is available.

I wonder how that could be interpreted.

 

[JPC]

I predict that TD will raise the fact that MS is a smoker and he was not allowed to smoke in the house. I believe that AM confirmed to TD during his cross that DM insisted that smoking cigarettes had to be done outside. My guess is similar to the TB testimony, MS will say that he was outside of the house having a smoke and then DM has him to help dispose of some garbage.


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[Grey-St]

He is not smart. I think he will call her, or MS will, he has to try something to explain away those letters. To not call her would be to let the jury decide. If he thinks CN is still on his side, he will call her. Thats why the crown didn't want to call her I bet, she is probably still his cover. Going to be interesting for sure.

I think he will call her, simply because he can. It's not so much about what she can offer his defence (little to nothing), it's about exercising control and power over the people he once knew. And I have a feeling this one would be extra satisfying for him.

 

[Oreck]

As I see it.
The planning, the purchase, the building of the Eliminator is the premeditation.
Any murder after that is premeditated murder1.

 

[JuneBug67]

Me too. I really didn’t think the crown had a very strong case, but the letters changed things for me.

I know most people here hate DM, but I just think it is so sad someone with so much potential and opportunity would throw it away like this. MS was always going no where in my opinion, but DM was highly intelligent, bilingual, etc. It’s really sad to me.

He's not stupid at least. He's got an active mind. He's going to have to find some direction for that in prison or he will go squirrely.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

Not sure, but cross can only address points brought up on direct. It's not a situation where the cross examining attorney can ask whatever he or she wants. However, if I was a defense attorney I don't think I would ask that either. It's enough that the Crown didn't ask her about the night of the 3rd/4th. It's the Crown's burden to prove guilt, and it is telling that they didn't raise it with her.

I don't think this is true. They can ask whatever they want as long as its relevant to the case. DM was asking MM about MS abusing her and other things the crown didn't ask.

Now if DM or MS go to the stand, they can't be asked about their criminal record unless they bring up DM or MS bring up their character

 

[JuneBug67]

As I see it.
The planning, the purchase, the building of the Eliminator is the premeditation.
Any murder after that is premeditated murder1.

I think this is the biggest threat to Smich. If the jury believes this was a specific plot to kill LB, that the incinerator was part of that plan, and that MS knew both of those things and helped research and test anyway, that may be a straightforward M1. It may not matter what he did after that.

 

[JuneBug67]

I don't think this is true. They can ask whatever they want as long as its relevant to the case. DM was asking MM about MS abusing her and other things the crown didn't ask.

Now if DM or MS go to the stand, they can't be asked about their criminal record unless they bring up DM or MS bring up their character

Yes, I think you are correct. Sorry about that! I think I might have been conflating cross examination with re-examination, which can only address point from the cross.

 

[andreww]

I think this is the biggest threat to Smich. If the jury believes this was a specific plot to kill LB, that the incinerator was part of that plan, and that MS knew both of those things, that's a straightforward M1. It doesn't matter what he did after that.

Absolutely no evidence to prove either of those things. Millard is on record as telling multiple people the incinerator was for an animal cremation business, Smich may have been told the same. Unlikely, but without evidence to prove any different...