MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #22 Retrial

[kuromiiiilove]

I didn't see the first trial. Can you explain some of the things she has changed?

Post #277 in this thread

 

[Tricia]

Tonight we will discuss the Karen Read case on Websleuths YouTube Live at 10:30 P.M. Eastern

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[Amber29]

Here’s the thing - that’s speculation. Time distortion and minimization are common with hours of drinking. Saying ‘3-4 beers’ over 3 hours may sound casual and responsible, but alcohol affects different people differently. Not to mention the effects of different medications, food vs. empty stomach, etc. She also said she had a white claw in the Albert’s home but ‘only took a few sips’, which again, is pretty subjective.
Multiple other people from trial 1 testify to heavily drinking/drunk. Isn’t the safe assumption that Jen was likely on her friends level?
Also, even 3-4 beers over 3 hours is absolutely enough to affect judgement, especially in a woman with a smaller frame. MOO.

Also 3-4 beers that were what size? A normal glass, a schooner, a tall glass, a bottle, a can, this all makes a difference because some of those are more like 1.5 beers.

 

[Angelwatch]

We have gotten into the minutiae with JM and JOK's cell phones. But no mention of the location data for KR. Her phone was turned over so the CW had access to it. It would be helpful to see the same Whiffin map showing when KR left 34 Fairview. Was she there for the 12:32am event on JOK's phone?

 

[clearskies1]

The other day did Brennan play a clip where KR said she saw John go into the house? Why would KR think she might have hit John if she saw him go into the house?

 

[Izzylizzy]

Live in 3 minutes.

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[MerlinFalcon]

She said 2-3 beers between 9pm and when they left the bar past 12. That would not be enough for anyone with a functioning liver to be drunk, even without food. A person can metabolize ~1 drink per hour. I don't think it's safe to say she was on her friend's level - especially KR who would definitely have been very intoxicated based on what she herself said she drank and her BAL the next morning. But Jen could have been lying or mis-remembering, no way to know for sure.

I’m a total lightweight when it comes to booze. Like if I have two or three sips of wine fairly quickly I feel it. Even if I had 3 in 3 hours I wouldn’t trust myself to drive. She could have had one in the first 80 or 90 minutes and then 2 in the remaining time that could have put her over the limit. It’s impossible to know what her blood alcohol level was without a test.

The other thing with drinking is people play down their level of drunkenness. I was tipsy or I had a nice buzz is what you often hear because it’s taboo to say I was drunk and then I drove.

 

[BUF]

and then she (Judge) stupidly (or crookedly) endorsed his account AND didn't let the def speak to set the record straight. That skewing of the facts might matter on appeal one day.

^^^^ this!

 

[kuromiiiilove]

The other day did Brennan play a clip where KR said she saw John go into the house? Why would KR think she might have hit John if she saw him go into the house?

Panic? Confusion? She doesn’t deny still being drunk.

Here’s an anecdote that I feel applies: a couple months ago, my partner wasn’t responding to my texts while he was WFH and I was in office, which was strange for him. I checked his location and he was home but did not show on any security cameras, which meant he was in the bedroom. After a few hours and many unsuccessful calls, I called his brother, who lives close by to check on him. The brother and his wife swung by, knocked LOUDLY, and did not get a response.

Now I am panicking. I taxi home and I am blabbering to the driver about how my partner hasn’t answered me today. He’s hitting the gas and looking at me like I’m crazy.

All the while, I’m thinking: is he ok? Is he just sleeping? Did he have a brain aneurysm? Did he have an allergic reaction? Did someone break into the house to attempt a robbery and found him there? Did he leave his phone behind and go somewhere?

When I got home, thankfully, he was ok. Just jet lagged from a flight and passed out. But my mind went through EVERY possible scenario in that moment. And I think that’s what was happening with Karen.

MOO

 

[kuromiiiilove]

I’m a total lightweight when it comes to booze. Like if I have two or three sips of wine fairly quickly I feel it. Even if I had 3 in 3 hours I wouldn’t trust myself to drive. She could have had one in the first 80 or 90 minutes and then 2 in the remaining time that could have put her over the limit. It’s impossible to know what her blood alcohol level was without a test.

The other thing with drinking is people play down their level of drunkenness. I was tipsy or I had a nice buzz is what you often hear because it’s taboo to say I was drunk and then I drove.

Same here. The room spins if I drink a drink an hour.

 

[shotgun09]

Over and over, throughout this trial and the first, Judge has been like Archie Bunker.....saying " Stifle it, Edith" to the defense. We are watching

ETA: Sorry in advance for those that don't get my quote

 

[clearskies1]

Panic? Confusion? She doesn’t deny still being drunk.

Here’s an anecdote that I feel applies: a couple months ago, my partner wasn’t responding to my texts while he was WFH and I was in office which, was strange for him. I checked his location and he was home but did not show on any security cameras, which meant he was in the bedroom. After a few hours and many unsuccessful calls, I called his brother, who lives close by to check on him. The brother and his wife swung by, knocked LOUDLY, and did not get a response.

Now I am panicking. I taxi home and I am blabbering to the driver about how my partner hasn’t answered. He’s hitting the gas and looking at me like I’m crazy.

All the while, I’m thinking: is he ok? Is he just sleeping? Did he have a brain aneurysm? Did he have an allergic reaction? Did someone break into the house to attempt a robbery and found him there? Did he leave his phone behind and go somewhere?

When I got home, thankfully, he was ok. Just jet lagged from a flight and passed out. But my mind went through EVERY possible scenario in that moment. And I think that’s what was happening with Karen.

MOO

It just seems strange to think that the reason someone didn't come home is because you hit them with a car. I would think maybe they had a heart attack walking home in a blizzard. But to go to hitting them with your car in your mind... that seems odd to me. JMO.

 

[lohrtabitha]

This is what ticks me off. It’s so obvious they all drank and some of them drove. Why would JOK not stop his GF from driving? He’s a cop and both she and he and others could have been injured because she was drunk. It just shows how they all think nothing of drinking heavily and driving.

And on that horrible night they all put themselves above the law. They have no problem arresting others who drink and drive and prosecuting them, but weren't willing to obey the law themselves. Apparently BAs brother(also a PO) got suspended by Boston PD for drinking during his shift with Michael Proctor. It's a darn shame. Mo

 

[RatFace]

I’m a total lightweight when it comes to booze. Like if I have two or three sips of wine fairly quickly I feel it. Even if I had 3 in 3 hours I wouldn’t trust myself to drive. She could have had one in the first 80 or 90 minutes and then 2 in the remaining time that could have put her over the limit. It’s impossible to know what her blood alcohol level was without a test.

The other thing with drinking is people play down their level of drunkenness. I was tipsy or I had a nice buzz is what you often hear because it’s taboo to say I was drunk and then I drove.

But then again, there are people who go out and drink responsibly and don't get drunk.

 

[lohrtabitha]

I agree. If Kerry wasn't even there the night before and her and Jen just met why were those 2 creating a timeline. That makes no sense to me.

Maybe the McAlberts strong armed her. It seems many in that town are fearful of their power. Just like the Murdaugh clan. Moo

 

[clearskies1]

I agree. If Kerry wasn't even there the night before and her and Jen just met why were those 2 creating a timeline. That makes no sense to me.

Based on their testimony, they were thrown into a highly fraught situation with an unhinged KR that morning and came upon a dead man. That might cause people to bond. JMO.

 

[HarmonyE.]

Based on their testimony, they were thrown into a highly fraught situation with an unhinged KR that morning and came upon a dead man. That might cause people to bond. JMO.

Especially if one party (Jen) really, really wants to bond.....

 

[ShadyLady]

Based on their testimony, they were thrown into a highly fraught situation with an unhinged KR that morning and came upon a dead man. That might cause people to bond. JMO.

Personally, I think they bonded over their dislike of Karen.

It seemed as if one of the issues between John and Karen was that she spoiled the kids. Did Kerry or Jen point this issue out to John? I don't think either woman liked Karen. And why did they have to mimic Karen's hysteria over and over again. No compassion.

 

[Bethlamb16]

Based on their testimony, they were thrown into a highly fraught situation with an unhinged KR that morning and came upon a dead man. That might cause people to bond. JMO.

I get that but if Kerry wasn't with them that night how can she help with the timeline since all her interaction was after the event?

 

[detectivewannab]

Personally, I think they bonded over their dislike of Karen.

It seemed as if one of the issues between John and Karen was that she spoiled the kids. Did Kerry or Jen point this issue out to John? I don't think either woman liked Karen. And why did they have to mimic Karen's hysteria over and over again. No compassion.

Poor Karen... all these people dislike her.