MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #31 Retrial

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Agree. I think it is more probable they were hiding something much bigger than Karen’s hit and run on their phones. Perhaps it was a multitude of things they were hiding.

And there was an FBI investigation done on all the shenanigans that occurred with this case. That is how ARCCA became involved. The fbi hired them as part of their investigation. AFAIK, that investigation has concluded and the only consequence of the investigation was Proctor was fired.

MOO
I didn’t know why ARCCA came into the case- makes sense. Proctor may be a scapegoat?
If the family of JO files wrongful death charges against the PD due to evidence tampering- which could be said to have prevented a full balanced investigation then this isn’t over no matter what happens to KR.

IMO
 
Jmo and if you are inclined, I think you might benefit from listening to the expert testimony from trial 1. This is an area of specialist expertise.
I saw her testimony, she wasn’t convincing at all. It was clear she had a conclusion and was focused on supporting it.

I’d like to hear what the ME thinks of the dog bites- the ME is neutral.
But- the ME wasn’t asked, and her report did not say blunt force to face, nor did it describe the arm lacerations as dog bites.

IMO
 
What I fail to see here is proof he was hit by a car. No matter if there was a 3 point turn or a backing up event. We know she already made a 3 point turn that night because she was going the wrong direction. This still doesn’t prove he was hit by a car. Jen Mc was watching out the window - her words. She saw the car. She should have seen a hit. But, beyond that inference, the CW did NOT prove he was hit by a vehicle. Their own ME said his body doesn’t exhibit the signs of a pedestrian strike
Yes @cocomod mod agree - and nobody saw a BODY on the lawn and John was not a small guy. And the lawn is not vast.

I just cannot fit those pieces together... because they don't fit ?

JMO
 
I saw her testimony, she wasn’t convincing at all. It was clear she had a conclusion and was focused on supporting it.

I’d like to hear what the ME thinks of the dog bites- the ME is neutral.
But- the ME wasn’t asked, and her report did not say blunt force to face, nor did it describe the arm lacerations as dog bites.

IMO
I just posted that the ME was asked in trial x1 and she had no idea because she didn't know, but could not exclude claw injuries. The ME is on the defense's witness list. Not expanding on those points again. Other posters have also posted on this several times.

It's important to comprehend in relation to the ME's recent testimony she was the CW's witness and they have the burden of proof not the defense.

You are entitled to your opinion on Dr Russell of course. Dr Sheridan also testified on the matter. I disagree with your take on Dr Russell. If you don't know, Dr Russell was a very new witness and was prohibited by cannone from offering conclusions, despite her verifiably top notch qualifications and experience. In this trial she will provide far more detailed testimony. I'd suggest watching the voir dire of Dr Russell to see how she was treated by the judge prior to testifying in the first trial. However, at this point I agree to disagree and am moving on. Jmo
 
I saw her testimony, she wasn’t convincing at all. It was clear she had a conclusion and was focused on supporting it.

I’d like to hear what the ME thinks of the dog bites- the ME is neutral.
But- the ME wasn’t asked, and her report did not say blunt force to face, nor did it describe the arm lacerations as dog bites.

IMO
Russell said she has “much experience” with dog-inflicted wounds and observed or treated “at least 500” dog bites during her time at the hospital in Los Angeles. She also said she’s published and edited publications on dog bite wounds. As far as car crashes, Russell said she’s treated hundreds, if not thousands, of patients injured in vehicle collisions.

She said she arrived at her opinion on O’Keefe’s injuries in part by relying on her training and experience, but also by reviewing case materials such as O’Keefe’s autopsy report and medical examiner Dr. Irini Scordi-Bello’s prior testimony. Alessi asked Russell why she ruled out a motor vehicle collision as a potential cause for O’Keefe’s arm injuries.
 
Russell said she has “much experience” with dog-inflicted wounds and observed or treated “at least 500” dog bites during her time at the hospital in Los Angeles. She also said she’s published and edited publications on dog bite wounds. As far as car crashes, Russell said she’s treated hundreds, if not thousands, of patients injured in vehicle collisions.

She said she arrived at her opinion on O’Keefe’s injuries in part by relying on her training and experience, but also by reviewing case materials such as O’Keefe’s autopsy report and medical examiner Dr. Irini Scordi-Bello’s prior testimony. Alessi asked Russell why she ruled out a motor vehicle collision as a potential cause for O’Keefe’s arm injuries.

Yeah, I watched Russell’s testimony in full again on a big screen so I could see the pictures better. Changing my opinions here with these edits.
Yes, Russell would be an expert for sure based on her background and experience- and having seen thousands and thousands of skin injuries.
I also saw the cross- where she was asked if she measured the dog’s mouth or took a mold. She said it wasn’t necessary. In cases I’ve seen where human bites are involved- they take a mold of the mouth and do measurements.
The attorney who did the cross was a horses rear.

Maybe a connection between the dog and the bites it would have been more convincing. In the cross they bring up a report that questions the validity of forensics bite evidence- she says the science is questionable when trying to identify the biter. So, when asked if she took a mold or such when she had access to the dog, she said she did but did not think it was necessary.

Russell explains it well, says the wounds are consistent with a large animal- large dog, as are the tears in the clothing. She chooses her words carefully- used the ME report and photographs. She doesn’t just say they are consistent- she says she is confident those injuries came from a large animal bites and scratches.

So then if JO was attacked by a dog we still do not know if it was the German Shepard Chloe.
We know Chloe was described as not friendly to strangers.
My guess is they can’t connect those injuries to the Albert’s dog. No dog DNA- on clothing or in the wounds? That is amazing to me- a puncture wound would push saliva way deep- dog DNA should be in the wounds and on clothing. But there is evidence the clothing was not stored correctly so maybe any evidence was compromised?
Evidence tampering can always come up with missing evidence- because of the taillight issue. So- we are at a logical impasse.

Hmm, so it seems it is likely he was attacked by an animal!
IMO
 
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Russell said she has “much experience” with dog-inflicted wounds and observed or treated “at least 500” dog bites during her time at the hospital in Los Angeles. She also said she’s published and edited publications on dog bite wounds. As far as car crashes, Russell said she’s treated hundreds, if not thousands, of patients injured in vehicle collisions.

She said she arrived at her opinion on O’Keefe’s injuries in part by relying on her training and experience, but also by reviewing case materials such as O’Keefe’s autopsy report and medical examiner Dr. Irini Scordi-Bello’s prior testimony. Alessi asked Russell why she ruled out a motor vehicle collision as a potential cause for O’Keefe’s arm injuries.

Dr Russell's CV is quite impressive, IIRC. She started working as an LE officer, went to medical school, worked as an ER Physician for years, then TAUGHT ER physicians. She then furthered her education, becoming a Medical Examiner, TEACHING other students of ME. She certainly is qualified to opine on all things about this case, but most certainly ER presentation, wounds and autopsies. IMO
 
I have been watching this case since the beginning and have seen nothing to prove KR's guilt. Angry voicemails do not equal her killing JO. Evidence of the Lexus hitting JO and JO having injuries consistent with a collision is the only thing that would prove her guilt to me, and that has not happened. JMOO and ARCCA's.
There is even less evidence it is other people. I would understand if people felt there isn't enough to convict her. I don't understand the massive jump to accusing other people who were called BY HER!!! How would they set her up when she called them in the middle of the night and was the one to see him in the snow? It's just an odd jump to illogical conclusion, to me.
 
Dr Russell's CV is quite impressive, IIRC. She started working as an LE officer, went to medical school, worked as an ER Physician for years, then TAUGHT ER physicians. She then furthered her education, becoming a Medical Examiner, TEACHING other students of ME. She certainly is qualified to opine on all things about this case, but most certainly ER presentation, wounds and autopsies. IMO
She's very qualified. It seems she also understands that molds of teeth made 3 years after the alleged event are not permissible as evidence in a trial or investigation because a dog's teeth can change shape and size over time. Hence the CW's rebuttal witness cannot use what he claims are molds of Chloe's teeth IIRC.
 

I didn’t know why ARCCA came into the case- makes sense. Proctor may be a scapegoat?
If the family of JO files wrongful death charges against the PD due to evidence tampering- which could be said to have prevented a full balanced investigation then this isn’t over no matter what happens to KR.

IMO
Now, that would be interesting...
 
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She's very qualified. It seems she also understands that molds of teeth made 3 years after the alleged event are not permissible as evidence in a trial or investigation because a dog's teeth can change shape and size over time. Hence the CW's rebuttal witness cannot use what he claims are molds of Chloe's teeth IIRC.
And where is the blood work to prove she is the same doggie??
 
She's very qualified. It seems she also understands that molds of teeth made 3 years after the alleged event are not permissible as evidence in a trial or investigation because a dog's teeth can change shape and size over time. Hence the CW's rebuttal witness cannot use what he claims are molds of Chloe's teeth IIRC.
My friend had a 2 X 2 inch square of skin ripped off the back of her hand. A dog did it and there were no tooth marks on her hand like there are on John’s arm. Hard teeth on a soft body can and do create different types of wounds. The first time I saw his arm I immediately thought dog bite. Dr. Russell is highly qualified and has a unique perspective in her years as an ER doctor.
 
There is even less evidence it is other people. I would understand if people felt there isn't enough to convict her. I don't understand the massive jump to accusing other people who were called BY HER!!! How would they set her up when she called them in the middle of the night and was the one to see him in the snow? It's just an odd jump to illogical conclusion, to me.

KR is being tried for hitting JO with her Lexus and that is what the cw needs to prove , and they have not.The burden is on the cw not on the defense. JMOO
 
And where is the blood work to prove she is the same doggie??
Yeah, imo that is going to be an issue for the cw, authenticating that Cora is really Chloe. In any event Brennan's attempt to get those molds in, when I assume he was aware (from his own expert?) that they cannot be considered scientifically meaningful, appears to have been a tad underhand to put it mildly. Not unexpected though I guess. Jmo
 
I have been watching this case since the beginning and have seen nothing to prove KR's guilt. Angry voicemails do not equal her killing JO. Evidence of the Lexus hitting JO and JO having injuries consistent with a collision is the only thing that would prove her guilt to me, and that has not happened. JMOO and ARCCA's.
I have watched every single day, too. Not recaps, the whole entire trial. And I absolutely think there is evidence of her hitting him. Starting with the time his phone stopped moving and him not checking his phone anymore directly after she pulled off. I'm not here to argue about it, though. I actually read so much before the trial that I thought she was not guilty. Watching the whole trial has solidified, for me, that she is responsible for his death.
 
I saw the cross- where she was asked if she measured the dog’s mouth or took a mold. She said it wasn’t necessary. In cases I’ve seen where human bites are involved- they take a mold of the mouth and do measurements.
Maybe if she had shown some sort of connection between the dog and the bites it would have been more convincing to me. And, I wondered why she did not do this.
In the cross they asked if she had access to the dog, and she said she did but did not think it was necessary.

So then the door is wide open- if he was attacked by a dog where is the evidence it was the German Shepard Chloe? There isn’t any, because the Def is only trying to say the arm injuries could have been caused by a dog bite.
My guess is they can’t connect those injuries to the Albert’s dog. No dog DNA- on clothing or in the wounds? That is amazing to me- a puncture wound would push saliva way deep- dog DNA should be there if all of those wounds and tears to clothing are dog bites.
Why isn’t there dog DNA?
Evidence tampering can always come up with missing evidence- because of the taillight issue. So- we are at a logical impasse.

IMO
Problems with dental molds have been discussed repeatedly in previous threads and posts.
 
There is even less evidence it is other people. I would understand if people felt there isn't enough to convict her. I don't understand the massive jump to accusing other people who were called BY HER!!! How would they set her up when she called them in the middle of the night and was the one to see him in the snow? It's just an odd jump to illogical conclusion, to me.

I think the blame on others and LE conspiracy was necessary by the defense when the DA increased the charges and brought in the taillight evidence that appears fictional and fabricated.

If the taillight evidence is fabricated then you wonder Why?
Following that assumption you conclude that someone is covering up something and pinning this on KR because they believe she is near to the incident enough for her to plausibly be to blame.

This to me is a logical path by the defense to conspiracy by LE. Then you can speculate as to what they may be converting up, and who actually did it, and if it was intentional, and why plant evidence if you didn’t do it.

IMO
 
I think the blame on others and LE conspiracy was necessary by the defense when the DA increased the charges and brought in the taillight evidence that appears fictional and fabricated.

If the taillight evidence is fabricated then you wonder Why?
Following that assumption you conclude that someone is covering up something and pinning this on KR because they believe she is near to the incident enough for her to plausibly be to blame.

This to me is a logical path by the defense to conspiracy by LE. Then you can speculate as to what they may be converting up, and who actually did it, and if it was intentional, and why plant evidence if you didn’t do it.

IMO
What evidence has been presented for planting of taillight?
 
The " Investigation" conducted by the MSP ( Proctor) was so tainted, and clearly designed to get the focus on the " whackjob *#** ", and off of the Boston Cop whose lawn another Boston Cop was found on...is so apparent. How other's cannot see that , or question that is beyond me.
The Blue wall is real.

Their was only focus on KR.

What party?
What fight?
What dog?
Who's house?

imo
This is where I miss the laughing emoji. 🤣
 
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