MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #3

[rosesfromangels]

I am speculating the use of fire was because it is his fetish, (vs. trying to hide her identity), and he derived enjoyment from the suffering. Power, control over this beautiful girl, and an act of incredible hatred. He left her out in the open because he saw her as an object to discard, not as a person.

This guy is a misfit, an outcast. Anti-social. The weird guy everyone is already wondering about.
Rather than being distressed, I think he is deriving enjoyment from watching the news coverage, the LE activity. He's probably been at crime scene again blending in with spectators, and perhaps any vigils. This is all nourishing his memory of the crime.

 

[Camerabug]

And a different report said feet and head, (not hands or face)

"A New York City woman found dead in Massachusetts on Sunday had burns to her head and feet"
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/08/0...have-been-set-on-fire-sexually-assaulted.html


So nothing definitive.

"An autopsy was performed, but additional testing that has to be done," said Early, who would not specify her cause of death or the condition of her body".
,"
http://www.masslive.com/news/worcester/index.ssf/2016/08/authorities_not_ruling_out_lin.html

So no COD or condition.

If I missed other info from MSM or LE please advise.

"An investigative source said she was found naked and had suffered burns to her face, hands and feet."

http://www.telegram.com/news/20160809/dianne-williamson-slaying-sends-shock-waves-through-princeton

"There were indications her body had been burned, a law enforcement official briefed on the case said."

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...e-continues/W4RX4k7MOxCTEVYRUBFQSN/story.html

 

[ThinkHard]

I am speculating the use of fire was because it is his fetish, (vs. trying to hide her identity), and he derived enjoyment from the suffering. Power, control over this beautiful girl, and an act of incredible hatred. He left her out in the open because he saw her as an object to discard, not as a person.

This guy is a misfit, an outcast. Anti-social. The weird guy everyone is already wondering about.
Rather than being distressed, I think he is deriving enjoyment from watching the news coverage, the LE activity. He's probably been at crime scene again blending in with spectators, and perhaps any vigils. This is all nourishing his memory of the crime.

If it was a fetish and he derived pleasure from pain....then that would assume she was alive when she was being burned.

Of course this is a possibility as nothing definitive has been stated by LE either way, but shortyly after this crime occurred a profiler compared both this case and Karina Ventranos case. In that article she says that VM was burned post mortem.

It's possible she is speculating, but it's also possible she had information the public did not and inadvertently leaked this info.

If it is true information though, and she was burned post mortem, to me that wouldn't point to a perp that used burning as a pleasure out of pain scenario....as you can't see someone suffer if they are already dead.

If it is true that the burns are post mortem as the profiler suggested at, I'd think they were more to cover her identity from him, which to me would point to a personal connection (even if it were a one sided a one) or an amature attempt to his his own DNA on her body.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I think they can tell if the fire was post mortem due to carbon monoxide levels in the tissue, so they should be able to know for sure. Your theory sounds very plausible as well.

 

[Camerabug]

I am speculating the use of fire was because it is his fetish, (vs. trying to hide her identity), and he derived enjoyment from the suffering. Power, control over this beautiful girl, and an act of incredible hatred. He left her out in the open because he saw her as an object to discard, not as a person.

This guy is a misfit, an outcast. Anti-social. The weird guy everyone is already wondering about.
Rather than being distressed, I think he is deriving enjoyment from watching the news coverage, the LE activity. He's probably been at crime scene again blending in with spectators, and perhaps any vigils. This is all nourishing his memory of the crime.

I differ with you on a couple points but we are basically on the same page.

-I think he left her out in the open because he was done with her. The murder released his pent-up rage and the fire cleansed his spirit

-I don't perceive this guy as antisocial. I think he is quiet, awkward, but not without friends, although he may only have a few. Maybe an online game player (World of Warcraft) or similar games that allow him to be someone else.

-I agree he is a watcher and is watching LE work and following the news closely as well as returning to the scene to savor the memory.

 

[Steleheart]

"An investigative source said she was found naked and had suffered burns to her face, hands and feet."

http://www.telegram.com/news/20160809/dianne-williamson-slaying-sends-shock-waves-through-princeton

"There were indications her body had been burned, a law enforcement official briefed on the case said."

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...e-continues/W4RX4k7MOxCTEVYRUBFQSN/story.html

Yes. So differing reports, Head, hands, feet, face and any combination. Was burned, had burns, set on fire, naked or partially clothed. Google has every combination. Photos that could be old damage, green grass, dead grass, etc. The greatest drought in recorded history but no forest fire No 911 calls, no smoke seen.

Nothing definitive and no official LE reports, press releases, or etc. No Affidavits, no ME report, no COD or MOD.

Except that they have asked about a vehicle.
That tells me that they have tire tracks. Not bicycle tracks or motorcycle info.

They would not share, and neither have they, information they don't want the perp to know about,
Nor would they share information that only the perp would know. And there is a lot that only the perp would know.


MOO

 

[Rocky1]

Insight? Not really, but I read somewhere that serial killers generally bury their kills or otherwise dispose of the bodies so they can go on killing undiscovered.

i personally think the burning was what the killer may have enjoyed most. I don't think it was to hide her identity for sure. if killing her was the thrill, he would have left once the deed was done, but he didn't. It may be that he was angry at women (confused sexual identity?) or a specific woman (his mother comes to mind) but I think the fire was a release for him.

Actually, according to the FBI stats most bodies are left "as is"... 43.8%. The rest are small percentages of bodies left different ways. I was surprised to read that.
Page 39 gives that pathway.
https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/serialmurder-pathwaysforinvestigations.pdf/view

 

[Inthedetails]

Actually, according to the FBI stats most bodies are left "as is"... 43.8%. The rest are small percentages of bodies left different ways. I was surprised to read that.
Page 39 gives that pathway.
https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/serialmurder-pathwaysforinvestigations.pdf/view

I don't know if this is an "as is" case.

She was left in the open, but I think there was some posing or arranging. We don't have specific information, but the attention given to burning her makes me think he left her not simply "as is" but sort of in a way he wanted her to be be discovered.

Total speculation on my part, thinking aloud.

jmo

 

[Rocky1]

I don't know if this is an "as is" case.

She was left in the open, but I think there was some posing or arranging. We don't have specific information, but the attention given to burning her makes me think he left her not simply "as is" but sort of in a way he wanted her to be be discovered.

Total speculation on my part, thinking aloud.

jmo

I am with you on the arranging. What I meant by "as is" was as opposed to being buried. I picture her being placed in a sitting position leaned over with her feet under her head with her hands inbetween.
Same as you, just thinking out loud.

 

[zoso]

Would the posing and not burying reflect on his being local or a stranger? Would he be more inclined to bury if he was not from the area? Does he want to "decorate" a familiar place by the staging? If this is his "backyard" he is beyond cavalier...and someone has to know it was him.

 

[FindHG]

Ball Hill, not Barn Hill, sorry TH, for causing you more confusion, when this is an already tough situation for you.

Thank you Steleheart for clearing it up.

 

[Steleheart]

To clarify if that is OK...

There is no factual information that VM was posed and staged.

Please let's refer to that as one possible scenario. Else it will soon grow legs as a fact.

 

[zoso]

No mention ever of staging by LE. Good point.

 

[DatelineFan]

In my opinion, if he raped her, the burns weren't to destroy DNA. It would be pointless to try to burn only her head/face and extremities.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[Rocky1]

To clarify if that is OK...

There is no factual information that VM was posed and staged.

Please let's refer to that as one possible scenario. Else it will soon grow legs as a fact.

True, and just to reiterate, LE has only said it was a male,a timeline of 1 pm to 3 pm, and that they are asking people that may have seen a car in the area, to call them.
Everything else is just speculation.

 

[ThinkHard]

True, and just to reiterate, LE has only said it was a male,a timeline of 1 pm to 3 pm, and that they are asking people that may have seen a car in the area, to call them.
Everything else is just speculation.

They also asked to report anyone seen with cuts and scratches shortly after her murder.

So in addition to assuming a car was involved given the LE request, we also have to assume she faught back as well given LE hinting the person would have had injuries.

 

[Paulclapper]

Don't see why he needs to be anti-social or awkward. I believe the term is sociopath when you just don't really care about other people. But you can still be charming and friendly is its in your best interest. Many successful business people have this to a degree. Firing/laying off people, unrealistic expectations, screwing over customers and employees, all to put a little more money in their pockets. Point is he could come across as completely normal.

 

[Paulclapper]

I don't think he raped her, I think he intended to, but she fought back. It just seems really hard to rape an unbound awake grown women, plus no one officially or off the record has claimed she was raped.

 

[ThinkHard]

Don't see why he needs to be anti-social or awkward. I believe the term is sociopath when you just don't really care about other people. But you can still be charming and friendly is its in your best interest. Many successful business people have this to a degree. Firing/laying off people, unrealistic expectations, screwing over customers and employees, all to put a little more money in their pockets. Point is he could come across as completely normal.

I agree. I don't see the antisocial awkward loner thing either. It feels more like a stereotype to me, and granted a stereotype for a reason....but most sociopaths aren't socially awkward as you have said. They are actually far more likely to be quite gregarious. While they may not empathize with others, they are also keenly aware of social question and social order and know very well how to make themselves normal, even popular.

other conditions can affect people social skills or even ability to recognize social cues and these are the people the world looks at suspiciously, simply because they aren't "playing by the rules". Some of these people might also lack empathy, but it's more likely they lack expressive empathy rather then lacking internal empathy.

Sociopaths on the other hand lack internal empathy but are very very good at faking expressive empathy. They also tend to be incredibley bright.

 

[ThinkHard]

I don't think he raped her, I think he intended to, but she fought back. It just seems really hard to rape an unbound awake grown women, plus no one officially or off the record has claimed she was raped.

It's interesting you say unbound. Given the location of her burns, and given the fact we know no big fire was started....I have wondered if perhaps he did bind her hands and feet....and perhaps it was these bindings that he burnt. Perhaps he had a gag on her on burned that resulting in burns to head or face....or he could have burned her hair.