It has been reported that the PJ asked for urine samples from the twins, and the McCanns refused, stating they didn't need them because Madeleine had been kidnapped. However, the PJ were concerned because on the night Maddie went missing, the twins slept through the entire police investigation, including the noise created by family and friends searching for her and being carried out of the apartment by police officers.
Madeleine McCann 3 year old missing in Portugal - Part 13
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Wow, the things you guys think about and know the answers to are amazing.
I think that's very telling that the McCanns wouldn't let them have urine samples. I would have given a sample of anything if it would help the investigation along.
They would know what to try to hide and how to hide it with the medical background...
I think that's very telling that the McCanns wouldn't let them have urine samples. I would have given a sample of anything if it would help the investigation along.
They would know what to try to hide and how to hide it with the medical background...
For those asking about Gerry McCann's confession, it is here:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1667898&postcount=40
Both the Portuguese and English translation are provided.
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btw, colomom, nice going on the Portuguese Press thread. Are the SOL reports in there?
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1667898&postcount=40
Both the Portuguese and English translation are provided.
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btw, colomom, nice going on the Portuguese Press thread. Are the SOL reports in there?
In the link Cali posted above it reads:
"However, sources connected to the inquiry have revealed that Gerry has admitted to the investigators he had administed a sedative to the children on the night of May 3rd."
I don't know if we will know for sure unless there is a confirmed, written confession by Gerry McCann. Or a body that tests positive.
Calikid,
I appreciate the info. I wasn't aware that the twins slept through the entire investigation.
I think I got most of them Cali, the Pact of Silence is definitely there. I was amazed at how many pages there were to search through.
BTW, you have a PM (from me).
That is very true. The information was from a Portuguese newspaper called the Diario de Noticias. As colomom and others who post frequently here will testify, one of our biggest concerns is the credibility of the different papers we've come across. One of our posters gave us the lowdown on UK papers, but we have no way of knowing how reliable the DN is. It could be like the National Enquirer, for all we know.
Jacobean gave us the run down on the papers back in thread 11 I believe. I'm sure it was Jacobean, because I meant to say thank you and I'm not sure I ever did. So... Jacobean - THANK YOU.
Cali and Colo - thanks to you both for keeping us in touch with the Portugese press. I find this very helpful and hard as I try, I can not find a good translator. What ever it is you guys use makes the articles come out in a much more readable manner than babelfish. So again, thanks.
Salem
Cali and Colo - thanks to you both for keeping us in touch with the Portugese press. I find this very helpful and hard as I try, I can not find a good translator. What ever it is you guys use makes the articles come out in a much more readable manner than babelfish. So again, thanks.
Salem
It's not us. Both colomom and I are pulling our sources from Portuguese posters at other forums, and they are excellent.
Also, Jacobean, if I didn't say think you for the information about the British media, thanks belatedly.
Also, Jacobean, if I didn't say think you for the information about the British media, thanks belatedly.
Texana
Overreaching
The article at the link Calikid posted, from the Diario de Noticias, that contains the translation by Ozzy at mirror forums, contains this line:
"Kate is suspected of homicide by negligence and hiding the body ( the latter constitutes a sentence of upto two years in prison)."
This is where I think the misunderstanding that Kate was offered an actual plea bargain is--The PJ were telling Kate that if she confessed, the most she would serve under the law there would be two years in prison. By implication, it could even be less, but could not be more. This is not the same as being offered a "tell and you get two years" deal like in the U.S. It's more in the line of telling her the exact nature of what she's been charged with and the consequences if she's convicted.
"Kate is suspected of homicide by negligence and hiding the body ( the latter constitutes a sentence of upto two years in prison)."
This is where I think the misunderstanding that Kate was offered an actual plea bargain is--The PJ were telling Kate that if she confessed, the most she would serve under the law there would be two years in prison. By implication, it could even be less, but could not be more. This is not the same as being offered a "tell and you get two years" deal like in the U.S. It's more in the line of telling her the exact nature of what she's been charged with and the consequences if she's convicted.
Speaking of that....Jacobean, would it be OK with you if I posted your description of the papers in the UK in the Media Links thread?
Happy to help, and thank goodness for the generosity of our friends on the Proboards79 forum! They rock!
This "offer of a plea deal" is suspect in my eyes. As I understand it the PJ do not have the authority to offer such a deal. I believe it would have to be offered by a Magistrate and she has not been before one yet.
I agree with you Texana, I think they told her that for that crime she could serve 2 years and she passed that information on to her family who, in turn, passed it on to the media and somewhere it was mis-communicated.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/08/world/europe/08portugal.html?th&emc=th
New York Times article on the McCanns
New York Times article on the McCanns
BloodshotEye
Member
Thanks for the info CaliKid (re: request for urine sample from twins). Really appreciate it.
This makes me think that the PJ are far more observant, than I initially thought them to be. The PJ has been quietly, diligently collecting evidence, and observing certain patterns of behavior. The behavior of the twins, and the McC's.
Does any one of the other 7 in the group - have any idea about what happaned that night? I speculate...yes, one of them does have a feeling about what may have happened, but does not know the details. I will make the wild speculation (being that this is a group of doctors), that one of the 7 people also sedated their child/children, and suggested to the McC's that it works like a charm. And furthermore, if they gave the McC's "something" for the twins and Maddie, they might likely have contributed to a child's death, just as surely as a guy is responsible for the death of an addict to whom they sell drugs.
I find it more than coincidental, the McC's discover the fine art of sedating the children, only two days after the older woman who resided in the flat above the McC's, reported that she heard a child crying for over 1 hour. The child cried, calling out for her daddy, and only stopped crying when the McC's came home from an evening out. Who might have suggested how to handle this?
So...the question in my mind is, on the night that Kate exclaimed "they took Maddie", who else in this group of 7 other people, had children that were not being cared for by human being. Might the O'Briens be one? I recall that Russel (name?) was one who was repeatedly checking on his children. It was his daughter, who he claimed had "vomited" in bed, and had to change the sheets. Uh huh. . .
You guys are the best!
This makes me think that the PJ are far more observant, than I initially thought them to be. The PJ has been quietly, diligently collecting evidence, and observing certain patterns of behavior. The behavior of the twins, and the McC's.
Does any one of the other 7 in the group - have any idea about what happaned that night? I speculate...yes, one of them does have a feeling about what may have happened, but does not know the details. I will make the wild speculation (being that this is a group of doctors), that one of the 7 people also sedated their child/children, and suggested to the McC's that it works like a charm. And furthermore, if they gave the McC's "something" for the twins and Maddie, they might likely have contributed to a child's death, just as surely as a guy is responsible for the death of an addict to whom they sell drugs.
I find it more than coincidental, the McC's discover the fine art of sedating the children, only two days after the older woman who resided in the flat above the McC's, reported that she heard a child crying for over 1 hour. The child cried, calling out for her daddy, and only stopped crying when the McC's came home from an evening out. Who might have suggested how to handle this?
So...the question in my mind is, on the night that Kate exclaimed "they took Maddie", who else in this group of 7 other people, had children that were not being cared for by human being. Might the O'Briens be one? I recall that Russel (name?) was one who was repeatedly checking on his children. It was his daughter, who he claimed had "vomited" in bed, and had to change the sheets. Uh huh. . .
You guys are the best!
Thanks Bloodshoteye.
One of the daughters of Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien was apparently sick the night Madeleine disappeared. She was throwing up, and we wondered whether she was having a reaction to sedation. Or we wondered if the person who was throwing up was really Madeleine.
One of the daughters of Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien was apparently sick the night Madeleine disappeared. She was throwing up, and we wondered whether she was having a reaction to sedation. Or we wondered if the person who was throwing up was really Madeleine.
I just want to say what a pleasure it is to read a forum where individuals respect each other. I can always count on Websleuths for great information and common courtesy. You all are the greatest. Colomom, you are amazing with the amount of information you provide!!! Thank you all so much for keeping those of us who don't have time to post much, but who do care, informed!
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2165457,00.html
I don't know much about the authority of individual Portuguese newspapers, but the British Guardian is generally regarded as one of the world's most reliable periodicals:
Madeleine: DNA find is 'not a complete match'
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Ned Temko and Mark Townsend
Sunday September 9, 2007
The Observer
[/FONT]
The DNA evidence which led to the shock decision to name Kate and Gerry McCann as official suspects in the disappearance and possible death of their daughter, Madeleine, is incomplete and not a perfect match. Sources close to the investigation have revealed to The Observer that although the evidence contained in a DNA profile of blood found on the floor of the family's holiday flat is 'very strong' it is not conclusive. The first authoritative account of the sudden change of direction in the search for the missing four-year-old came last night from a senior source close to both the British and Portuguese police who have been handling the case. And in a dramatic sign of the growing tension surrounding the fast-moving investigation, it also emerged that family and friends of Kate and Gerry McCann were in contact with the Foreign Office in the hope of securing support from the Foreign Secretary, David Miliband.
I don't know much about the authority of individual Portuguese newspapers, but the British Guardian is generally regarded as one of the world's most reliable periodicals:
Madeleine: DNA find is 'not a complete match'
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Ned Temko and Mark Townsend
Sunday September 9, 2007
The Observer
[/FONT]
The DNA evidence which led to the shock decision to name Kate and Gerry McCann as official suspects in the disappearance and possible death of their daughter, Madeleine, is incomplete and not a perfect match. Sources close to the investigation have revealed to The Observer that although the evidence contained in a DNA profile of blood found on the floor of the family's holiday flat is 'very strong' it is not conclusive. The first authoritative account of the sudden change of direction in the search for the missing four-year-old came last night from a senior source close to both the British and Portuguese police who have been handling the case. And in a dramatic sign of the growing tension surrounding the fast-moving investigation, it also emerged that family and friends of Kate and Gerry McCann were in contact with the Foreign Office in the hope of securing support from the Foreign Secretary, David Miliband.
KR2tonenow
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Thanks for all the updates, I have been on vacation and heard it in Canada, and basically the same information is being broadcasted out..but I appreciate all the other articles.
The McCanns never sat right with me, and am glad to see PJ pushing to find out the truth to what has happened to little Maddie!
MoonGoddess
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BBCNews24 - 'Breaking News' - McCanns planning to return to Britain in the coming hours...
concernedperson
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That sounds like getting out of Dodge. An American vernacular for CYA and being gone.
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