Madeleine McCann 3 year old missing in Portugal - Part 9

[sleuthin4fun]

Yes, I absolutely feel like my brain may explode. This whole case baffles me to no end. I jump back and fourth between believing she was abducted to being suspicuos of her parents. I am totally unnerved by the fact that they believe that it was appropriate parenting to leave three small children alone while they were out with friends. I guess in my mind I have created three possible scenarios.

1- Maddie was actually kidnapped by a stranger who had been watching this family and had learned much about the families evening ritual and took it as an oppotunity to take Maddie.

2- Maddie was given a sedative to help her sleep and she had a bad reaction and died.

3- Maddie would not cooperate with the evening planes and GM lashed out at her in anger and unintentionally harmed her mortally and has covered his tracks.

4- Another member of the McCann party harmed Maddie and GM and KM are not aware this is the case.

Have we heard who the single women was that was traveling with this group?

Another question, GM and KM had fertility issues. Do we know how Maddie was concieved. I believe that it was invetro. Do we know if the egg and sperm used actually belonged to the McCanns? Is it possible that it belonged to a third party and that person has taken Maddie wanting to be part of her life? Farfetched I know but just thinking.

 

[colomom]

I posted this on the Mirror boards and wanted to share it with you as I head off to watch Last Comic Standing with my most amazing and patience husband....

I feel it very strongly in myself that if anything happened to my children (both under 11 years) especially if it involved violence and most especially if I did not know what happened to them....I would be done for.

I often wonder if I would be able to be strong for the remaining child and I truly believe that I would have to make sure they would be cared for and then...I'm checking out. I absolutely could not live with the thought that my child might be in the hands of evil.

These thoughts just floor me, they destroy me. And they are just thoughts. Those kiddos are in the next room happily playing. And I am crying...

I could never understand how the McCanns could be so....stoic. I never could and I never will, understand.

I am still trying not to be judgmental but, if I find out that the McCanns have lied and played with my deepest fears and made me afraid to let go of my daughter when we go out and made me cry for weeks on end and created a suspicion in my mind about parents with lost children....then God help them because I am not alone and they will know the force of the anger of millions...I would not want to be them....

I wish you all a peaceful good night...

:blowkiss:

 

[CaliKid]

I know exactly what you mean, Heather. I have read some awful stories through the years of what parents are capable of doing to their children- Andrea Yates, Susan Smith, etc. And now the new crop of men who think it's totally okay to kill their pregnant wives and girlfriends. It makes my blood boil over how cruel people can be in general. I have said for a good month that if it turns out the McCanns had something to do with Madeleine's murder, heaven help them because the world will turn on them in a flash and screaming for justice for her.

I don't know what to think anymore, especially about this new "not Maddie's blood" story. Remember that linked article we read last week? Something about the apartment the McCanns were staying in xhich was reportedly being sold but wasn't, just rented out to PJ detectives so they could spy on the McCanns. Well I wonder if the PJ think something happened to Madeleine based on the testimony and behavior of her parents and their friends so they set out to trip them up. There never was any blood evidence. They don't really have any proof that's admissable in court; they just want to spook them into confessing they killed her.

 

[mjak]

This has got to be the most convulted case I have ever tried to follow. I am holding on to the hope that PJ know exactly what they are doing and are very close to presenting their case. I am higly suspicious as I have always been that their is prental involvment in Maddelines dissapearance. However, I do not believe the entire group of friends are involved or knowingly participating in a cover-up. As I find it hard to believe that all of them would be this unconcionable to knowingly participate in the cover up of a childs death. However, I think it is very possible that GM could have sold them all a story which they have bought into. The parents insistance on an abduction scenerio from the get go has only two explanations to me. explanation number one is they have information we do not and therefore have reason to believe this explanation or this explanation is a falsehood that they are despertly trying to sell to cover there own guilt. It is completly illogical to me to find your 3 year old child missing after having left the child unattended and immediatly declare the child abducted. The logical explanation to me is the child wandered off. I hope the parents if they are involved do the right thing as soon as possible and confess and if not involved stop hiding behind a money making campagin and turn there efforts to finding Maddie.

mjak

 

[mjak]

From the Enfants Kidnappés site, here is some conflicting news about the blood.

http://www.google.com/translate?u=h...die/maddie.html&;langpair=fr|en&hl=en&ie=UTF8

I was looking at this source and it appears to be very poorly cited. As of 8 hours ago acoording to the British press the results of the blood found in the apartment was not known. Yet, this article states its been known for days it did not belong to Maddie. The other articles on this site are also very misleading and distored. I think there is still a good possiblity the blood does indeed belong to Maddie. In fact I think its possible PJ allready knows it does.

mjak

 

[Ang50]

And I'm not sure if you could distinguish one set of DNA from another if it's saliva on top of saliva. Sounds kind of gross, but you know what I mean.

I think you can - at least with sperm it works b/c DNA from different men implicates men in a gang rape situation...

 

[Morag]

...Have we heard who the single women was that was traveling with this group? ...

.

According to this story, it was somebody's mother.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../wmaddy408.xml

The others dining on May 3 were the McCanns, Jane Tanner, Russell O'Brien, David and Fiona Payne and another person who has not been named, but is thought to be the mother of one of those present

Also according to this story, the mid-evening timeline looks like this:

905pm Gerry checks his kids
915pm, Jane Tanner sees the child-carrying man, and it never enters her head that the child is Madeleine
930pm Dr. Oldfield checks the children and sees the McCann children asleep.

So this means that Jane Tanner could not have seen Madeleine at 915 IF
Dr. Oldfield saw the McCann children at 930.
Or, if the child Jane Tanner saw at 915 was Madeleine, then Dr. Oldfield did not see Madeleine at 930.
Or Dr. Oldfield did not look at the children at 930.

What's more, if Dr. Oldfield saw Madeleine and siblings at 930, then the abductor had only a half hour window of opportunity to enter the room and do his awful deed. Not only that,if the abductor had been scoping out the scene of the crime, he would have seen 3 separate adults checking on or looking out for the McCann kids---within a 25 minute period. And he would have committed his crime knowing that an adult could arrive at any minute.

If, and I do mean If, Madeleine was really kidnapped, then some of the Tapas partyers have to be lying, for whatever reason.

 

[Salem]

According to this story, it was somebody's mother.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../wmaddy408.xml

The others dining on May 3 were the McCanns, Jane Tanner, Russell O'Brien, David and Fiona Payne and another person who has not been named, but is thought to be the mother of one of those present

Also according to this story, the mid-evening timeline looks like this:

905pm Gerry checks his kids
915pm, Jane Tanner sees the child-carrying man, and it never enters her head that the child is Madeleine
930pm Dr. Oldfield checks the children and sees the McCann children asleep.

So this means that Jane Tanner could not have seen Madeleine at 915 IF
Dr. Oldfield saw the McCann children at 930.
Or, if the child Jane Tanner saw at 915 was Madeleine, then Dr. Oldfield did not see Madeleine at 930.
Or Dr. Oldfield did not look at the children at 930.

What's more, if Dr. Oldfield saw Madeleine and siblings at 930, then the abductor had only a half hour window of opportunity to enter the room and do his awful deed. Not only that,if the abductor had been scoping out the scene of the crime, he would have seen 3 separate adults checking on or looking out for the McCann kids---within a 25 minute period. And he would have committed his crime knowing that an adult could arrive at any minute.

If, and I do mean If, Madeleine was really kidnapped, then some of the Tapas partyers have to be lying, for whatever reason.

Morag - I agree 100%. In addition, the way the timeline works out, half the dinner party would be missing from the table at any given time. I posted a timeline in one of the previous threads based on the times stated for checking the kids and calculated in the length of time it might take to do the circuit. It was evident that Gerry would have only been back by 30 seconds or so (I am exagerating a litte here) before the next person left. When you through Jane Tanner into the mix, you end up with three people gone from the table at the same time.... Gerry at 9:05, Jane at 9:15, and then Matthew at 9:30. And with all this checking, are we then to believe that no one else checked again until 10:00. Doesn't make sense.

Now there is also the discrepancy with Jane. Was she checking the children or arriving late to dinner? Where was her husband, O'Brien? He was also late to dinner, but not one report has put the two of the arriving together.....

So, Dr. Oldfield sees the children sleeping about the same time that Gerry is out back talking to Jeremy Wilkins and Jane is running around the complex spying stange men in beige trousers and expensive shoes, carrying a child wrapped in a blanket. Same man spied by the Irish family, but apparently he had lost his blanket somewhere, because now the child is uncovered.

I really think that the media is being fed "tidbits" for various reasons. I am unsure what may or may not be true, here. I really sense that the PLE is trying to smoke someone out.

And then there is Tuck - guys what do you think about him? Do you not find it odd how he showed up in the pictures and he is Murat's friend? There has to be some meaning there.......

Salem

 

[AfterMidnight]

Yes, but did it test positive for DEATH?

Someone told the police no one had died in that apartment. Does that make it gospel truth? People don't lie? I imagine an apartment that once held a dead granny might not rent as well as another one. Of course, this is simply speculation.

I believe cadavar dogs are akin to psychics. They give us a piece of the puzzle, but are seldom able to show us clearly where and how it fits.

 

[Shazza]

Good morning, Shazza! :blowkiss:

Hi CaliKid, catching up on some reading, sorry I missed you.

 

[Shazza]

BLOOD

It is known now that the blood found in the apartment of McCann is not that of Maddie. It was about the blood of a British tourist who had rented the same apartment and which had been cut accidentally. It would seem that this information have been known PJ for several days.

Anybody else feel like your brain is going to explode?!?!

Morning Shazza!

Hi Colomom, my brain just did, you know I had a funny feeling it wouldnt be her blood, being on the wall is what put me off, but cant explain why.

 

[Shazza]

I posted this on the Mirror boards and wanted to share it with you as I head off to watch Last Comic Standing with my most amazing and patience husband....

I feel it very strongly in myself that if anything happened to my children (both under 11 years) especially if it involved violence and most especially if I did not know what happened to them....I would be done for.

I often wonder if I would be able to be strong for the remaining child and I truly believe that I would have to make sure they would be cared for and then...I'm checking out. I absolutely could not live with the thought that my child might be in the hands of evil.

These thoughts just floor me, they destroy me. And they are just thoughts. Those kiddos are in the next room happily playing. And I am crying...

I could never understand how the McCanns could be so....stoic. I never could and I never will, understand.

I am still trying not to be judgmental but, if I find out that the McCanns have lied and played with my deepest fears and made me afraid to let go of my daughter when we go out and made me cry for weeks on end and created a suspicion in my mind about parents with lost children....then God help them because I am not alone and they will know the force of the anger of millions...I would not want to be them....

I wish you all a peaceful good night...

:blowkiss:

I too have felt the same way and even said I would never visit another thread involving missing children, this has just hit me like a brick, and I feel like I am the one with a missing child, I want to scream, I am so numb, but as plenty of you said to me to stay I did thinking this will soon be over. Colomom I too feel your pain and anger towards the parents for putting their children in harms way and would hate to be in their shoes, I still think they were involved in some way and will keep reading and posting on this site until this case is closed. I hope you do to Colomom as you are one of the most compassionate person that posts here. Prayers to Madelaine.

 

[CaliKid]

Morag - I agree 100%. In addition, the way the timeline works out, half the dinner party would be missing from the table at any given time. I posted a timeline in one of the previous threads based on the times stated for checking the kids and calculated in the length of time it might take to do the circuit. It was evident that Gerry would have only been back by 30 seconds or so (I am exagerating a litte here) before the next person left. When you through Jane Tanner into the mix, you end up with three people gone from the table at the same time.... Gerry at 9:05, Jane at 9:15, and then Matthew at 9:30. And with all this checking, are we then to believe that no one else checked again until 10:00. Doesn't make sense.

Now there is also the discrepancy with Jane. Was she checking the children or arriving late to dinner? Where was her husband, O'Brien? He was also late to dinner, but not one report has put the two of the arriving together.....

So, Dr. Oldfield sees the children sleeping about the same time that Gerry is out back talking to Jeremy Wilkins and Jane is running around the complex spying stange men in beige trousers and expensive shoes, carrying a child wrapped in a blanket. Same man spied by the Irish family, but apparently he had lost his blanket somewhere, because now the child is uncovered.

I really think that the media is being fed "tidbits" for various reasons. I am unsure what may or may not be true, here. I really sense that the PLE is trying to smoke someone out.

And then there is Tuck - guys what do you think about him? Do you not find it odd how he showed up in the pictures and he is Murat's friend? There has to be some meaning there.......

Salem

If the timeline holds true, Gerry McCann, Jane Tanner and Mathew Oldfield would've all run into Jeremy Wilkins.

I don't know what to make of the relationship between Tuck and Murat except if RM is found innocent, I'd assume that Tuck has nothing to do with it either. Maybe just a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[Shazza]

If the timeline holds true, Gerry McCann, Jane Tanner and Mathew Oldfield would've all run into Jeremy Wilkins.

The timeline according to the McCanns and their friends about their whereabouts throughout the night imo is FALSE, I think they lied, there is definitely a cover up, I just hope the LE gets the sons of ...itches.

 

[CaliKid]

Agreed. I'll take the word of the Tapas bar staff who, having already said nobody got up from the table all night, have nothing to gain by lying, over the a$$-saving accounts of the McCann group. I don't think all of them are involved in a cover-up, but I'd be willing to bet at least one of them is.

 

[lizziedripping]

BLOOD

It is known now that the blood found in the apartment of McCann is not that of Maddie. It was about the blood of a British tourist who had rented the same apartment and which had been cut accidentally. It would seem that this information have been known PJ for several days.

Anybody else feel like your brain is going to explode?!?!

Morning Shazza!

I am in the UK and on the morning news all over the UK it is being said that the police are still waiting for the results of the blood tests but they are hoping to annouce the results today. now I'm confused, what is the truth???

http://icberkshire.icnetwork.co.uk/...bjectid=19598079&siteid=106484-name_page.html

 

[mjak]

I am in the UK and on the morning news all over the UK it is being said that the police are still waiting for the results of the blood tests but they are hoping to annouce the results today. now I'm confused, what is the truth???

http://icberkshire.icnetwork.co.uk/...bjectid=19598079&siteid=106484-name_page.html

I posted a few posts back that the source of this information that the blood is Not Maddelines is very questionable. The paper is filled with aritcles that are distored and missleading regarding Maddeline. As of last night the British press was reporting the results of the blood has not been released. I would disregard this article stating the blood is definitvly not Maddelines as unconfirmable and therefore should not be believed at this time. The articls states PJ has known for days the blood is not Maddies. They only relased the infromation of the existance of this blood to the public a few days ago. That would make no sense.

mjak

 

[Reannan]

I posted a few posts back that the source of this information that the blood is Not Maddelines is very questionable. The paper is filled with aritcles that are distored and missleading regarding Maddeline. As of last night the British press was reporting the results of the blood has not been released. I would disregard this article stating the blood is definitvly not Maddelines as unconfirmable and therefore should not be believed at this time. The articls states PJ has known for days the blood is not Maddies. They only relased the infromation of the existance of this blood to the public a few days ago. That would make no sense.

mjak

Nothing makes any sense with this case. In fact, I will be surprised if the results of the DNA testing on the blood come back conclusively as belonging to Maddie. If the current trend for information continues, the results will come back as NOT belonging to Maddie. This case has been a constant parade of BIG news that fizzles out with a little whimper.

 

[Jdee]

From Sky news article...
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1279204,00.html

"DNA analysis of blood traces found in the holiday apartment is now being carried out at a Birmingham laboratory"

So that leads me to think the results are still out on the blood and nothing is confirmed yet.

Another comment from the same article...
"The couple, who were dining with friends nearby at the time, have defended their actions, saying it was safe to leave them alone and they were "at worst" naive.."

If that was true and Madeleine was "safe" then none of us here would be discussing this case.. as there would be no case and no missing child. What a stupid comment from the 'friends'.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

LE often gives out misleading information to their advantage. They probably do have the results which has led to them saying the things they have about the Mccanns and reinterviewing them. I would say in that case...the results are positive for it being Maddie's blood. The pressure they are putting on the Mccanns right now is telling and they are wanting a confession to end this.