Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread #27

Status
Not open for further replies.
http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic9.html
Mark Warner/Ocean Club staff statements

Quite interesting read, but time consuming.. although by reading the staff statements one can get much clearer picture of what was going on in the resort and how the things are organised etc..
I recommend reading it, if you have time..
 
While reading staff statements I came across this, a witness saw a car parked next to the McCanns window at around 10pm
Processos

Volume II

Pages 469 – 470a

Maria Manuela Martins da Silva

Date/Time: 2007/05/08 14H00
Domestic
Portuguese

Concerning the issue of the process said;
. That she resides in Praia da Luz;
. That she often visits ********, sister of her boyfriend, who resides in Block 6, Apartment 5 in the resort known as the Ocean Club in Praia da Luz, in Lagos
. The block in question is contiguous with that one occupied by the McCann family, and is a ground-floor with a kitchen window having visibility to the back windows of the apartment occupied by Madeleine McCann;
. On 03-05-07, the deponent, as is customary, visited her friend ******, as a rule she passes the afternoon with her;
. The night, generally around 22H00, she leaves with her boyfriend, *******, for their residence indicated above;
. Declares that she left the apartment around 22H00, as was her habit, as the deponent generally makes and receives calls to family at 22H30 at/from her residence;
. The deponent and her boyfriend have two vehicles, a light passenger jeep of the mark Opel, model Frontera, green in colour, with license plate ***** and another light passenger vehicle, mark-Renault, Laguna model, gery in colour with license plate *****;
. Together the vehicles are registered in the name of her boyfriend;
. Declares further that on the night 03-05-07, she left the apartment at around 21H58—she remembers the exact time because she asked her friend the time and she responded after checking this on the telephone in the lounge;
. They left the building and the deponent and her boyfriend took the Opel Frontera, previously indicated, which was parked out front of the apartment, in the private parking area of Block 6 where her freind’s apartment was located;
. She declares that the night was good with a breeze, and that it was dark;
. After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment;
She declares further that she mentioned this fact to her boyfriend and that it wasn’t yet summer given the movement on the roads, and at that hour movement was nill;
. States that she looked at the exit of the apartment and that from the flat above the McCanns, she saw light, and also in from of the apartment, but she could not define, concretely, where she saw the light when she passed the McCann apartment;
. Next to the tree, she did not detect any movement of people or vehicles, and nothing struck her as abnormal in that zone that would have raised her suspicions;
. She only learnt of what had happened to little Madeleine the next day after having received a telephone call from her friend, who alerted her to what had happened;
. And nothing more said, having read the statement, finds it in conformity and signs it;
. The document is duly signed by me …

Carlos Dordonnat, Inspector with this Polícia Judiciária.
 
Yes I know that BUT they were ABSOLVED of all of this.....as a false statement cannot be made if nothing actually happened. Oh never mind I give up lol....

That is not true I think... It depends on what you said. There are lies that are independent of each other.

I mean, let's suppose that Ann says Bertha beat her up and Bertha says she didn't, and Colin says that Bertha is right, he saw everything and Ann fell down the stairs.

Now, if Bertha beat Ann up, then Colin's statement is obviously a false statement. But even if it's true that Ann fell down the stairs Colin's statement could still be false if it turns out that he wasn't there to witness it. (For example. I'm just making this up to illustrate the principle, I've no idea what the false statement was really about).
 
While reading staff statements I came across this, a witness saw a car parked next to the McCanns window at around 10pm

What colour was the car the mccanns rented? If the abductor had a vehicle why was he seen walking with the child?
 
We are going to continue with one thread for awhile. It's a lot easier to manage since we don't have one assigned moderator for this area.

The snark factor has been pretty high in Madeleine's forum lately. Start treating each other with respect or you might find yourself on the outside looking in.

Bump! We can all agree to disagree but let's be respectful to one another. I would hate to have this thread shut down. Madeleine needs to be found dead or alive and that's why we're here
 
What colour was the car the mccanns rented? If the abductor had a vehicle why was he seen walking with the child?

McCanns rented the car many days later.

The abductor could take the child in the car up to the beach area where he could have parked and carried the child further.
 
McCanns rented the car many days later.

The abductor could take the child in the car up to the beach area where he could have parked and carried the child further.

Could be. Why wasn't this made public in the early days though? Maybe other witnesses could have seen this car.
 
Could be. Why wasn't this made public in the early days though? Maybe other witnesses could have seen this car.

I remember there are other mentions of the cars in statements, I am looking for them now..

Why it hasn't made public? Maybe Portuguese police identified the owners and knew why they were there at the time?

Maybe they did not find it important or they did not find the witness reliable?
 
Statement about McCanns behaviour at the night Madeleine disappeared.
Source: the police files

CARTAS ROGATORIAS UK (FILE 4)
3 to 6—Witness statement of Emma Louise Knight 2008.04.30

Translation:

Leicestershire Police Force

Statement from: Emma Louise KNIGHT

Occupation: Hotel Manager
Date: 30th April 2008

I am currently an employee of the Mark Warner Holiday Company, 20 Kensington Church Street, London. I have worked for this company since November 2005 and have held various positions in complexes and hotels abroad.

In March 2007 I travelled to the Mark Warner complex in Praia da Luz, Portugal. My position was Client Support Manager and my function was to receive and welcome the new guests and be available to resolve any problem that might arise during their stay.

The Praia da Luz complex covers a large area and for this reason there were several locations where I worked during the day, such as the reception, the Tapas bar area and the Millenium Restaurant.

My first contact with the couple named Gerry and Kate McCann took place in the 24 hour reception when they arrived at the resort accompanied by their 3 children. They were on holiday with a number of other families, some of them arrived by different means.

During the first part of their holiday there were no problems that were brought to my knowledge relating to their stay. I knew about their three children but I never had contact with them.

On the night of 3rd May, after having finished work, I planned to meet a group of colleagues at 22.30 to go out. At about 22.17 I received a call from Lyndsey Johnson, the Crèche Manager, informing me that the girl had gone missing. I met Lyndsey and the Service Manager, Amy Tierney, near to the Tapas Bar and we initiated the “Mark Warner procedures for the search of a missing child”.

This procedure involved the distribution of leaflets that had already been prepared, with the names of the locations, for the members of staff, indicating the zones that they should search. Once the location indicated had been searched, the leaflet was returned and another one with a different location was handed over. This procedure was followed by the members of staff, but on that night about 6 residents from the complex were also involved in the search.


I was told who the missing girl was and at the beginning of the procedure went to the McCann’s apartment to obtain the girl’s description and of the clothes she was wearing when she disappeared. When I arrived at the apartment, there was a lady on the terrace, whom I now know to be Kate McCann, accompanied by the wife of one of her friends, David Payne. Kate could not say a word, looked very upset and about to cry. It was Mrs Payne who provided me with the details that I needed.
I returned to the location where the leaflets were being distributed and passed on the information that I had gathered about the missing girl. Lyndsey was busy with the distribution of the leaflets and I went to search in the beach area. On my return I passed by the Duke Pub where I met other members of staff who also joined in the searches.

The hotel manager, John Hill arrived at the location from which the searches were being organised and I can confirm that he called the police. John stayed at the location and I several times went to search the grounds. I went with Amy and we searched the highest part of the complex behind the apartments. The search lasted for about 10 minutes and then we returned. At that moment John asked me to go to the apartment the girl had disappeared from and, on behalf of Mark Warner, provide all the help the family might need.

I went to the McCann’s apartment, entered by the patio doors and introduced myself to Kate and Mrs Payne. I entered the apartment living room and Kate and Mrs Payne stayed in the main bedroom, from where I could hear them both crying.

The twins were still asleep in the children’s bedroom and the door was half open.

A short while later, Gerry returned to the apartment accompanied by Russell. They also entered by the patio doors.

I don not remember the exact sequence of events at this time, but I do remember that I phoned John, who informed me that the police were on their way.

I remember that the police arrived between 00.00 and 00.30, entered by the main door and went to the kitchen with Gerry.

I went to the bedroom where Kate and Mrs Payne were. Kate was still upset, crying and calling Madeleine’s name, shouting “where is she?”
She also banged on the headboard. At that moment I went to check on the twins in their room and they were ok.

I remember being in the main bedroom with Kate, Mrs Payne, Gerry, Russell and David who were sitting on the bed and I sat on the floor. At that moment David suggested that the press should be contacted. Russell disagreed, saying they should keep calm and let the police take care of the situation.

At that moment Kate appeared to lose control, crying and constantly asking “where is she?” whilst banging on the bed.

Gerry remained calm throughout. On one occasion Kate and Gerry both went to the main bedroom and I could hear both of them crying.

Quite a bit later that night I remember the police asking everyone to leave the apartment. I received a call from John informing me that he had arranged for another apartment for the McCanns. I went to reception and helped Lyndsey to move the two cots to the new apartment

The McCanns went to the new apartment and I remember seeing Kate and Mrs Payne seated on the sofa, each holding one of the twins. I left the new apartment at 04.30 in the morning after instructions from John Hill. I was the last to leave, the police had already left, but I left my number saying that I was available for anything that might be needed.

After a short rest I returned to work at 08.00. I did not see Kate or Gerry during the whole morning, but went to the new apartment at about lunchtime. Kate and Gerry were not there but there were other members of the group taking care of the twins.

I remember there were helicopters flying overhead and showing them to the twins.

I remember that both Kate and Gerry were calmer that day and Kate had stopped crying. They were accompanied by family members who had travelled to Portugal and by the local priest. I remember that on the night Madeleine disappeared, Kate wanted to contact the local priest, but it was not possible to reach him by phone.

I remember being present in the apartment with Kate, Gerry and other members of the family when they gave their first press conference. Gerry sat at the table and wrote what he wanted to say to the press and Kate, although she did not want to speak to the press, accompanied Gerry and stood by his side while he read the statement. I and the others stayed at the apartment door to observe.

During the weeks that followed, when Kate and Gerry were still staying in the complex I accompanied them and helped in the preparation of the posters for Gerry and planned the way to take the twins to the crèche without being bothered by the press. Gerry was always calm and polite, whilst Kate could not hide her emotion. At times she appeared reasonably all right at other times she would walk about crying.

In relation to the specific questions, these are my replies:

1. My first meeting with the McCanns occurred when they arrived at the complex and my relationship with them was purely professional as Manager of Client Support services and a s Mark Warner representative.
2) I first spoke to Gerry and Kate McCann at about 23.00 on the night of 3rd May in their apartment after the disappearance of Madeleine.

3) Gerry and Kate said that their daughter had disappeared and that she had been abducted.

4) I would describe Kate’s reaction as hysterical and desperate. Gerry was visibly upset and cried out of our earshot, but he maintained a firm position and helped in all he could.
5) As mentioned previously, their emotional state was one of consternation and despair.


This statement was made by me and is truthful as far as my understanding.
 
Statement about McCanns behaviour at the night Madeleine disappeared.
Source: the police files

I remember that the police arrived between 00.00 and 00.30, entered by the main door and went to the kitchen with Gerry.

Wait, what? The police came 2 to 2,5 hours later than she was first found missing?
 
Wait, what? The police came 2 to 2,5 hours later than she was first found missing?[/QUOTEI

I have seen other statements saying that the police came around 23.00

It might be a confusion between GNR personnel and the PJ.

I've also seen a statement saying that the police was late due to a robbery they had in another near by town.
 
I would suggest that the "new" timeline is definitive proof that there was no intruder.

The reason being, that if there was, Kate had to have seen him. She ran out screaming "they've taken her" at the exact same time she was seen being taken.

On top of everything else, this "coincidence" just defies logic. How did she know?????

I don't follow your logic here. I assume you're referring to the Smith sighting of a man carrying a child at about 10 pm? If so, that sighting was some distance away from the apartment. IF it was an abductor, he must have taken Madeleine at least several minutes before KM entered the apartment and realised that Madeleine was not there.

(As I've said before, I don't think this guy was an abductor anyway, just a dad on his way home with his child.)
 
Statement by a cleaner Natália ....
She says that the keys are kept in special safes for this purpose and when she returns the keys to her superiors they always check that all the keys are there.

During lunchtime, the keys are kept by the cleaners and are not deposited in the safes.

As far as she knows, the laundry only has one copy of each key, thinking that more keys corresponding to the apartments are kept in the reception.


Statement by a cleaner Piedade ....
She says she is not aware of any of her colleagues having problems of a criminal nature, nor vices. She does not know of any strange people having frequented the resort. She says that a lot of new members of staff have been contracted recently and does not know what kind of people they are.

Statements from the maintenance staff also confirm that the keys are kept in a safe, the safe has only one copy of the key, there is a log who currently has the key of which apartment but also that the maintanance staff can keep the keys in their possesions until they complete the work.
The reception also has the key copies.

Regarding the keys, I remember reading somewhere long ago that they are not the usual keys, they operate in bit of a different way, where you have to know how to turn them to lock, unlock etc..
 
another interesting moment in this case

Prince Charles website names suspect in Madeleine McCann case
Submitted by mstar on 30 September, 2007 - 05:35
Posted in

Prince Charles is involved in a dramatic intervention in the Madeleine McCann case according to today's News of the World.

An anonymous e-mail sent to the prince's official website says the three-year-old Madeleine was kidnapped from the Mark Warner Ocean Club holiday resort in Portugal by a disgruntled ex-employee.

The informant named a maid who was sacked from the apartment complex in Praia da Luz and claimed she snatched the child in a revenge plot.
 
What a disgusting bit of journalism. This article makes it appear that Maddy has been found. I am amazed the newspapers can get away with this really.

maddy_zps05d6b360.jpg
 
another interesting moment in this case

I remember that. Obviously false info from someone who had nothing better to do than involve themselves in this tragic case. Ex employee would have been located and Madeleine found if true
 
What a disgusting bit of journalism. This article makes it appear that Maddy has been found. I am amazed the newspapers can get away with this really.

maddy_zps05d6b360.jpg

Disgusting is right. They even made the model to look like Kate. :maddening:
 
Wait, what? The police came 2 to 2,5 hours later than she was first found missing?

I have seen other statements saying that the police came around 23.00

It might be a confusion between GNR personnel and the PJ.

I've also seen a statement saying that the police was late due to a robbery they had in another near by town.

BBM. Yes, two different LE units:

GNR Lagos Precinct (local police):

11.00/11.05 pm - A GNR patrol arrives at Ocean Club (two men);
ca. 11.05 When GNR arrived, Gerry McCann walked to them, kneeled down and put both his hands on the ground and shouted twice, with rage in his voice, saying something that the witnesses close to them could not understand.

11h15/11h20 pm - GNR patrol calls CID in Portimão, reporting a possible kidnapping

CID team:

11h30/11h40 pm A CID team leaves from Portimão to Praia da Luz.
11h40/11h50 pm The CID team arrives at Ocean Club.

When the call was made to CID headquarters, in Portimão (20 miles from Praia da Luz), there was only a stand-by night shift of two CID officers. It's normal, at this time of the year (May...). Population in Algarve multiplies by ten, during summer time. So, Police (GNR, rural police; PSP, urban Police, CID and other emergency services, like paramedics, firemen, etc, etc) is reinforced only 2 weeks before the beginning of summer. The two CID officers called other colleagues that were on a 'medium' stand-by (at home, but ready to be called in an emergency) and a 4 men team (2 CID inspectors, 1 photographer and 1 expert in collecting digital fingerprints) was sent to Ocean Club, arriving there between 11h40 and 11h50 pm. (No link)

Others say: 00.00 am/midnight, police [CID] arrive "The police arrived at around midnight and by that stage we were already out looking. There were uniformed police, plain clothes and even off duty local officers who joined in"

Around midnight, Mr Amaral is informed about the case (GA)

0.10 am police start operation and call PSP, PJ, Border and Immigration Services and Faro Airport.

BBM. Link to source: http://www.mccannfiles.com/id28.html
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
136
Guests online
878
Total visitors
1,014

Forum statistics

Threads
626,021
Messages
18,519,101
Members
240,919
Latest member
SleuthyBootsie
Back
Top