Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread No. 23

[SleuthMom]

Untrue and a nasty nasty comment Sleuthmom. :furious: I thought better of you!!

Waiting a minute and I mean no sarcasm eh? What is nasty about it? I truly feel based on some comments you have made in the past about lynch mobs, witch hunts, etc that those who believe the parents are guilty are only interested in putting these people down and NOT really concerned about Madeleine. That's MY perception. I don't know what is nasty about that?

 

[SleuthMom]

April, I sent you a PM. I think things like this could be dealt in private.

 

[teacherbees]

For sure taking a break :furious: I really cannot deal with the nonsense on here!

Bottom line -
Two parents left three kids under four alone to go get pissed & have a good night! Alone in an unsecured apartment if what they would have us believe is true! An apartment on the main road despite the warnings that complex owners had given about burglaries!

One of those kids went missing, if genuine abduction, wouldn't have happened if parents were not pissed in local Tapas bar! End of!

What kind of people will continue to defend these moronic imbeciles I cannot fathom, what they did is like putting your hand on coals in an open fire & expecting not to get burned!

Wake up & smell the roses which Madeleine will never smell again! The Mccanns killed her, whether by their own hands or by utter negligence! THEY DID IT! they are responsible for whatever happened to a defenceless 3 year old! I bloodywell hope their night of drinking & fun was worth it! I hope that everytime they put a drink in their mouths again, they will think of the ACTUAL COST of their pleasure!

People like these do not deserve the wonderful gift of children which most of us here appreciate & cherish!

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

That says it all for me. Two educated doctors thought more of their own pleasure than taking care of the children they were supposed to protect. Madeleine tried to tell them it was scary and awful being left alone, but they blew her off because they were so selfish they couldn't be moved to care.

Three children - none even four years old and yet they were left alone, night after night. Then when one gets "abducted", those two arrogant, narcissistic jerks have the audacity to act like it's everyone else's fault but theirs.

And what's with the "baby minders are legal abroad" argument? Dr. and Mrs. McCann didn't even bother to use that extremely minimal form of child care! Instead they repeatedly lied about the distance from their Party City to the room where they left their three babies alone.

Jerry and Kate McCann are despicable and terrible parents. If it weren't for their money and connections, they'd be in jail instead of courting public favor and conning people out of hard earned money to pay for their jetsetting and mortgage payments.

 

[Texana]

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

That says it all for me. Two educated doctors thought more of their own pleasure than taking care of the children they were supposed to protect. Madeleine tried to tell them it was scary and awful being left alone, but they blew her off because they were so selfish they couldn't be moved to care.

Three children - none even four years old and yet they were left alone, night after night. Then when one gets "abducted", those two arrogant, narcissistic jerks have the audacity to act like it's everyone else's fault but theirs.

And what's with the "baby minders are legal abroad" argument? Dr. and Mrs. McCann didn't even bother to use that extremely minimal form of child care! Instead they repeatedly lied about the distance from their Party City to the room where they left their three babies alone.

Jerry and Kate McCann are despicable and terrible parents. If it weren't for their money and connections, they'd be in jail instead of courting public favor and conning people out of hard earned money to pay for their jetsetting and mortgage payments.

Amen to that. If they had not been well-connected, they would have been condemned outright from the beginning.

What's the difference between them and two parents on the dole (is that word still used for welfare in Great Britain?) going down to the local pub a few blocks away--and saying they were walking back to check every thirty minutes--and in that half hour span, the house burns down?

 

[Salem]

Amen to that. If they had not been well-connected, they would have been condemned outright from the beginning.

What's the difference between them and two parents on the dole (is that word still used for welfare in Great Britain?) going down to the local pub a few blocks away--and saying they were walking back to check every thirty minutes--and in that half hour span, the house burns down?

There is no real difference Texana - just one of perception by the "powers that be."

Disgusting!

Salem

 

[april4sky]

We have not gone over Mrs. Fenn enough, as we still seem to be a long ways from any kind of conclusion. I can't understand why she would allow that final version to be quoted in the official report if it was in error--given that the McCanns have sued newspapers, don't you think she'd have some fear of being sued as well?

Ditto Kate's notes. They are from her own notebook and verbal responses. There is no argument from the McCann camp on the "checking every thirty minutes."

So again: Someone is wrong. Which one? They can't both be right.

Texana there may never be a conclusion regarding Mrs Fenn.
If we ever get to see everyones statements things may become clearer.
I would never call Mrs Fenn a liar, I think she gave her honest recollections as best she could.
And I don't believe the McCanns lied about what happened that night either.

 

[Tony Bennett]

april4sky wrote: "If we ever get to see everyone's statements things may become clearer".

REPLY: Well, I can agree with that.

One full statement that I would like to see is that of the waiter at the Tapas Bar - the one who spoke publicly to a Portuguese newspaper, and whose testimony very much confirmed Mrs Pamela Fenn's account of the McCanns not being there when Madeleine was crying.

It will be recalled that he said, in terms:

(a) the McCanns and their 'Taps 9' friends were in the Tapas bar boozing night after night,

(b) they all drank copious quantities of alcohol and were very merry,

(c) they did not have any children with them when they were dining,

(d) they were never seen with their children,

(e) they did not leave their table for a few minutes, every half-hour, every hour, or whatever, to check on their children, and

(f) in the light of the above, all the waiters at the Ocean Club assumed that they had no children.

Yes, let us see that full statement, as soon as possible

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[april4sky]

april4sky wrote: "If we ever get to see everyone's statements things may become clearer".

REPLY: Well, I can agree with that.

Wouldn't we all.

But lets not forget the PJ have seen everyones statements and completed their report.

And the result is the McCanns have been formally cleared of involvement in Madeleines disappearance.

 

[Tony Bennett]

april4sky wrote: "And the result is the McCanns have been formally cleared of involvement in Madeleine's disappearance".

REPLY: Now you know perfectly well that that is not a true statement and is not what the Portuguese authorities have actually said

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[april4sky]

april4sky wrote: "And the result is the McCanns have been formally cleared of involvement in Madeleine's disappearance".

REPLY: Now you know perfectly well that that is not a true statement and is not what the Portuguese authorities have actually said

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What I do know perfectly well is that they are no longer arguidos and have been cleared....

.....McCanns and Murat formally cleared in case of missing Madeleine

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/jul/21/madeleinemccann.internationalcrime

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article4373782.ece

Not everyone agrees with you.

 

[SleuthMom]

Well, I see it as a play of words. Whether they have been cleared or not, whether there was no evidence or not enough, the fact remains that they are no longer arguidos unfortunately.

 

[april4sky]

Well, I see it as a play of words. Whether they have been cleared or not, whether there was no evidence or not enough, the fact remains that they are no longer arguidos unfortunately.

Spot on SleuthMom and I was with you until you added "unfortunately"

 

[Texana]

Texana there may never be a conclusion regarding Mrs Fenn.
If we ever get to see everyones statements things may become clearer.
I would never call Mrs Fenn a liar, I think she gave her honest recollections as best she could.
And I don't believe the McCanns lied about what happened that night either.

Well, we have everyone's statements.

Mrs. Fenn said that she heard Madeleine crying for an hour and 15 minutes. That's a specific amount of time, not a "a long time" which could mean anything. If she's watching television or even sitting at a computer, it's easy to keep track of time--especially if it's something distracting or disturbing such as a child continuing to cry and cry. Then she hears the front door of the apartment downstairs open and the parents enter.

As for the McCanns, they specifically said they were checking every thirty minutes.

Mrs. Fenn said she heard Madeleine crying for an hour and 15 minutes. (

One of these two is wrong. One of these statements is not true.

This isn't a matter of opinion as in "I heard yelling" and "I heard a discussion." One says well over an hour left alone; one says every thirty minutes. Mrs. Fenn's account simply could not have happened if the McCanns's statement is the true one.

So again, which one is correct? We're not calling Mrs. Fenn "liar," but one of these two accounts cannot be true.

Which one is true?

 

[twinkiesmom]

Mrs. Fenn has the most credibility of anyone in this case.

 

[SleuthMom]

Spot on SleuthMom and I was with you until you added "unfortunately"

lol I know that. We cannot agree on that one.

 

[Salem]

Mrs. Fenn has the most credibility of anyone in this case.

I agree twinkiesmom! She also had the most integrity, in my opinion. When the press started "attributing" other words to her, she told them to back off, she wasn't going to talk to them and that she had given her statement to the police.

It is hard not to believe her, because she did stand up to the press. I applaud her for that. This case was a media circus at the time and she held her ground. She didn't go looking for that 15 minutes of fame.

Salem

 

[april4sky]

Well, we have everyone's statements.

Mrs. Fenn said that she heard Madeleine crying for an hour and 15 minutes. That's a specific amount of time, not a "a long time" which could mean anything. If she's watching television or even sitting at a computer, it's easy to keep track of time--especially if it's something distracting or disturbing such as a child continuing to cry and cry. Then she hears the front door of the apartment downstairs open and the parents enter.

As for the McCanns, they specifically said they were checking every thirty minutes.

Mrs. Fenn said she heard Madeleine crying for an hour and 15 minutes. (

One of these two is wrong. One of these statements is not true.

This isn't a matter of opinion as in "I heard yelling" and "I heard a discussion." One says well over an hour left alone; one says every thirty minutes. Mrs. Fenn's account simply could not have happened if the McCanns's statement is the true one.

So again, which one is correct? We're not calling Mrs. Fenn "liar," but one of these two accounts cannot be true.

Which one is true?

Texana I refer you back to my answer to this very same question in my previous post to you. As my opinion hasn't changed.

And Mrs Fenns statement refers to the Ist May not the night Madeleine went missing.
Do we know if the McCanns have actually given a different timeline to the PJ for the 1st May?

 

[SleuthMom]

Texana I refer you back to my answer to this very same question in my previous post to you. As my opinion hasn't changed.

So you don't believe the PJ report part where they talk about Mrs Fenn account? :waitasec:

 

[april4sky]

So you don't believe the PJ report part where they talk about Mrs Fenn account? :waitasec:

SleuthMom check out my answer in post 506 as it covers this.

 

[SleuthMom]

April, I just re-read it but still don't understand. Why do you need to read the actual statements when the PJ report was made with Mrs Fenn account and she hasn't complained at all about it?