Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #10

[SMK]

LOL Okie Dokie

(thanks, SMK) :seeya:

ETA: I'd wondered if it was a regional thing or some new word that I'm too old to be hip to

Nope, just my idiosyncrasy!!!:seeya:

 

[SMK]

Another question I had: I had read somewhere, with great interest , that the initial inventory reports did not mention the lamp from Amanda's room, and it was suggested that the lamp was brought into the room by investigators in order to see better. anyone else hear of this?

Here is what I meant:

Mignini and Maresca both implied in their questioning of Amanda that the attempt by Raffaele to break down the door was to retrieve the lamp that they suddenly realized they had left in Meredith's room during the alleged cleanup (after they had locked the door and ditched the keys).

I have seen those that believe in guilt endorse this theory as well. Then again I have seen the same posters claim that Raffaele could have broken down the door if he really wanted to and it was just attempted to show the cops that they had tried.

My personal theory is that the investigators or one of the LE personnel brought the lamp in there to better observe the crime scene and Mignini just decided to use the presence of the lamp against Amanda and Raffaele.

Then there are other theories like the one from DanO's that Meredith borrowed the lamp for some reason.

AND :

So if Meredith borrowed Amanda's lamp after Amanda left on the afternoon of Oct 31, Amanda would not have subsequently been in the cottage at anytime she needed to use the lamp (late evenings and night). Much earlier I posted the theory that Meredith could have borrowed the lamp to put on or photograph the makup for her vampire costume. Meredith herself would not have a chance to return the lamp since she returns very late and is rushed the next day to get ready for the pizza party.

Forums.randi.org/showthread.php?p=7081612

 

[sherlockh]

Massei doesn't mention the lamp all that much so I am not sure if he puts any weight to it. He mentions AK being questioned about it and she says she doesn't pay attention to her own lamp and didn't miss it. She denies kicking the door to try to get the lamp back. LE using the lamp and leaving it on purpose as some kind of evidence is a bit far fetched IMO.

IMO if RS really had wanted to get that lamp then he would have broken in the door. He already damaged the door so why not crack the whole thing open completely? I think they simply forgot about that lamp when they locked the door. The damage at the door could have been caused when they tried to get into MK's bedroom and MK tried to get them out. Maybe she even did lock her door because they were already harassing her. And then when they got violent at the door, a fight started. Who knows?

 

[otto]

Otto---Why do you leap to the idea that RG had to attack MK at the door? It is very reasonable to picture him knocking, and she opening the door, recognizing him as part of the downstairs association, and as they were all gone for the weekend, thinking it was Ok for him to use the restroom briefly. She may have then been surprised when he would not leave, and things escalated from there. I read of a case where a very studious girl opened the door to her neighbor, whom she had only known for a day or 2, as she had just moved in. He raped and killed her.

Meredith was not some starry eyed, naive new visitor in Europe. It was home to her. If some guy she met once or twice came banging on the door when she was home alone, late at night, and she had studying to do ... why would she open the door. Her sister studied in Italy and would have told her about dangers and risks ... like druggies squaters. Instead of having to argue why she wouldn't open the door, I would like to know why she would open the door. Amanda ... sure ... she had the "american college atmosphere" argument on her side ... she would come home to an open door and not think anything. I simply don't believe that Meredith was that stupid.

 

[otto]

But RG wasn't unknown to MK. He was a friend of her boyfriend's, he and MK may have met at a party. We simply don't know whether she would have trusted him or not.

And while RG had less reason to stage a break-in than a resident of the apartment, what matters is what he may have thought he needed to do to distance himself from the crime.

In both instances, we are dealing with subjective impressions we can't know for sure (because MK is dead and RG has reason to lie).

This whole discussion is quite entertaining for me. It's been argued high and low for ages that although Amanda met Rudy at least three times ... they were strangers ... they were not friends ... they would never do drugs together on the night of the murder!!! Now we have Meredith. I only know of two times that she encountered Rudy ... and here it is argued that Meredith and Rudy were such good buddies that she would open her door while she was home along to let him poop in her roommates bathroom.

Unbelievable!

 

[SMK]

Meredith was not some starry eyed, naive new visitor in Europe. It was home to her. If some guy she met once or twice came banging on the door when she was home alone, late at night, and she had studying to do ... why would she open the door. Her sister studied in Italy and would have told her about dangers and risks ... like druggies squaters. Instead of having to argue why she wouldn't open the door, I would like to know why she would open the door. Amanda ... sure ... she had the "american college atmosphere" argument on her side ... she would come home to an open door and not think anything. I simply don't believe that Meredith was that stupid.

Well, I guess I am just an airheaded American like Amanda, because I would surely have opened the door for Rudy!!!:snooty::snooty:
:cautionDrunk:

 

[otto]

Otto---Why do you leap to the idea that RG had to attack MK at the door? It is very reasonable to picture him knocking, and she opening the door, recognizing him as part of the downstairs association, and as they were all gone for the weekend, thinking it was Ok for him to use the restroom briefly. She may have then been surprised when he would not leave, and things escalated from there. I read of a case where a very studious girl opened the door to her neighbor, whom she had only known for a day or 2, as she had just moved in. He raped and killed her.

Tell me again ... why would Meredith open the door after dark so Rudy could use her roommate's toilet?

 

[claudicici]

It still doesn't explain why she'd stage a crime scene if she had nothing to do with the murder.

I don't think she staged the crime scene.I think RG did.
I believe she was wasted that night.You know those mornings you wake up and you don't remember anything? You feel confused and ashamed and you're kind of like "what the hell happened?" so she went home to take a shower and saw the door open and a dead Meredith.I imagine her confused,like do I have something to do with this?No way.
so she locks the door.

 

[SMK]

Tell me again ... why would Meredith open the door after dark so Rudy could use her roommate's toilet?

*DEEP SIGH*
Because. in her innocent and decent mind. he would have been a nice fellow. one of the boys from downstairs, as Massei said, who loved to socialize with the girls and the guys. And he would INNOCENTLY be saying, "Hey, sorry to bother you, the guys aren't home, may I use the restroom real quick before I leave???????????????:loser:

 

[otto]

We both have daughters, otto, and we'd both like to believe they wouldn't be so foolish as to open their doors to casual acquaintances. But we also know that college-age kids do so all the time, which is one of the reasons why rape rates are so high on college campuses. Perhaps things are different in Europe, but I have trouble believing people in late adolescence are that much different in Western cultures on the two continents.

As for the footprints, I know you are accurately summarizing what has been reported. My problem is that so much of the investigation appears to have been done by the Keystone Kops, I don't know what to believe of what we are told.

I have two daughters who graduated high school in Switzerland. Trust me ... they are street smart about living in Europe and don't open the door to someone banging on the door when they were alone. In fact, their level of maturity, after schooling is Europe, compared to NA students their age, was very obvious.

 

[SMK]

I have two daughters who graduated high school in Switzerland. Trust me ... they are street smart about living in Europe and don't open the door to someone banging on the door when they were alone. In fact, their level of maturity, after schooling is Europe, compared to NA students their age, was very obvious.

But Rudy, according to the Motivation report, was not someone banging on the door. He was one of the crowd who enjoyed the social scene at the cottage, and he most likely knocked gently, and was apologetic.
:loser::loser::loser::nono::nono::nono:

 

[jjenny]

Otto, you hit the nail right on the head. I am also very confused-why are Amanda's supporters claiming MK led Rudy in all of the sudden? Before they were arguing that broken window surely points to the fact that he climbed in.

 

[SMK]

Otto, you hit the nail right on the head. I am also very confused-why are Amanda's supporters claiming MK led Rudy in all of the sudden? Before they were arguing that broken window surely points to the fact that he climbed in.

No, maybe he staged it. :snooty:

 

[jjenny]

I don't think she staged the crime scene.I think RG did.
I believe she was wasted that night.You know those mornings you wake up and you don't remember anything? You feel confused and ashamed and you're kind of like "what the hell happened?" so she went home to take a shower and saw the door open and a dead Meredith.I imagine her confused,like do I have something to do with this?No way.
so she locks the door.

Well if RG staged anything, he must have been a truly horrible stager, considering he left a lot of evidence that led right to his apprehension. One would think that if he had time to stage, he'd try to at least flash the toilet first, and try to clean up his foot prints and hand print, rather than go breaking windows for no apparent reason.

 

[jjenny]

No, maybe he staged it. :snooty:

RG left a hand print, foot prints, and DNA on the scene. If he was staging anything, he got to be the worst stager in the world.

 

[SMK]

RG left a hand print, foot prints, and DNA on the scene. If he was staging anything, he got to be the worst stager in the world.

well, he was likely high and in a panic....anic:

 

[otto]

*DEEP SIGH*
Because. in her innocent and decent mind. he would have been a nice fellow. one of the boys from downstairs, as Massei said, who loved to socialize with the girls and the guys. And he would INNOCENTLY be saying, "Hey, sorry to bother you, the guys aren't home, may I use the restroom real quick before I leave???????????????:loser:

So, even though she had met him twice (that I know of) they were buddies and she would welcome him into the cottage at night, when she was alone, so he could poop in her roommate's toilet. But when it comes to Amanda and Raffaele partying hard with Rudy and things went so wrong Meredith was murdered ... it's not possible because Amanda didn't know Rudy.

Something about this isn't making sense to me.

 

[jjenny]

well, he was likely high and in a panic....anic:

I still fail to see any reason why he would break a window.
He did not live there. Him breaking a window would not divert suspicion away from him.

 

[Nova]

Meredith was not some starry eyed, naive new visitor in Europe. It was home to her. If some guy she met once or twice came banging on the door when she was home alone, late at night, and she had studying to do ... why would she open the door. Her sister studied in Italy and would have told her about dangers and risks ... like druggies squaters. Instead of having to argue why she wouldn't open the door, I would like to know why she would open the door. Amanda ... sure ... she had the "american college atmosphere" argument on her side ... she would come home to an open door and not think anything. I simply don't believe that Meredith was that stupid.

This is all pure speculation on your part, otto. You don't know how well MK thought she knew RG or how close she thought RG was to her boyfriend. You don't know what RG might have told her to gain entrance, but you're always portraying MK as a saint, so surely she would open her door to a friend of a friend who claimed to be ill!

I don't know that any of this happened, but pretending that we can know it did not happen is just that: pretending. If this is the sort of reasoning on which AK and RS were convicted, then we have a gross miscarriage of justice here indeed!

 

[otto]

Otto, you hit the nail right on the head. I am also very confused-why are Amanda's supporters claiming MK led Rudy in all of the sudden? Before they were arguing that broken window surely points to the fact that he climbed in.

I guess it is becoming apparent that the only way to argue Rudy climbed in the window is to accept that some glass would have fallen on the ground ... and the only way to explain the absence of glass on the ground is to suggest that investigators simply didn't bother to investigate the ground below the window? Not sure.

Rudy did walk in through the front door, but it was not Meredith that let him in. That has been attributed to Amanda ... Amanda with the "college atmosphere" attitude who treated her home as a drug pad.