MI - 4 students killed, 6 injured, shooting at Oxford High School, 30 Nov 2021 *Arrest incl parents*

[Doghairrules]

They were supposed to turn themselves in over 7 hours ago and withdrew 4000.00 in cash.

Right. And it’s now hours after their attorney said that and still no parents…

 

[passionflower]

They will make a mistake like using a credit card, atm or something. Wonder if lawyer knows where they are? Could be in any state. Have to get gas, eat and bed down. BOLO for vehicle, might have to switch cars from family or friends?

 

[Cinna]

I just can't get over the "don't do it" text from the mom. Regardless of whether she meant don't kill yourself or don't kill student, why TEXT?? If I thought my son was going to kill himself, I would think that would rate an actual phone call. Same if I thought he was going to kill others. A text? Seriously?

Maybe she tried to call and he didn't answer. But even then, I would be texting him <modsnip>

 

[Doghairrules]

Even if the sheriff did know though, the idea of holding a press conference to announce charges before you know for a fact the suspects are in custody, just seems like a massive error.

I can't think of any good reason why you would do something like that.

Why rush?

Yes I certainly agree with that.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

My speculation only:
And when the parents push back and say "oh he's a good kid we have no problems at home. Just do your damn job." And they don't offer that they just bought him a gun. And there is no other evidence except the day before and the day of?

It's like progressive discipline at work. You jump to fast to termination and you get sued for wrongful termination. Do we know that the parents didn't threaten legal action over the edict that he get counseling within 48 hours as a form of defamation? We don't. Let's see if more doesn't come out about that conversation. Then we can parse blame.

Under any other circumstance I would except that as a reasonable explanation not to take further actions, but this drawing is disturbing and has reached the level of necessitating action even if there is no prior history, even under the threat of legal action by the parents. MOO

 

[Snoopster]

I'm sure that Canadian border patrol will have been alerted to the situation by FBI, Homeland Security, or similar US government authorities. JMO.

I've told this story once before here on WS, but can't resist to tell it again, just for some levity, in contrast to the tragedy.
We live just off the highway that runs from Detroit to Toronto, through SW Ontario. A number of years ago our family (including our 2 young kids) were attending a community event at an indoor golf driving range. My spouse went out to the parking lot to have a smoke. A young man, driving a rental car from Michigan, approached him and asked him where the nearest hotel was, as he'd had to pull off the highway due to heavy snow. They got to chatting and my husband invited him to stay overnight at our house. My husband came back in and told me we had a guest for the night. I asked him who. He pointed to the young man, now sitting off to the side watching the event. Well, I was pretty naive and trusting, but, with my two young kids I felt a bit protective. I asked my husband if he had seen the 48 Hours shows where the fugitive crosses the border into Canada!? I told a neighbour friend about the situation and gave her a 'code word' in case I called later and needed help.

The end result was that this young man (originally from Malaysia, but heading from Minnesota to upper NY state to futher his graduate studies in graphic design) was an amazing guest. He played video games with our sons and we had wonderful discussions. He ended up working at IBM, where my husband worked. We kept in contact for 1o years or so.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could get back to trusting people? Of course I won't now because I've read too many stories here on WS!!

 

[Doghairrules]

I'm not sure what crimes you are talking about? I don't know about the terms of the court appearance, so are they fugitives, has there been a warrant for their arrest?

Do we have proof, or only gossip, (social media) if this was a gift to their son. I had originally heard it was the father's gun, and the son only said again on social media that it was a gift to him. And if so, in my rural area, young people do receive guns as gifts, it doesn't mean that they are immediately responsible, but the parents in my area take their children hunting or gun practice. It's not an immediate inheritant skill the children have but is learned. Since the gun was only bought recently, maybe dad was going to teach skills of how to handle the gun to his son?

As far as mom's text, don't do it, I truly feel that was a gut reaction after the school meeting that morning, possibly she saw something in his attitude that seemed defeated. Don't do it could have meant, don't hurt yourself?

I am truly at a lost why you would bring into the conversation about the fathers child support for his older children? If you follow any kind of law, or in the court, that is inadmissible because it isn't even relevant to the case. This is why, if I ever did anything wrong to be tried in court, I would only choose to be judged by a judge, not a jury. I am honestly astounded by the response tonight. I pray our justice system prevails and crimes will be tried, if guilty, punished, but no one will be swept into incarceration by public opinion alone. Let the facts decide. MOO

Please, please watch the press conference and all of your questions will be answered. It’s been linked throughout the thread, at least once in reply to one of your posts.

 

[TTF14]

Per the DA press conference, they are being charged with a crime/ manslaughter because they left the gun in a bedside table, they did not properly secure it and a minor used it to commit murder. They were negligent in their responsibility as a gun owner.

That is not at all what she said. In fact, she said Michigan has no such law that mandates locking up guns.

 

[JJ Ray]

So help me out please, didn't I read up thread that the parents actually left their residence on the night of the murders? And that the only contact was via Zoom to set the arraignment date/time. So in essence no one really knew where they were; DA, attorneys, Sheriff. Now that they didn't show, the emergency warrant ran bank records, etc. to find out the withdrawals, and pings before phones turned off? I'm not sure waiting until they were located would do much in terms of if the charges were announced or not. Thanks.

 

[passionflower]

Did any of the couples friends get interviewed.? Did they belong to gun clubs?relatives out of state? One report mentioned the state of Washington.

 

[TTF14]

That’s interesting because the heavy article said she worked for a realtor that immediately took her off their website when the shootings happened.

Was she actually a realtor though? Maybe just an office manager or something at this point without a license?

 

[Dontknow?]

Even if the sheriff did know though, the idea of holding a press conference to announce charges before you know for a fact the suspects are in custody, just seems like a massive error.

I can't think of any good reason why you would do something like that.

Why rush?

I'm curious of the reason why the Sheriff's department was dissed. Terribly curious.

jmo

 

[bestill]

That is not at all what she said. In fact, she said Michigan has no such law that mandates locking up guns.

Which to me makes it even more odd they didn't show up for their arraignment and try to fight the charges, now they are fugitives on the run - this will not help them out at all. JMO

 

[Doghairrules]

Was she actually a realtor though? Maybe just an office manager or something at this point without a license?

I will look for the link again and double check but I believe her listing on the website described the kinds of properties she specialized in. Going to look for the link now.

eta below, but it does say higher up in the article that her license was expired. So weird.


Jennifer Crumbley, Ethan Crumbley’s Mother: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know

Crumbley was listed as a real estate agent, but the company removed her staff bio in the day after the shooting. Here is her deleted profile:

 

[StarryStarryNight]

It is pretty shocking that these parents would choose to ignore signs that their son was psychologically unstable instead of getting him help.
Shocking again that after the school calls you in to view disturbing images your child has drawn you decline to take him home.
The mistakes the school made were after the parents refused to take him home. Mistake one was not checking his backpack. Mistake two was sending him back to class, they should have kept him in the office of an assistant principal and under an administrators eye for the rest of the day. Then they should have suspended him…surely those drawings could be deemed a threat…and forced the parents hand.
The apparent fact that the parents have decided to run, instead of trying to help their son or face the music, pretty much says it all about their parenting skills.

 

[bestill]

Breaking!! Wanted since yesterday
https://twitter.com/USMarshalsHQ/status/1466980265566388225?s=20

 

[bestill]

My take on this is that US Marshals have lost them

 

[Betty P]

So help me out please, didn't I read up thread that the parents actually left their residence on the night of the murders? And that the only contact was via Zoom to set the arraignment date/time. So in essence no one really knew where they were; DA, attorneys, Sheriff. Now that they didn't show, the emergency warrant ran bank records, etc. to find out the withdrawals, and pings before phones turned off? I'm not sure waiting until they were located would do much in terms of if the charges were announced or not. Thanks.

That's what their attorney claims. At this point, I don't believe anything that attorney is saying.

News stories linked above have reported that LE was monitoring the parents in the motel where they were staying. They were being watched. The problem was that the state LE mistakenly thought the parents weren't going to be charged with anything, didn't bother to ask anyone in the prosecutors office, FBI, etc. and left their guard post. Another LE agency (I think they were taking turns) came by to guard them, but found they had left.

So, regardless of when they left their home, LE had them under surveillance from that time until the state police messed up.

 

[Puzzles]

From the New York Times, 35 minutes ago:

"...School officials told the parents during the in-person meeting that they were required to seek counseling for their son, Ethan, Ms. McDonald said. The teenager’s parents did not want their son to be removed from school that day, and did not ask him whether he had the gun with him or search the backpack he brought with him to the office, Ms. McDonald said..."
BBM

The school principal showed the parents a note, written by their son the morning on the shooting, in which he depicted an image of a gun and a person who had been shot twice.
He included the words:
"Blood everywhere” and “The thoughts won’t stop. Help me.”

The alleged shooter is a 15-year-old child. A child whose parents and school principal had ample evidence upon viewing the note that he was possibly/probably/actually experiencing a severe mental crisis. He was definitely asking for help.

In a country where school shootings occur with chilling frequency, no help was offered. No intervention was implemented. No attempt was made to avert the subsequent tragedy.

Why?

Because the parents didn't want him their son to be removed from the school that day. And school officials saw fit to have him return to class, in spite of recognizing he needed help. They simply admonished the parents to seek counselling for him. Not now. Later.

I'm staggered by the demonstrated negligence of all the adults in the room. I'm stunned by their ignorance.





Facing Charges, Parents of Michigan Shooting Suspect Are Now Fugitives

 

[Snoopster]

Breaking!! Wanted since yesterday
https://twitter.com/USMarshalsHQ/status/1466980265566388225?s=20

Well that doesn't exactly line up with what their attorney said.
The US Marshals wouldn't be posting that they are 'wanted' at this late hour (tweet is from 7 minutes ago) if there was an actual contact between the parents and LE.

(I'm back to patrolling the highway into Canada! j/k )