MN - George Floyd, 46, died in police custody, Minneapolis, 25 May 2020 #12 - Chauvin Trial Day 9

[ilovewings]

Sniped by me.

From everything we've learned, Officers are trained to assess that kind of risk, a reasonable Officer should be able to know the possible implications of their actions but that's just MOO.

You said that so well- I was trying to figure out how to say what you said--- that is exactly the key---A reasonable officer who had been properly trained, would know or should have known the potential implications of their actions, in this case, a knee on the neck of a prone person, handcuffed, on the street.

 

[Katerz]

https://twitter.com/DannySpewak/status/1380196033075023876

Dr. Tobin says he was able to calculate that George Floyd lost all of his oxygen at 8:25:41 p.m. on May 25, 2020, but Chauvin's "knee remained on his neck for another three minutes and two seconds after we reach the point where there’s not one ounce of oxygen left in the body.”

View attachment 291890

So sad. So so sad.

 

[Katerz]

“A HEALTHY person would have died”.

 

[ilovewings]

If this witness holds up under cross examination, his testimony is absolutely devastating to the defense.

 

[Katerz]

Nelson seems a little nervous during this testimony.

 

[Gibbo214]

I cant imagine what they thought the end result was going to be. How much longer were they going to keep it going? You really do have to wonder if he was just showing the bystanders that he was the boss and he was not taking orders from them. MOO.

 

[CrimeAway]

The medical testimony is what Nelson is banking on the most so it’ll be really interesting now that we’re getting away from police use of force and getting into cause of death. I suspect Nelson will try to get this witness to say how the drugs and GF’s heart conditions would have slowed down his breathing more than normal before Chauvin put his knee on him. But he still won’t get past the hurdle that but for Chauvin putting his knee on him he wouldn’t have died in that exact moment.

I agree with most of your post, but I think that your last statement, beginning with, But... is still your opinion at this point, and hasn't been definitively established as fact at this point IMO

(How do I bold a portion of a quoted post?)

 

[ilovewings]

Nelson seems a little nervous during this testimony.

I would be too if I were him: I like all of the questions asked by the prosecution, especially the question about putting a covid patient prone--- The good doctor explained why putting a patient with pneumonia in a prone position is a whole different thing than putting a perp prone on the ground, handcuffed.

 

[JerseyGirl]

JB: Do you have an opinion to a reasonable degree of medical certainty as to whether...a healthy person would have died of the same circumstances as Mr. Floyd?
DT: Yes, a healthy person subjected to what Mr. Floyd was subjected to would have died as a result...

https://twitter.com/anavilastra/status/1380197769474887688?s=21

JB: ...If you can speak you can breathe. Is that a true statement.
DT: Yes. It's a true statement, but it gives you an enormous false sense of security, certainly at the moment you're speaking, you're breathing, but it doesn't tell you you're going to be breathing 5 secs later.

Dr. Tobin notes George Floyd continued to speak for 4 min & 51 secs from the time the knee is placed on his neck.

"It tells us that there could not have been complete compression could not have been total occlusion of the neck."

Dr. Tobin: If you stop the flow of oxygen to the brain you lose consciousness in eight seconds.

Dr. Tobin: It tells you how dangerous is the concept of..."if you can speak, you can breathe." Yes, that is true on the surface, but highly misleading...a very dangerous mantra to have out there.

 

[ilovewings]

I agree with most of your post, but I think that your last statement, beginning with, But... is still your opinion at this point, and hasn't been definitively established as fact at this point IMO

(How do I bold a portion of a quoted post?)

I think the defense v the prosecution will have experts which will present the cause of death most beneficial to their position. It will be up to the jury which experts they believe. I believe but for the knee on the neck of Mr. Floyd he would still be with us.

 

[Sleuther12345]

Oh wow. The fear in GF’s eyes in the lower right picture is heartbreaking. The knee is very clearly on his neck and also pushing his face into the pavement IMO.

That picture OMG poor George Floyd it really slams it home.

 

[Niner]

Cathy Russon
@cathyrusson
·
5m
#DerekChauvinTrial - Dr. Tobin shows this visual of a study that was done on the effect of the prone maximal restraint position.
"The pressure per sq inch exerted by a knee on the back is 10 times greater than reported in San Diego studies"




link: https://twitter.com/cathyrusson



@Chelly - only if you are around - if you want to do Cathy's tweets. I'm leaving....

 

[Hennarincess]

429 seconds. That is so powerful! Think of all the decisions we make in a split second.

429 seconds

429 seconds......... say it out loud and think about how long that is. Wow![/QUO

This testimony seems compelling. However, I have thought that before... so will just wait until it's over!

I need to go back and catch the first half hour of his testimony later.

https://twitter.com/DannySpewak/status/1380196033075023876

Dr. Tobin says he was able to calculate that George Floyd lost all of his oxygen at 8:25:41 p.m. on May 25, 2020, but Chauvin's "knee remained on his neck for another three minutes and two seconds after we reach the point where there’s not one ounce of oxygen left in the body.”

View attachment 291890

Wondering exactly when cops will redirect themselves towards the correct side of history because their reputation is in the toilet.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

I want this doctor to explain why GF couldn't breathe before Chauvin put his knee on neck/shoulder.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

RSBM I don't think that intent can be inferred from this (IMO), especially if the officers were not aware of the potential implications of this.....After all, Graham vs Connor says that the reasonableness of force should be judged based not from the view of a lay person, or a respiratory specialist, but,
"from the perspective of a reasonable officer, on the scene, rather than with the 20/20 vision of hindsight."

Graham v. Connor - Wikipedia

Graham v. Connor, 490 U.S. 386 (1989)

Well, we KNOW that Lane questioned multiple times, was concerned and concerned and concerned... MOO and he and Keung got off him when no pulse. So "based on lay person"... we already know that Lane was concerned, and he and Keung were off him vs. still on him until ambulance guy had Chauvin off of him. OO

 

[MsBetsy]

They just showed the picture of Floyd's waist moving up and down and the last 7 or 8 breaths he took. This was around 8:25, when one of the officers saw that he was passed out.

 

[missy1974]

thanks all for the updates... I got stuck on the phone and now have to work for an hour or so

I think this is all very compelling, BUT, I can already hear some of Nelson's questions.

Crime.. highlight what you want to bold and either hit CTRL + B or hit the B at the top of message window.

 

[Algo214]

"His breathing was normal, not what you'd expect with fentanyl" (paraphrased)

This is over.

 

[CrimeAway]

I cant imagine what they thought the end result was going to be. How much longer were they going to keep it going? You really do have to wonder if he was just showing the bystanders that he was the boss and he was not taking orders from them. MOO.

That was my very first thought when I saw the bystander video. I guess we will never know for sure.
I don't think that DC left home that day wanting to contribute to someone's death. This is the worst nightmare for most LEOs IMO.

I also don't think that Mr Floyd went out that evening as a master fraudster who wanted to tussle with police. I think he was a struggling individual, who made foolish decisions, and was taken advantage of by his "friends". Then he encounters 2 rookie officers, and 2 more senior officers, with a chequered past. Everything goes down from there.

Sigh, I just wish that this whole tragic event had never happened

 

[MsBetsy]

I want this doctor to explain why GF couldn't breathe before Chauvin put his knee on neck/shoulder.

He was already having trouble breathing before they ever tried to put him in the car. It could have been from anxiety. He kept saying he was scared and claustrophobic.