MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #19

[CuriousGuy]

Huh? Why would you think that from the info in the above link? I am not seeing any such indication. Can you explain your claim?

Looks like a question to me, not a claim

 

[EvilSoup]

More than a dozen, to stick with what's been reported. Frydaddy, sonjay, K_Z and many others have made well reasoned posts as to what has made various witness reports appear suspect and unreliable. Many facts, such as obstructions, distance and math, the autopsy report, and conflicts within their own statements have been discussed and solid logic applied.

But, many posters who have stood behind THOSE witness accounts have scoffed at other witness accounts as unreliable. So that would mean the witness statements that support their "side" are also flawed. But of course, feathers get ruffled in pointing out logic.

Since i was not there, I will wait to see what the GJ finds.

 

[EvilSoup]

Looks like a question to me, not a claim

Yeah. That's been covered??????

(Clever punctuation)

 

[EvilSoup]

More than a dozen, to stick with what's been reported. Frydaddy, sonjay, K_Z and many others have made well reasoned posts as to what has made various witness reports appear suspect and unreliable. Many facts, such as obstructions, distance and math, the autopsy report, and conflicts within their own statements have been discussed and solid logic applied.

Opinions are not facts. They simply aren't.

 

[CuriousGuy]

My point was that the orbital fracture was espoused in post after post as proof of MB's animal brute behavior. The orbital fracture was treated as FACT. When, in fact, it is not a fact.

Throwing feces at a wall just to see what sticks is not proof of anything, except how gullible people are in the absence of facts.

"Throwing feces at a wall just to see what sticks is not proof of anything, except how gullible people are in the absence of facts."

Can you please deliver this message to Mr. Crump and the MSM?

 

[Linda7NJ]

Opinions are not facts. They simply aren't.

I am confused as to why even participate if waiting for the opinion of the GJ?

Surely, the goal is to try to ferret out the truth ...that's why we are all here, no?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Muffet]

Honestly, I don't care one way or the other in making my opinion...fracture or not...I'm totally convinced there was a serious struggle in that police vehicle for control over Officer Wilson's weapon.

I will never believe in a million years, and I don't feel anyone with an IQ over 70, would believe Officer Wilson grabbed Brown by the throat and attempted to drag him onto his lap while he was sitting.

That combined "fact" along with the eyewitness accounts and autopsy prove to me that Brown came toward Wilson and was facing him and moving forward when he was fatally shot.

Justified shoot 100%

IMO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, plus there's Mike Brady's "punching" moves interview. Poor guy lives right there.

Isn't he the only one other than DJ who has reported that they saw the "tussell" at the car?

 

[Truthy]

I don't know how to directly link to documents on Scribd. But there is an interesting document called: "General Order 406.00 - Ferguson Police Department Policy on Incident Reports"

I don't belong to or subscribe to Scribd but I do have the app so I can read things. If I go to scribd.com, I can enter "General Order 406.00" in the search box and the document will appear near the top in a short list of items.

It doesn't seem to me like the Ferguson Police Department has followed its own policies in this case. Of course I could be wrong, i could be misreading the policies.

From everything I have read, they are not following FPD policies. Lawsuits are coming, IMHO. I thought we always loved the Sunshine law around here?

MOO

 

[katydid23]

I wonder what the Grand Jury will think if the majority of the evidence is exculpatory? Will they ask themselves "Why are we hearing this case?".

They are locals, so they know exactly why they are hearing this case, imo.

 

[Truthy]

I am confused as to why even participate if waiting for the opinion of the GJ?

Surely, the goal is to try to ferret out the truth ...that's why we are all here, no?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Because after the opinion of the GJ is the first time we will actually see REAL evidence reports, and not third hand accounts from GF's GF or a friend of someone working for the police. It's all pretty much third hand info, to me it's all gossip.
Can't be sure of anything until real evidence is presented. Well... others can, but I think ANYTHING is possible.

 

[tlcya]

Orbital fracture: unconfirmed IMO simply means unconfirmed. It means RUMOR, not fact, not false, RUMOR. JMO.

What is confirmed: A blow to the face, also referred to as a punch, facial injury of unspecified nature, an ER visit, swollen face. All ove the aforementioned have been stated by the FPD.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Orbital fracture: unconfirmed IMO simply means unconfirmed. It means RUMOR, not fact, not false, RUMOR. JMO.

What is confirmed: A blow the face, facial injury of unspecified nature, an ER visit, swollen face. All ove the aforementioned have been stated by the FPD.

Which means that officer Wilson was assaulted.

 

[Truthy]

Many facts, such as obstructions, distance and math, the autopsy report, and conflicts within their own statements have been discussed and solid logic applied.

There's a completed autopsy that has been released? I can't find anything on that. Weird!

 

[katydid23]

Opinions are not facts. They simply aren't.

But one can take a factual look at someones witness testimony and see FACTUAL ERRORS, right?

 

[Muffet]

I agree, that is not good. Did that happen here? I have my opinion, but we have not got the forensics, we don't have any testimony given to GJ and we don't know if the GJ is even allowed to consider interviews they saw with possible testifiers but IF they are aware of certain (IMO) changes to accounts as more facts came to light and other witnesses chimed in, I cannot imagine it would be easy to ignore if the sworn testimony was differing in glaring ways to previous accounts jurors might be aware of.

I know one thing as fact. I do not envy this jury having to deliberate this particular shooting. Talk about pressure and much of it having little to do with truth or justice. JMO.

Very good question, tlc. Since the GJ isn't sequestered, they could be aware of witness statements made to the media. I wonder how much they'd evaluate and or use those in determining credibility or whatever.

 

[katydid23]

There's a completed autopsy that has been released? I can't find anything on that. Weird!

Badens report was released.

 

[katydid23]

Because after the opinion of the GJ is the first time we will actually see REAL evidence reports, and not third hand accounts from GF's GF or a friend of someone working for the police. It's all pretty much third hand info, to me it's all gossip.
Can't be sure of anything until real evidence is presented. Well... others can, but I think ANYTHING is possible.

But the police spokesman CONFIRMED that Josies version of events was pretty accurate. So that elevates it above gossip, imo.

 

[Klood-N]

Which, if any of these have been confirmed by the people conducting the investigation
Given one was from the prosecutor's office, one from St Louis County LE, and one source close to the department's brass (among others), the statements may have come from or been confirmed by said individuals.
I must have missed the investigative findings as released to the public.
"As reported by sources close to LE" is not the same as a definitive report on the investigation.
I've not seen one person argue that media reports are the same thing as the final investigative report. At the same time, it is a fact it's been reported by multiple news agencies. It's a fact it's been reported by multiple sources. And therefore, we're welcome to discuss and consider them.

MSM cannot even use proper spelling and grammar, much less fact-check.
And these means that 1)each of these agencies are lying about having sources? 2). They're lying about what those sources said? 3). They did not confirm who the source was? Or?? From your series of posts, I truly cannot tell what the complaint is irt media on these stories.
I re-assert that i will wait for the GJ to make a statement before I jump on any bandwagon. But I understand how some do not feel a need to see evidence before making up their minds. I'm just not one of those.

I haven't seen any "bandwagons" here, just people using facts, logic, deductive reasoning, etc and discussing opinions. Most cases are circumstantial and rely on those as well. I don't think there's any requirement here to not state or create an opinion until x point or that you must form one after y point. Seems it'd be a lot more productive to discuss media reports, information, etc than each other.

 

[Truthy]

My point was that the orbital fracture was espoused in post after post as proof of MB's animal brute behavior. The orbital fracture was treated as FACT. When, in fact, it is not a fact.

Throwing feces at a wall just to see what sticks is not proof of anything, except how gullible people are in the absence of facts.

True- I am getting confused by posters citing anonymous, third hand gossip as fact, not opinion, as they should. It's not very helpful, IMHO.

 

[Klood-N]

There's a completed autopsy that has been released? I can't find anything on that. Weird!

Probably because exactly no one said "completed".