Nancy Guthrie, 84, (mother of TODAY Show host Savannah Guthrie) missing - last seen in the Catalina foothills area on Jan 31, 2026

[louvillian08]

Or could it have just simply been left out initially bc early on it hadn't yet been verified.

Since then it's been verified but they haven't felt the need to clarify bc it doesn't affect the timeline of pertinent events.

Didn't show up for church, family looked for her and called 911

Could be just that simple

Exactly this. If anything, the more relevant time would be the time of the church service she missed.

I think LE knows that whatever happened, happened around 2am. So they’re not focusing on the details of the call because it’s largely irrelevant to the pertinent timeframe. MOO

 

[mikeshanty]

With all respect, we are not law enforcement, judges, prosecutors, or jury members. In a discussion, it's welcome, imo, to share personal opinions and experiences. Maybe some ideas are off-mark, but maybe some are insightful.

Brainstorming and thinking together can be messy or cloudy sometimes. It's okay.

jmo

Agreed, but there needs to be some more sensible judgment. A burst water pipe, as an example, clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with the investigation.

 

[shonyakay]

Am I missing something? That document says "contacted," not "called."

View attachment 642965

I think contact could mean a phone call but I think it is interesting that the complaint says contacted and notified. Why not just say called and notified?

 

[su5ie]

If the ransomers are independent of the crime-sceners, the ransomers got really lucky that the crime scene is not inconsistent with a kidnapping, that there was apparently no proof of death at the home AND neither NG nor her body have turned up this whole time. Ransomers IMO seem pretty confident that they had a whole week+ to extort money from the family with no risk of a discovery (NG/body) defeating their threat.

JMO

Scammers don't think as abstract as that . They pick their target and if it fruitful, happy pay day if not they move onto next target . The second demand and deadline came in because they know more details and they know that in the media its reported that the case is not a straightforward process. This buys the scammer more time to extract money from a grieving family imo jmo

 

[Ellis' Mom]

I believe this is what people are talking about. The family was contacted by a friend when Ms Guthrie was missed at church that morning. https://www.justice.gov/usao-az/media/1426976/dl?inline

View attachment 642961

Thank you for providing the pertinent portion of the file!

 

[Napoli]

I am pretty sure after a certain amount of time has elapsed that the authorities will declare a missing person deceased, especially when it involves a case like this.

In Arizona, a missing person is generally presumed dead after a continuous, unexplained absence of five years. According to A.R.S. § 14-1107, this applies when the person has not been heard from and a diligent search or inquiry has failed to explain their absence.
Key details regarding declaring a missing person dead in Arizona:

• Five-Year Rule: The statutory presumption of death requires a five-year period of absence.
• Earlier Declaration: If there is sufficient evidence of death (e.g., a witness to a fatal incident, a car wreck without a body), a court can declare a person dead sooner than five years.
• Procedure: A petition must be filed in probate court to legally declare the person dead and handle their estate, note asimoulaw.com and asimoulaw.com.
• Alternative: Before the five-year mark, families can pursue a conservatorship to manage the missing person's assets.

 

[Sadi]

Retired FBI special agent on Hidden Killers says, "Culprit someone who had access to Nancy's house in the last 6 months or year at the longest. Not a family member." He completely dispelled the notion it was AG or SIL. He thinks it was a home invasion gone wrong. And they are likely examining all the people who may have been contracted for work, and all their contacts. Then see about home invasions in that area.

I started to listen to this, but realized it’s almost an hour long. Did the FBI Agent explain why he doesn’t believe the family is involved? TIA

 

[iamshadow21]

I think contact could mean a phone call but I think it is interesting that the complaint says contacted and notified. Why not just say called and notified?

Just sounds like copspeak to me. It's a word that gets used a lot. Contacted, made contact with, in place of less formal language.

MOO

 

[Vegasgrl]

The church member call to family (true or a lie) and Nancy's clothing were two simple things that could be verified quickly. If she did make it home that night, she would have changed into bed clothes and her worn clothing would be in the house. If not, she likely didn't even make it home and LE knows this. They also know if the blood outside was there prior, or staged. If she never made it home, her home would still be a crime scene because of the obvious staging. But, after the initial processing, LE wasn't too concerned that the house remain secured.

 

[SMK777]

Approximately 11 a.m.: Someone who attends church with Nancy Guthrie called the family to report that the 84-year-old never made it to services, the sheriff said.

Nancy Guthrie abduction: Sheriff reveals more detailed timeline

Nancy Guthrie was taken from her home early Sunday, authorities said.

www.yahoo.com

The Sheriff originally said that, yes.
But I don't believe that call was ever received.
STRICTLY MY OWN SPECULATION!

 

[SlimPickens]

If the deadline comes and goes, which I am assuming is 8pm EST (5pm their time), and with no disposition that includes the return or imminent return of NG, then time to roll up our sleeves and focus primarily on the murder theories.

I was hopeful the FBI director's announced visit to Tucson was not pre-planned as he insisted, but every hour that goes by without any new information is another hour towards confirming that.

JMO.

 

[SRWCF]

Agreed, but there needs to be some more sensible judgment. A burst water pipe, as an example, clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with the investigation.

Some people think more analytically, and others think more . . . creatively, let's say. I'm on the analytical side, but I appreciate the more creative brainstorms, because I mostly would never think of them. Sure, some theories border on the absurd and those I just chuckle at.

 

[Deleted member 117884]

Agreed, but there needs to be some more sensible judgment. A burst water pipe, as an example, clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with the investigation.

I hear ya, but I can recall cases where I thought WSers were crazy with their speculation....and it turns out they were right.

Hannah Graham case comes immediately to mind.

When this case first broke, I wouldn't have guessed there would be ransom notes asking for bitcoin. That would've been a crazy idea at first, but here we are.

jmo

 

[desert-blue]

So what you’re speculating is if she would have attended the 10:45 mass, her missing was an emergency to report to family during the mass by a churchgoer, rather than waiting until after mass ended?

I feel like the only way this could work with the given timeline is if Nancy was supposed to attend the 9:00 service, which would have concluded around 10:00 or so. The notification could have occurred between 10 and 11ish, perhaps even after the parishioner got home. I can't imagine that someone would contact NG's family in the middle of the service. If so, that seems weird to me. I know she's elderly, but you'd think the friend would just figure she slept in or changed her mind. He/she might call or text NG after the service was over to check on her. If she didn't answer/respond or it went to straight to voicemail, that might be cause to notify the family. This scenario doesn't work with the 10:45 am service because the family was already at her house a little before noon (unless the parishioner actually notified her family during the service, which is bizarre imo. She could have just been a little late and don't people generally put their phones away during a service?).

 

[Sadi]

I meant if Nancy's church friend showed up at Nancy's house to check on her when she noticed her missing from church but Nancy's family was already at her house but hadn't contacted LE.

I am just giving a hypothetical since the thread was discussing why LE left the church friend's contact time off of the timeline and the DC complaint.

In this scenario it would be a "contact" or "notification" by the church friend not a "call".

What you reference is a possibility too because if the contact by the church friend was indeed a "call" LE might be able to tell by cell phone gps/data that the family should have already known about Nancy missing if their data was already placing them at her home prior to contacting LE.

Great question!

 

[Van Helsing]

With all respect, we are not law enforcement, judges, prosecutors, or jury members. In a discussion, it's welcome, imo, to share personal opinions and experiences. Maybe some ideas are off-mark, but maybe some are insightful.

Brainstorming and thinking together can be messy or cloudy sometimes. It's okay.

jmo

Some people are letting their own biases cloud their judgment. Not a good trait

Projecting of one's own biases onto others' comments is also not a good trait. It's probably best not to try to read other peoples minds.

 

[SRWCF]

If the deadline comes and goes, which I am assuming is 8pm EST (5pm their time), and with no disposition that includes the return or imminent return of NG, then time to roll up our sleeves and focus primarily on the murder theories.

I was hopeful the FBI director's announced visit to Tucson was not pre-planned as he insisted, but every hour that goes by without any new information is another hour towards confirming that.

JMO.

That's 7pm EST. Arizona is on MST and the East Coast is only 2 hours ahead.

 

[Fargo]

This is all just MHO- The problem is that your ISP (Spectrum, Charter, Xfinity, Starlink, hughesnet or whoever you use for the onramp) always knows when you're using the TOR and records the traffic. The ISP knows who and when, just not what or why. If the sender was in the US, the FBI will find out who sent it eventually.

The kidnappers would be wise not to communicate any further, because every time they do they are creating another fingerprint that can be used to pull their identifying information out of the billions of packets sent.

Yes, but LE has to work backwards to get to that and I suspect that's exactly what's taking them so long. If they're starting from TMZ's server and working backwards for the IP of the original sender they're going to need a lot of warrants in a lot of countries to track IPs from node to node.

If they have a suspect starting point then yes, a warrant to that suspect's ISP will show an initial request to TOR but nothing after that. The ISP has no means to track through the nodes as the query travels world-wide. It's kind of the whole point of TOR nodes.

Having said that it would definitely be a red flag if someone under investigation was using TOR browser at the time the ransom note was received.

My opinion only.

 

[BrittMontero]

Retired FBI special agent on Hidden Killers says, "Culprit someone who had access to Nancy's house in the last 6 months or year at the longest. Not a family member." He completely dispelled the notion it was AG or SIL. He thinks it was a home invasion gone wrong. And they are likely examining all the people who may have been contracted for work, and all their contacts. Then see about home invasions in that area.

I could kind of buy this - maybe it’s a massive coincidence that NG has a famous, wealthy daughter…

But how could a home invasion of an elderly woman “go wrongl”?? It’s not as though she’s likely to fight back. Tie her up, steal the valuables, leave quickly.

Even if she had a heart attack from fright, why would thieves burden themselves with a dying person? They would just leave.

 

[Ellis' Mom]

I am sorry @Ellis' Mom slow to respond. The thread is moving so fast I missed your post. I apologize my link did not post page 2 of the complaint. This the missing page 2.View attachment 642967

No worries! Thank you!