NC - Officer, several others dead at Raleigh active shooting scene, 13 Oct 2022 *suspect is a minor*

[airportwoman]

Yes, this, they woke up that morning as parents of two high school students....

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image from stock.adobe.com

jmho ymmv lrr

Does anyone know if they had other children? If so, they're suffering too, in unimaginable ways.

 

[SteveP]

What a powerful eulogy from the wife of Officer Torres...

'I tried to save you:' Wife of fallen officer Gabriel Torres describes their final moments together

During her eulogy at his funeral, she also recounted the final moments she had with him - and a frightening account of hearing the gunshots and rushing home to find her husband mortally injured.

www.wral.com

 

[lowes123]

Has anyone heard an update on the shooter? I can't imagine the position the parents are in.

 

[dgfred]

Last heard was in Pediatric ICU. Serious head wound. I am thinking it was a LE shot that hit him because his weapon was a shotgun apparently. Shotgun to the head not likely survivable IMO. But not sure.

 

[mewmew]

With a severe head injury like a GSW, doctors sometimes have to wait for the patient’s vitals to stabilize before they can perform surgery. If testing indicates positive brain function and the patient makes it through the surgery, there’s still usually a waiting game while they monitor for brain swelling, cranial pressure, infection, blood clots, and such. I wonder if that’s where his doctors/family are at right now. Even if he survives, I’d expect him to be significantly disabled at a minimum. Although, stranger things have happened, I guess.

A few months ago I had a patient who shot themself in the head. They lost an eye and had many, many staples in their head, but amazingly survived and had zero disabilities from it (other than losing the eye of course). It was incredible. When they came in for a follow up a few months later, I could not believe it. You would never have suspected anything had happened!! Just sharing that to say I agree — stranger things certainly have happened!

 

[Live_and_Learn]

EXCL: NC mom found her son, 16, after he was shot dead by brother, 15

Elise Thompson, 52, found her son James, 16, dead inside their home after he was shot by his 15-year-old brother Austin Thompson.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I am going to try this one more time, in the form of questions that don’t need to be answered here, are meant to provoke thought only, and are in no way presented as facts.

IMO, here are some questions that might be considered:

Was the mother on the scene quickly? Did she work nearby?
Were there any public alerts prior to her arrival?
Did the police respond quickly and block off all entry to the area? Did many residents trying to return home have to wait several hours?
What brought her home so quickly, before the roads were blocked off?
What communication happened that night?
If LE had your son surrounded, where would you be? How long was the standoff?
Did LE presence involve several agencies, counties, and experience levels?
What is the likelihood of complete confidentiality? Could there be motivation to share?
In general discussions about this case, is there judgement or vitriol toward the mom? How might this be perceived by those who were there?

Completely Unrelated: Does anyone have any knowledge of or experience with a narcissistic parent? What does that look like from the outside? If so, does that influence the way you research? Does something else?

 

[dgfred]

Hey mew. What type of weapon?

 

[mewmew]

Hey mew. What type of weapon?

I admit I have very very little knowledge of guns - I really couldn’t tell you! But I can try to find out.

 

[Laughing]

Last heard was in Pediatric ICU. Serious head wound. I am thinking it was a LE shot that hit him because his weapon was a shotgun apparently. Shotgun to the head not likely survivable IMO. But not sure.

Thought that an article linked up thread stated the head wound was self-inflicted?

Once knew a man who attempted suicide by placing the muzzle of a rifle against his temple. The muzzle slid forward far enough that the man ended up blind, and without sinuses, but otherwise little changed. Atypical forehead shape after the event.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[HMSHood]

EXCL: NC mom found her son, 16, after he was shot dead by brother, 15

Elise Thompson, 52, found her son James, 16, dead inside their home after he was shot by his 15-year-old brother Austin Thompson.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I am going to try this one more time, in the form of questions that don’t need to be answered here, are meant to provoke thought only, and are in no way presented as facts.

IMO, here are some questions that might be considered:

Was the mother on the scene quickly? Did she work nearby?
Were there any public alerts prior to her arrival?
Did the police respond quickly and block off all entry to the area? Did many residents trying to return home have to wait several hours?
What brought her home so quickly, before the roads were blocked off?
What communication happened that night?
If LE had your son surrounded, where would you be? How long was the standoff?
Did LE presence involve several agencies, counties, and experience levels?
What is the likelihood of complete confidentiality? Could there be motivation to share?
In general discussions about this case, is there judgement or vitriol toward the mom? How might this be perceived by those who were there?

Completely Unrelated: Does anyone have any knowledge of or experience with a narcissistic parent? What does that look like from the outside? If so, does that influence the way you research? Does something else?

I read the article. Not many see to recall Austin Thompson. Here is what caught my attention.

His neighbors say the teenager was quiet - but that he caught their attention by walking the streets of the neighborhood at 4:30am wearing his book bag, even though school didn't start until hours later.

I wonder why he would walk the street early in the morning.

 

[SteveP]

Thought that an article linked up thread stated the head wound was self-inflicted?

Once knew a man who attempted suicide by placing the muzzle of a rifle against his temple. The muzzle slid forward far enough that the man ended up blind, and without sinuses, but otherwise little changed. Atypical forehead shape after the event.

jmho ymmv lrr

I had assumed that his head wound was probably self-inflicted, as well, but I know that it was reported that he had two weapons, a shotgun by his side, and a handgun in his waistband. The suspect did not appear to be a very big kid, so I think it would have been difficult for him to shoot himself with a shotgun. I suppose he could have taken off his shoe and maybe held the barrel in his hand and pulled the trigger with his toe, but it would not have been quick or easy. I also believe a shotgun blast to the head at point blank range would have been fatal. Likewise, what is the likelihood that he would have shot himself in the head with the handgun, and then put it back into the waistband of his sweatpants? That seems equally unlikely, imo. So the only remaining possibility is that he was shot by one of the two officers, that, between them, fired 23 shots, one of which likely struck the assailant in the head. JMO

 

[sallye818]

In reply to some of your questions, @Live_and_Learn : (my answers in BOLD)

https://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/article267310312.html--

Good link for timeline of events.

Was the mother on the scene quickly? Did she work nearby?Seems like the mother was on the scene quickly, and I've read that she worked about 15 mins. away at a car dealership.
Were there any public alerts prior to her arrival? Some people are saying FB alerts, but I think from what I've pieced together she got there before the major public warnings. I think, otherwise, she would've gotten stuck in the heavy traffic once police arrived and neighbors were rushing to check on their loved ones.
Did the police respond quickly and block off all entry to the area? Did many residents trying to return home have to wait several hours?5:19 pm first officers responded, 5:55 pm public alert goes out of Twitter from Raleigh PD about active shooter in neighborhood.
What brought her home so quickly, before the roads were blocked off? Remains to be seen.
What communication happened that night? Would love to know
If LE had your son surrounded, where would you be? How long was the standoff?I have no idea where I'd be, but since his brother had been shot, probably with the police or Dr's at the hospital. Sounds like from the stabbing/GSW damage, brother (James) was prob declared dead at the scene...IMOO. The standoff lasted from about 6:40 pm- around 10 pm, when AT was captured at the barn where he'd holed up.
Did LE presence involve several agencies, counties, and experience levels?
What is the likelihood of complete confidentiality? Could there be motivation to share?Yes, from listening to scanner, brought in state police, robotic equipment, SWAT, etc. Little likelihood of complete confidentiality in my opinion, but sure haven't heard much, and not for lack of researching on my part.
In general discussions about this case, is there judgement or vitriol toward the mom? How might this be perceived by those who were there? I'm hearing some about the mom, little about the dad. The main thing I'm hearing in general discussions is how did he get the guns? "Must've been from his parents"..I think people are assuming this b/c of his age. Many are angry and feel if parents had the guns unsecured, they should be prosecuted.

 

[Live_and_Learn]

Thank you, Sallye818! This is excellent.

I'll add some additional thoughts around these questions that are my own thoughts, only:

If there were posts on NextDoor or FB, it is possible the mom saw those while she was at work, and still got home before the police arrived, but how likely?

Could she have been one of the first ones on the scene, based on a direct call from one of her sons? Could she have heard anything that was going to happen, was happening, or happened? Any of the why?

There is a YouTuber who recorded relevant scanner coverage from the entire evening. If this needs to be deleted because it is not cited, please delete. I am not going to link to that because I wish I had not heard it. But if the mom was there and the older son was already deceased when first responders got there, what communication did she have with the first responders? Is it possible that she was allowed to go to where the standoff was with the other son? If so, what communications happened there?

Finally, a PSA: If you are on NextDoor, it is very easy to see any other neighborhood, regardless of distance, using the map function. I regularly look at things in my old hometown this way. So, keep that in mind when you post there. It is also easy to look up any person anywhere who has a NextDoor account and uses their first and last name.
Also, if you are on a neighborhood Facebook page, make sure it is private.

 

[sallye818]

I just found this video on YouTube today...a WRAL reporter texted and called what he believed were AT & JT's parents:
ETA: Link:

(Mother) said they (she and her husband, I'm assuming) were headed home and they heard about the shooting through a FB group for the Hedingham neighborhood, and then from a neighbor. She says they were at the hospital later when they heard about the jogger who was shot.

So, it does seem to be confirmed that this is how she originally heard about the shooting. No clarification if she heard (at that point) her son(s) were involved.

 

[Stunned]

I feel so bad for those parents. They basically lost two sons that day. I feel for everyone.

 

[Laughing]

I had assumed that his head wound was probably self-inflicted, as well, but I know that it was reported that he had two weapons, a shotgun by his side, and a handgun in his waistband. The suspect did not appear to be a very big kid, so I think it would have been difficult for him to shoot himself with a shotgun. I suppose he could have taken off his shoe and maybe held the barrel in his hand and pulled the trigger with his toe, but it would not have been quick or easy. I also believe a shotgun blast to the head at point blank range would have been fatal. Likewise, what is the likelihood that he would have shot himself in the head with the handgun, and then put it back into the waistband of his sweatpants? That seems equally unlikely, imo. So the only remaining possibility is that he was shot by one of the two officers, that, between them, fired 23 shots, one of which likely struck the assailant in the head. JMO

No idea how tall AT is, or his arm spread, but using a tape measure from my sewing room & 2 different rifles, it is certainly possible by measurement of arm & measurement of barrel to place the muzzle on one's temple & use the thumb on the trigger.

Probably holding the barrel with the other hand to keep the muzzle in place.

I used these rifles (including my target 22) because it meant less unlocking, they have trigger locks & are in a locked cabinet while shotguns are in locked cases in a locked locker with trigger locks. Safe Storage R Us. The shotguns we have can fit in the same cases as the rifles, with rearranged padding.

Your mileage/measurements may vary

 

[AC4RD]

Radio traffic sheds light on number and kind of guns used in Raleigh mass shooting

Sources told WRAL News the suspect had at least two guns.

www.wral.com

There's no text in the transcript tab and I strongly dislike local news, so I don't know what this news report says. My wife says a crawl on the local noon news said the kid had an AR-15-style rifle, but she may have missed the city or shooter; she's done it before.

Since our local newspaper crashed, I get very little local news. I checked that WRAL site to see what it said about the type of gun, and nearly HALF of the local stories were about shootings. I won't get political here, but it appears to me that people are shooting each other at a rate that would have shocked and dismayed Dodge City in the cowboy era. There's too much shooting going on, and a lot of it is by juveniles. This is a very disconcerting situation. IMO, of course.

 

[Live_and_Learn]

I just found this video on YouTube today...a WRAL reporter texted and called what he believed were AT & JT's parents:
ETA: Link:

(Mother) said they (she and her husband, I'm assuming) were headed home and they heard about the shooting through a FB group for the Hedingham neighborhood, and then from a neighbor. She says they were at the hospital later when they heard about the jogger who was shot.

So, it does seem to be confirmed that this is how she originally heard about the shooting. No clarification if she heard (at that point) her son(s) were involved.

Thank you, sallye818. So, I heard that report when it came out, too. I had to listen a couple of times to understand it. The reporter supposedly talked with the mom late in the day, the day after the shootings. Austin had been taken to the hospital the night before. She she had been at the hospital that day, which was the day after. IMO, calling the parents was in very poor taste and the unclear reporting just added confusion.

Did both parents get home before the police arrived? Where were they from the time that James was found until hours later when Austin left in an ambulance?

If you heard about a shooting in your neighborhood on FB or a neighbor, and you came home to find one son beyond medical help, wouldn't you immediately be frantic to know where the other one was?

If this reporter did get statements from her the next day, were they her original statements or might someone else be trying to control what she says at that point?

 

[sallye818]

@AC4RD , you are right. We are headed to Raleigh for a concert in a couple of weeks, and I also noticed how MUCH shooting has been going on there recently. Too much.

@Live_and_Learn , do you think the mom was at the standoff? If so, I guess she could not "talk him down". We have heard he exchanged gunfire with the police, and got a GSW himself. I still think this was self-inflicted, why? It was such a pinpointed shot to the head. Also, he was in the barn and scanner traffic said he was trying to shoot more times but didn't succeed.

 

[Live_and_Learn]

@AC4RD , you are right. We are headed to Raleigh for a concert in a couple of weeks, and I also noticed how MUCH shooting has been going on there recently. Too much.

@Live_and_Learn , do you think the mom was at the standoff? If so, I guess she could not "talk him down". We have heard he exchanged gunfire with the police, and got a GSW himself. I still think this was self-inflicted, why? It was such a pinpointed shot to the head. Also, he was in the barn and scanner traffic said he was trying to shoot more times but didn't succeed.

I know what you mean about concerts. I love to go, but have really changed the way I think about them, especially outside venues.

To answer your question: Not knowing where she was, I just wonder if she could have been at or near the standoff, or if she spent any time alone with LE/first responders at her home or another location. If so, that might have been the single biggest window for raw, uncensored communication (unlike when the reporter tried talk with her the next evening when she was at the hospital, presumably with her husband).