Found Deceased OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #5 *Arrests*

[al66pine]

Poor women were terrorized by those goons before dying. Whatever jury they get is going to hate their guts.

@Artis
Likely that juries (plural) will hate their guts and ALL parts of their anatomies.
imo

 

[al66pine]

I wasn't aware there is a difference between a taser and a stun gun. I also didn't realize a Taser is a brand name but the news articles I've read say TA purchased tasers.
JMO

Document: Grandmother admits to role in murder of 2 women found dead in Texas County

A grandmother admitted to her role in the murder of two women found dead in Texas County, Oklahoma.According to the motion to hold Tifany Adams without bail, af

abc7amarillo.com

When that failed, Adams bought burner phones and tasers and plotted to kidnap and kill the victims.

@MyBelle Thanks for your response.

Yes, I've also noticed some MSM coverage seems to conflate TASER & stun gun (among a few other common boo-boos in crime reporting), so readers' resulting mistakes are not surprising.

Affidavits for arrest are worded so much more concisely.

 

[simlyme]

Was "pools of blood" ever confirmed? We heard that very early on from "unnamed sources" and people picked up on it and ran with it, but was it confirmed? That's a heck of a lot of blood, which would lead me to believe knives were used. I can see some blood outside the car, if they were bludgeoned, but "pools" sounds like major arteries were sliced wide open.

Coming in late on this but, from NN wrote this in the article . Court papers ? Haven't seen those . IF you put in (blood was found on the roadway and edge of the roadway near the car) you'll find a lot of news outlets writing the same , but, saying per News Nation. If that's true, then it appears both driver and passenger side women were bleeding a lot. This article seems to cover a few reporters .Brian Entin, Damita Menezes, Jeff Arnold, Laura Ingle ,Devan Markham, Nancy Loo

Kansas moms killings: What we know

New details have emerged about the killings of two Kansas mothers whose suspected killers had a violent history, according to court documents.

www.newsnationnow.com

Was blood found near their located vehicle?​

Court papers revealed that blood was found on the roadway and edge of the roadway near the car.

Butler’s glasses were also found on the roadway by the car near a broken hammer, according to the probable cause affidavit.

Investigators also said a pistol magazine was found inside Kelley’s purse in the car but that there was no gun found.

“An examination of the vehicle and area surrounding the vehicle found evidence of a severe injury,” the affidavit stated.

 

[al66pine]

Blood or Pools of Blood?

Coming in late on this but, from NN wrote this in the article . Court papers ? Haven't seen those . IF you put in (blood was found on the roadway and edge of the roadway near the car) you'll find a lot of news outlets writing the same , but, saying per News Nation. If that's true, then it appears both driver and passenger side women were bleeding a lot. This article seems to cover a few reporters . Brian Entin, Damita Menezes, Jeff Arnold, Laura Ingle, Devan Markham, Nancy Loo

Kansas moms killings: What we know

New details have emerged about the killings of two Kansas mothers whose suspected killers had a violent history, according to court documents.

www.newsnationnow.com

Was blood found near their located vehicle?​

Court papers revealed that blood was found on the roadway and edge of the roadway near the car.

Butler’s glasses were also found on the roadway by the car near a broken hammer, according to the probable cause affidavit.

Investigators also said a pistol magazine was found inside Kelley’s purse in the car but that there was no gun found.

“An examination of the vehicle and area surrounding the vehicle found evidence of a severe injury,” the affidavit stated.

@simlyme Blood or Pools of Blood?
IDK who originated description of scene w "pools of blood."

Affidavit of ProbCause for Arrest Warrant of Paul G.*
Excerpt here starts w VB's family members who found ---
"... Butler's abandoned vehicle just west of the intersection of Highway 95 and Road L.... An examination of the vehicle and area surrounding the vehicle found evidence of a severe injury. Blood was found on the roadway and edge of the roadway. Butler's glasses were also found in the roadway south of the vehicle, near a broken hammer. A pistol magazine was found inside Kelley's purse but no pistol was found."

"Blood" but no "pools of blood" in this affidavit.

If only MSM would give summaries AND add more LINKS to affidavits, motions, & other doc's filed w court, we could get the straight scoop. Sigh, jmo.

_________________________________
* https://www.scribd.com/document/726351799/P-Grice-CF-24-81-Info-and-Affidavit

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but could TA's confession be seen as connected to a motive?
As in, not wanting VB to have custody, just that, not caring if she herself suffers, dies, or gets charged with murder.
Like, " Yeh I killed her, she ain't ever having custody now".
ETA:
If so, it can be added to the unbelievable actions these people have committed.

 

[Seattle1]

Didn't Veronica have to pay for the supervisor, regardless of whether the supervisor had been chosen by TA or VB? If so, perhaps Brune had to contact VB to say she wasn't available for those weeks and to find a replacement. Imo.

^^rsbm
No, not in this case. The Court ordered TA to pay the cost of supervision by CB if this is who she wanted to supervise VB's visits.
However, in the event VB provided the supervisor such as 3/30 when JK was the supervisor, VB was responsible for the cost. This is confirmed in the AA quoted a couple pages back, and quoted below:

Generally, a Court Order for supervised visitation provides the names of the individuals sanctioned by the Court as supervisors, and also defines the instructions for changing the schedule and the deadline to do so. This is to prevent last minute mockery, etc.

From the AA, pages 4-5, we know that TA lied to VB when she stated that CB was not available to supervise visitation on March 30 and requested VB furnish an alternate supervisor from those previously named by the Court:
View attachment 499780View attachment 499781

 

[AliceInPain]

Brian Entin reported they were not shot, and he's an actual, and very good, reporter, as far as I know.
The pool/ puddle of blood was mentioned by a local in an FB group. They took pictures. The day after? So that's where whoever reported that got it from.
Our nightmares are real.

 

[Ksfarmer8]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but could TA's confession be seen as connected to a motive?
As in, not wanting VB to have custody, just that, not caring if she herself suffers, dies, or gets charged with murder.
Like, " Yeh I killed her, she ain't ever having custody now".
ETA:
If so, it can be added to the unbelievable actions these people have committed.

IMO As I understand the "confession" by TA was more like an off the cuff remark and not a normal signed confession. Maybe someone has a link to a definite signed confession but to my knowledge there is not one. IMO
I believe with the use of the stun guns and the number of people involved that the perps planned to get away with it and the women and the car would just disappear. IMO TA wanted Veronica out of the way period!! JMO If VB goes away the problems for TA as she saw them would go away. JMO

 

[MyBelle]

IMO As I understand the "confession" by TA was more like an off the cuff remark and not a normal signed confession. Maybe someone has a link to a definite signed confession but to my knowledge there is not one. IMO
I believe with the use of the stun guns and the number of people involved that the perps planned to get away with it and the women and the car would just disappear. IMO TA wanted Veronica out of the way period!! JMO If VB goes away the problems for TA as she saw them would go away. JMO

I think TA's confession was recorded by LE after she was read her rights.

JMO

 

[Seattle1]

IMO As I understand the "confession" by TA was more like an off the cuff remark and not a normal signed confession. Maybe someone has a link to a definite signed confession but to my knowledge there is not one. IMO
I believe with the use of the stun guns and the number of people involved that the perps planned to get away with it and the women and the car would just disappear. IMO TA wanted Veronica out of the way period!! JMO If VB goes away the problems for TA as she saw them would go away. JMO

I'm not familiar with any reference to a signed confession of the charges filed against the defendant by TA.

However, from both the AA and the Motion to Hold Defendant Without Bail, we know that following TA's arrest on April 13, she made recorded statements to LE during a custodial interview that she was responsible for the deaths of the victims.

IMO, the Court did not discount TA's statements as "off the cuff" when the statements were used by the Court to deem the defendant not eligible for bail consideration pursuant to the Oklahoma Constitution.

AA pg 4/4:

Motion pg 2/3:

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

I'm not familiar with any reference to a signed confession of the charges filed against the defendant by TA.

However, from both the AA and the Motion to Hold Defendant Without Bail, we know that following TA's arrest on April 13, she made recorded statements to LE during a custodial interview that she was responsible for the deaths of the victims.

IMO, the Court did not discount TA's statements as "off the cuff" when the statements were used by the Court to deem the defendant not eligible for bail consideration pursuant to the Oklahoma Constitution.

AA pg 4/4:

View attachment 499982
Motion pg 2/3:

View attachment 499984

Thank you.

 

[Megnut]

Do we have confirmation that that was a legitimate, scheduled visitation?

Is it possible that TA engineered the whole thing? Offered VB a visit off the record, and VB who would likely know better than to trust TA implicitly, arranged for a supervisor to accompany her to protect herself (not as much from violence but from TA twisting the say around and then using it against VB).

Or was it an official visit? I guess it must have been if TA's only alibi, if you will, was that VB canceled. And, if VB was choosing the supervisor, TA considered any supervisor selected by VB to be Team VB. Dispensible.

If these idiots thought ahead enough to use burner phones (leaving their personal phones in the blackout mode that always does criminals in), did it never occur to them that the victims' phones would tell a story? That they did travel the course toward the meet up location? Did it never occur to them that people in the victims' circles would be aware of their plans, perhaps be on heightened alert, know to miss them?

What an altogether ill-conceived brutal plan.

No conviction, no sentence, no lethal injection is punishment enough.

JMO

 

[Knitty]

MOD NOTE:

Move on from discussion of which sources you find credible and which you don't. Who you believe is up to you. If you wish to take this discussion to PM, feel free.

Knitty,
Moderator

 

[CuriousCricket]

I was thinking of something, I have never been to Oklahoma, but just going by the FB groups many Oklahomians/ or *this particular area pips* seem deadly serious and highly Christian and don't f with anyone like those. None of these arrested people were granted bail which makes me think there will be no plea deals, they will all be found guilty and all sentenced to death (possibly the women will be spared due to being women and mothers).
This was a planned torture and murder and (what they hoped to be) disappearance of an innocent pastor's wife and mother who took her Easter Day off to help another mother in need. No way are they ever going to see the sun again. Even if the trial was moved to NY. Or Canada. Or Iran! Nowhere. They did the most evil a person can do.

I have been to Oklahoma and Western areas and found people there wonderful. The addition of the fifth arrest has put me into even more horror than before. Perhaps it is the realization of just what complete and total thugs these 5 people are going after 2 women. Maybe it's the kid in me whose feeling of some nobility and inherent goodness in "cowboys" has been destroyed.

A surprise attack, an ambush, by FIVE grown, active, strong people against two women heading to a kid's birthday party? A gang of thugs, lower than animals. Adding that fifth person takes the horror of this up a notch for me.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1784299475298566321

https://twitter.com/x/status/1784303867376677237

 

[AliceInPain]

I have been to Oklahoma and Western areas and found people there wonderful. The addition of the fifth arrest has put me into even more horror than before. Perhaps it is the realization of just what complete and total thugs these 5 people are going after 2 women. Maybe it's the kid in me whose feeling of some nobility and inherent goodness in "cowboys" has been destroyed.

A surprise attack, an ambush, by FIVE grown, active, strong people against two women heading to a kid's birthday party? A gang of thugs, lower than animals. Adding that fifth person takes the horror of this up a notch for me.

bbm. That's exactly what I was saying.

 

[Chimera]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but could TA's confession be seen as connected to a motive?
As in, not wanting VB to have custody, just that, not caring if she herself suffers, dies, or gets charged with murder.
Like, " Yeh I killed her, she ain't ever having custody now".
ETA:
If so, it can be added to the unbelievable actions these people have committed.

Good points !

Aside from the obvious cruelty of the crime, there's perhaps an element of selfishness ?
I.e., "My way or the highway."

It continues to astound me that they thought they could get away with this !
Omo.

 

[Gae]

Have the bodies been released to the families even though the ME hasn't publicly released cause and manner?
Is it possible the cause and manner won't be released until the trials start?

 

[CuriousCricket]

Good points !

Aside from the obvious cruelty of the crime, there's perhaps an element of selfishness ?
I.e., "My way or the highway."

It continues to astound me that they thought they could get away with this !
Omo.

Maybe they still think they can be freed by a jury of their peers? Wonder if they think there are enough "Sovereign Citizen" proponents the state and DA will not be able to find 12 people in the county who will vote to convict them.

Maybe that's why they're being outspoken about it?

 

[Sundog]

I have been to Oklahoma and Western areas and found people there wonderful. The addition of the fifth arrest has put me into even more horror than before. Perhaps it is the realization of just what complete and total thugs these 5 people are going after 2 women. Maybe it's the kid in me whose feeling of some nobility and inherent goodness in "cowboys" has been destroyed.

A surprise attack, an ambush, by FIVE grown, active, strong people against two women heading to a kid's birthday party? A gang of thugs, lower than animals. Adding that fifth person takes the horror of this up a notch for me.

There are bad dudes in every demographic, lifestyle.