Parents of third graders outraged at diversity tape

[Nova]

You are just neat-o Nova.

Right back atcha. But do keep the kids away from my house. Nobody is old enough to have to deal with all the debris from the frost damage this Winter.

 

[kcksum]

I love the idea of those books. It just plain introduces the idea that these people exist and are families - so that our kids don't laugh at little Johnny when his moms or dads come to the school play. So the next generation is more tolerant than ours.

Its not that simple as saying we're doing this so kids don't laugh at little Johnny when his moms or dads come out to play. It is a deep and important issue for any of us who believe it is something that should be brought up and taught at home.
I am sorry if some adults don't teach tolerance to their children, but it is not my responsability and goes against my own rights to have secular ideas forced down my childrens throat in the name of diversity. I am not saying the opposing view should be taught either. I would prefer issues outside of reading, writing, math, science, and computer technology be left out of the classroom all together.
No where on the ACT or SAT is their going to be questions about same sex marriage, homosexuality,blended families, or diversity and self esteem. We have allowed our acedemic system to be highjacked by special interest groups and the idea that the schools are reponsible for teaching moral developement. Maybe that is why we have such an overwhelming poor to middle class demographic, maybe that's why our kids are testing way behind most industrialized countries. Maybe this is why we have a bankrupt educational system. Instead of spending money on real curriculim to help prepare these kids for college and higher education, we're spending it on self esteem booklets and movies about diversity.
I am just tired of my tax dollars being spent so ineffectivly.The real butt chapper is that I spend 10,000 bucks to spend my kids to private schools, and still have to pay taxes for other peoples kids to go to school. Man I wish vouchers had passed, but that's a whole other issue.

 

[kcksum]

Well, I'm sorry, but when you have religion, you will always have extremists.

and where you have human beings with brains you will have extremists. Religion doesn't hold the market on extremist behavior.I've seen people in politics become very extremist about any given issue. For instance....Rosie is an extremist, and she supports no religious affiliation at all.

 

[southcitymom]

......No where on the ACT or SAT is their going to be questions about same sex marriage, homosexuality,blended families, or diversity and self esteem...

Maybe not, but thoughtful consideration of these and other real-life issues will assist your children in life more than any rote facts they are "learning" in school. As I posted before earlier in this thread, school can't help but touch on moral issues - we only stamp our feet when they touch on ones that we don't agree with.

I too spend lots of money to send my kids to a private school, but I don't mind that my tax dollars pay for the other. Whether I agree with what they are doing or not, I think it's great that anyone in this country who wants to can get 12 years of education. I'm happy to support that financially.

 

[Jessiebell]

Its not that simple as saying we're doing this so kids don't laugh at little Johnny when his moms or dads come out to play. It is a deep and important issue for any of us who believe it is something that should be brought up and taught at home.
I am sorry if some adults don't teach tolerance to their children, but it is not my responsability and goes against my own rights to have secular ideas forced down my childrens throat in the name of diversity. I am not saying the opposing view should be taught either. I would prefer issues outside of reading, writing, math, science, and computer technology be left out of the classroom all together.
No where on the ACT or SAT is their going to be questions about same sex marriage, homosexuality,blended families, or diversity and self esteem. We have allowed our acedemic system to be highjacked by special interest groups and the idea that the schools are reponsible for teaching moral developement. Maybe that is why we have such an overwhelming poor to middle class demographic, maybe that's why our kids are testing way behind most industrialized countries. Maybe this is why we have a bankrupt educational system. Instead of spending money on real curriculim to help prepare these kids for college and higher education, we're spending it on self esteem booklets and movies about diversity.
I am just tired of my tax dollars being spent so ineffectivly.The real butt chapper is that I spend 10,000 bucks to spend my kids to private schools, and still have to pay taxes for other peoples kids to go to school. Man I wish vouchers had passed, but that's a whole other issue.

I have a very hard time believing our school systems have over extended themselves when were talking bout ONE video and about ten seconds a same sex couple is probably shown on said video.

This stuff is NOT taught - so how can it be effecting the time spent on academics? The reason this video is in question is because - IT HASN'T been done before to any extent.

The reason our schools can't stand up to other countries in testing is because our teachers are too busy trying to get the kids ready for government testing so that they can recieve some kind of funding.

Yes, you have to help in way of taxes to pay for this county's school system - that's the way it works here.

 

[Jessiebell]

By the way kc - it's a deep an important issue to gay people as well - and like it or not, besides marriage they have as many rights as you do and are equally part of this country.

 

[kcksum]

By the way kc - it's a deep an important issue to gay people as well - and like it or not, besides marriage they have as many rights as you do and are equally part of this country.

I never said they didn't have any rights?Where in my post did I advocate taking away the rights of gay people? Does not showing other peoples children their choice of living situations take away any of their God given rights in this country? I don't think so. That's the type of drama posturing that upsets so many people about the entire gay movement. They want to make everything a discrimination issue. I could CARE LESS what anyone does in their bedroom with what ever race,gender,animal,toy, or how many people they do it with. If a gay couple wants to adopt 100 children go for it.....I will not stand in the way. I am just sick and tired of gay people trying to get tax breaks and special treatment based on what they do in the bedroom. Gayness is not a race, it is not a nationality, and it makes you no different than anyone else on this planet EXCEPT the way you practice sexual intercourse. That being said, it does not make you a diversity....it just makes you someone who has sex with same gendered individuals. Mine is not so much a moral outrage, as it is a "get over yourselves" outrage. If they want everyone to start treating them equally, start by NOT WANTING special treatment based on what you do in the bedroom behind closed doors.
Again, just because someone doesn't agree, you assume that I all of the sudden want to deny them their rights. Again, what right am I wanting to take away from them? Trying to force everyone to accept your way of life was not a right in this country last time I checked.

 

[IdahoMom]

kcksum-

How do you feel about gays not being allowed to be by their significant others' side in many cases when they're in an emergency medical situation?

 

[IrishMist]

kcksum, what special treatment are they looking for? To be treated the same as anyone else in this country isn't asking for anything special.

 

[Mira]

/quote of gay people trying to get tax breaks and special treatment based on what they do in the bedroom. /unquote


and what tax breaks, please?

 

[southcitymom]

I never said they didn't have any rights?Where in my post did I advocate taking away the rights of gay people? Does not showing other peoples children their choice of living situations take away any of their God given rights in this country? I don't think so. That's the type of drama posturing that upsets so many people about the entire gay movement. They want to make everything a discrimination issue. I could CARE LESS what anyone does in their bedroom with what ever race,gender,animal,toy, or how many people they do it with. If a gay couple wants to adopt 100 children go for it.....I will not stand in the way. I am just sick and tired of gay people trying to get tax breaks and special treatment based on what they do in the bedroom. Gayness is not a race, it is not a nationality, and it makes you no different than anyone else on this planet EXCEPT the way you practice sexual intercourse. That being said, it does not make you a diversity....it just makes you someone who has sex with same gendered individuals. Mine is not so much a moral outrage, as it is a "get over yourselves" outrage. If they want everyone to start treating them equally, start by NOT WANTING special treatment based on what you do in the bedroom behind closed doors.
Again, just because someone doesn't agree, you assume that I all of the sudden want to deny them their rights. Again, what right am I wanting to take away from them? Trying to force everyone to accept your way of life was not a right in this country last time I checked.

While I appreciate your stance and the sentiments behind, it overlooks (denies) the fact that homosexuals have been discriminated against, marginalized and denyed basic human rights for many many years based solely on what they do in their bedrooms. How anyone can fail to see that flummoxes me? It's like saying African Americans want special treatment based on the color of their skin. Absurd.

 

[Dark Knight]

kcksum, what special treatment are they looking for? To be treated the same as anyone else in this country isn't asking for anything special.

Outside of marriage, what are they being denied? Are they segregated from heteros in school? Do they have to use seperate drinking fountains and bathroom? Can they still vote? What are these other rights they don't have?

 

[southcitymom]

Outside of marriage, what are they being denied? Are they segregated from heteros in school? Do they have to use seperate drinking fountains and bathroom? Can they still vote? What are these other rights they don't have?

Well, marriage is a huge legal (not religious) contract that they are forbidden to enter into. This excludes them from numerous benefits. Can you imagine the United States saying a gay person couldn't enter into a legal sales contract to buy a house? And yet, we say a gay person can't enter into a legal contract to form a marriage partnership. Discriminatory.

United gay partnerships, absent this legal status, can't make healthcare decisions as a unit. This is huge. And it's discriminatory.

This official stance of discrimination seeps into our national consciousness and results in ugly realities. Higher rates of suicide (particular among gay teenagers), higher rates of substance abuse, higher chance of becoming victims of assault, etc..

We have come a long way in the past decade in this regard, but we aren't "there" yet. It is now "okay" to be openly gay in many areas of the country, but in many other areas, it would be a death sentence. I applaud the strides we have made as a nation, but we have to keep reaching for what is right in this struggle. It won't come easy because it never does with issues like this.

Future generations will look back on us many years from now and be (gently, I hope) befuddled at why we have to repeat the same mistakes over and over again until we finally figure it out....

 

[Dark Knight]

Future generations will look back on us many years from now and be (gently, I hope) befuddled at why we have to repeat the same mistakes over and over again until we finally figure it out....

Given the number of states that are banning gay marriage as part of their constitution (the rather liberal state of Michigan surprisingly being the most recent) I highly doubt we're moving in that direction, thankfully. A few states may allow it, but even those may change, as their standing is tenuous at best.

 

[southcitymom]

Given the number of states that are banning gay marriage as part of their constitution (the rather liberal state of Michigan surprisingly being the most recent) I highly doubt we're moving in that direction, thankfully. A few states may allow it, but even those may change, as their standing is tenuous at best.

Inter-racial marriages had a similar path, DK. And that's all fallen away like dust in the wind.

While this struggle is different, I admit, there are enough similarities to remain hopeful that reason and the basic premise that all men are created equal will pave the way for us to do what is right and not just what is easy.

 

[IrishMist]

Outside of marriage, what are they being denied? Are they segregated from heteros in school? Do they have to use seperate drinking fountains and bathroom? Can they still vote? What are these other rights they don't have?

1) Gays can't get insurance or benefits for their spouses.
2) Gays still risk losing their jobs if "outed".
3) Gays are still persecuted by the police.
4) Gay bashings still happen daily.
5) Gay marriages are not recognized by the state.
6) Gays are still denied adoption rights.

Heterosexuals can visit their critically injured partners in the emergency room and ICU...homosexuals can't.

Heterosexuals can inherit from their partners without expecting a raft of legal crap from their partner's parents...homosexuals can't.

That's a start. And, keep in mind, some of these things involve more than what's listed, as with the case for gay marriage. What I mean is, they are not just denied marriage, but a slew of benefits that marriage bestows.

 

[Amraann]

I think Irishmist summed it up nicely ..... In a nutshell they are not afforded equality.

The reality is that if those parents who are morally opposed to gays taught their children kindness and tolerance then this would not be an issue that the schools needed to address.

Avoiding this issue at home is just merely a convenience for the parents.
These children do not live in a bubble and they know about such topics even if mom and dad think they don't.
How can these children be taught in an environment that is hostile?? If they are not kind to each other then learning cannot begin.
Putting aside the religious aspect of this topic.... How do you all propose these children be taught without topics like being kind to each other being included?
Many are saying these topics need to be taught at home.... Often they are not or all children hear are nasty comments about those that are different.

 

[csds703]

Why shouldn't equal rights be a part of a school curriculum? I think it is a very relevant topic and should be taught in public schools.

 

[IrishMist]

Why shouldn't equal rights be a part of a school curriculum? I think it is a very relevant topic and should be taught in public schools.

That's what I was thinking, csds. There should be a stronger emphasis on Civics. IMO, when kids (and adults, for that matter) have a strong grasp on The Constitution, tolerance would follow.

 

[j2mirish]

I think Irishmist summed it up nicely ..... In a nutshell they are not afforded equality.

The reality is that if those parents who are morally opposed to gays taught their children kindness and tolerance then this would not be an issue that the schools needed to address.

Avoiding this issue at home is just merely a convenience for the parents.
These children do not live in a bubble and they know about such topics even if mom and dad think they don't.
How can these children be taught in an environment that is hostile?? If they are not kind to each other then learning cannot begin.
Putting aside the religious aspect of this topic.... How do you all propose these children be taught without topics like being kind to each other being included?
Many are saying these topics need to be taught at home.... Often they are not or all children hear are nasty comments about those that are different.

this comment will go right up most peoples crawl--- but I am gonna say it---the point is like Amaran says- it begins at home--- this is no means a bashing stmt on my kids behalf- the point is they understand it exists, they know it may not be a common thing, so that is why a 10 yr old made the comment he did- but I was glad to hear it, if that makes sense- I felt he knew there is another lifestyle-
My son and daughter were doing the I hate each other thing the other day- son made stmt about daughter going to grow up and be gay--althouht to some it may not sound good- I thought it was GREAT they at least understand it exisits--my daugher answer was so what?....told her little brother he was a loser with that comment !! :clap: :clap: :clap: