Patsy Ramsey

[2 percent]

IKR?

Why is it that many of the creepiest movies involve twins????

Now I wanna watch it :lol:

All I ever wanted to know about trifurcated cervixes, I learned in Dead Ringers :facepalm:

The Shining had twins
And then there's Star Wars and Game of Thrones...but their twins are creepy for a different reason ew ew ew

 

[bettybaby00]

All I ever wanted to know about trifurcated cervixes, I learned in Dead Ringers :facepalm:

The Shining had twins
And then there's Star Wars and Game of Thrones...but their twins are creepy for a different reason ew ew ew

Another creepy one :scared:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/1015710-other/#contentReviews

 

[Anti-K]

Another creepy one :scared:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/1015710-other/#contentReviews

is this based on a book? i'm pretty sure i read this when i was a teen.
...

AK

 

[Meara]

otg........what have we done?



:ghost: :noooo: :help: :Banane18: :ghost: :hills: :mummy: :help: :noooo: :ghost: :Banane18:

 

[CherCher]

And just think...the movie 'Dead Ringers' was based on a true story.

When I lived in upstate NY we had neighbors with a set of identical twins that were bad! We called them "The Krays" because they not only looked like them ( dark hair and blue eyes) but were very naughty boys. They were cruel to animals and people alike.

 

[gramcracker]

otg........what have we done?

:ghost: :noooo: :help: :Banane18: :ghost: :hills: :mummy: :help: :noooo: :ghost: :Banane18:

:notgood:

 

[CherCher]

Okay back to Patsy.
It's been suggested that since there were no reports of abuse EVER coming from the R household, that there was no way one of them could snap and even accidentally kill JB.

Things I've heard and seen in fine upstanding households with no record of abuse...

1. My son is an a-hole. And she proceeded to call him that over and over.
2. A wife who paid a credit card bill 3 days late and her husband laid into her asked me if I carried a gun because she wanted her husband dead.
3. I accidentally vacuumed up a customer's son's bag of heroin or cocaine that was under their bed. It clogged my vacuum. When it came to the attention of the Mom, she begged me not to mention it to the Dad and gave me a really nice Christmas bonus.
4. When the parents were "forced" to spend a lot of time with the children, they didn't handle it very well.
5. I am honor bound not to tell you the worst of what I've witnessed, but suffice it to say...

Just because there are no "reports" of wrongdoing, doesn't mean anything.

 

[CherCher]

There used to be a WSer who posted here and had the 2 unusual and identical letters that were in PR's handwriting and the RN handwriting as their icon or signature, can't remember which. You look at those 2 letters (and there were other examples as well), and tell me Ms. R didn't write that letter with a straight face.

 

[gramcracker]

Okay back to Patsy.
It's been suggested that since there were no reports of abuse EVER coming from the R household, that there was no way one of them could snap and even accidentally kill JB.

Things I've heard and seen in fine upstanding households with no record of abuse...

1. My son is an a-hole. And she proceeded to call him that over and over.
2. A wife who paid a credit card bill 3 days late and her husband laid into her asked me if I carried a gun because she wanted her husband dead.
3. I accidentally vacuumed up a customer's son's bag of heroin or cocaine that was under their bed. It clogged my vacuum. When it came to the attention of the Mom, she begged me not to mention it to the Dad and gave me a really nice Christmas bonus.
4. When the parents were "forced" to spend a lot of time with the children, they didn't handle it very well.
5. I am honor bound not to tell you the worst of what I've witnessed, but suffice it to say...

Just because there are no "reports" of wrongdoing, doesn't mean anything.

exactly. I had a housecleaning business, and it was a real eye-opener. if I hadn't personally experienced what people are capable of in "the best homes" I never would have believed it possible. but I was a lot younger then, LOL, and had a lot to learn about real life. but seriously, substance abuse, blatant disrespect, domestic violence, mental and verbal cruelty, emotionally neglected children, the list goes on and on. and these were the VIPs in our fairly small town. some people forget you're there and say/do things which should remain private. that's a lack of common sense or forgetting to use it. some cross the employee/employer boundary and confide things they shouldn't and even try to involve you in their situations. I don't know what that one is about. others assume that because they consider you deaf and blind, you are. that's arrogance

with all of the other evidence/indicators here, I believe the statements and opinions of the Ramsey household staff and I agree with CherCher

 

[CherCher]

Thanks gramcracker. Before I went on my own in house cleaning I worked for a service. I had to sign a "confidentiality agreement" to get the job because we had several high status clients. At the time, NJ didn't require house cleaners to be "mandated reporters" as well.

I will say this much...when I worked for the service we cleaned for a woman who was the sister of a short yet good looking actor who is known for action movies and maybe a vampire movie. Before the sister's child died from a horrible genetic disease (which is why the man will never have a son) she would SCREAM at her parents on the phone, would boss the nanny around like nobody's business, and completely forget that we were there.

 

[Venom]

I think it's suffice to say that NO ONE knows what went on behind the R's closed doors. Or any other home.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I think it's suffice to say that NO ONE knows what went on behind the R's closed doors. Or any other home.

That is completely true. So to assume the worst or crazy scenarios without any proof is just wrong.

In any other case we are not allowed to make accusations about people without proof or them being charged or evidence of abuse.. But in this case people have made patsy out to be a monster and there is just nothing to support it but rhetoric and fantasy.

It is a shame.

I think she was an odd duck. I think she was a southern lady who was steeped in custom and formality. But I don't see anything that points to someone who led a perfectly normal existence and then a horrific murder.

 

[Meara]

That is completely true. So to assume the worst or crazy scenarios without any proof is just wrong.

In any other case we are not allowed to make accusations about people without proof or them being charged or evidence of abuse.. But in this case people have made patsy out to be a monster and there is just nothing to support it but rhetoric and fantasy.

It is a shame.

I think she was an odd duck. I think she was a southern lady who was steeped in custom and formality. But I don't see anything that points to someone who led a perfectly normal existence and then a horrific murder.

What weight do you give to the Grand Jury indictment?

 

[gramcracker]

my maternal line is full of southern women steeped in custom and formality. their standards were formal enough that it was not their custom to tolerate or permit feces in the house anywhere except where it properly belonged, and certainly not littering children's bedrooms

this pattern of deflection, which actually does consist of rhetoric, happens any time reference is made to less-than-favorable statements by household staff. if their statements reflected favorably on PR they would be shouted from the rooftops

unfavorable comments by those with inside knowledge of and experience in the household should not be labeled as fantasy and rhetoric simply because the behavior was not captured on video/audio recordings

odd duck or dirty bird? mileage varies re that

 

[2 percent]

That is completely true. So to assume the worst or crazy scenarios without any proof is just wrong.

Hold on. While I agree speculation can get wild (I'm not necessarily referring to this case or this site), there are some things we know. No one is looking at a random woman with a bruise on her arm and stating it's a result of spousal abuse with no knowledge.
We're talking about a woman whose behavior has been observed and documented in police reports and other official capacity. Whose behavior was witnessed on several occasions before and after. Direct evidence of her behavior, if you will

Then we have the absolute reality of the prior molestation. While discussion of who did it remains speculative, the reality is that someone did it. In most cases of a child this young, it is family or friend. Statistically, the speculation that it was someone in the house who sexually assaulted her both prior and that evening is on firm ground - access, timing (very late at night), etc.

In any other case we are not allowed to make accusations about people without proof or them being charged or evidence of abuse. But in this case people have made patsy out to be a monster and there is just nothing to support it but rhetoric and fantasy.

Patsy is still a POI in this case.
A case has been made for her guilt that is no more based on rhetoric and fantasy than any other theory. And there is slightly more evidence against her than others.

I think she was an odd duck. I think she was a southern lady who was steeped in custom and formality. But I don't see anything that points to someone who led a perfectly normal existence and then a horrific murder.

The entire point of this leg of the discussion is that we don't really know Patsy did have a "normal existence". For all we know this was a long time coming.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

What weight do you give to the Grand Jury indictment?

None. An indictment does not mean guilt. It does not mean much. Many people are indicted and found not guilty.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Hold on. While I agree speculation can get wild (I'm not necessarily referring to this case or this site), there are some things we know. No one is looking at a random woman with a bruise on her arm and stating it's a result of spousal abuse with no knowledge.
We're talking about a woman whose behavior has been observed and documented in police reports and other official capacity. Whose behavior was witnessed on several occasions before and after. Direct evidence of her behavior, if you will

Then we have the absolute reality of the prior molestation. While discussion of who did it remains speculative, the reality is that someone did it. In most cases of a child this young, it is family or friend. Statistically, the speculation that it was someone in the house who sexually assaulted her both prior and that evening is on firm ground - access, timing (very late at night), etc.



Patsy is still a POI in this case.
A case has been made for her guilt that is no more based on rhetoric and fantasy than any other theory. And there is slightly more evidence against her than others.



The entire point of this leg of the discussion is that we don't really know Patsy did have a "normal existence". For all we know this was a long time coming.

Behavior is nothing more than an observation and someone's interpretation of that observation. Nothing more. It does not mean guilt. Nothing she did points to guilt. just oddness.

She was normal. She was never arrested, never charged with any crime. Never accused of child abuse, well except online.

That DNA proves it was not her there that night nor anyone she was related to.

Behavior means nothing. Really. Unless it is being observed burning clothes, or dumping bodies in a lake it means nothing.

Im sorry but in this case the only evidence against patsy comes from people not liking her. IMO

 

[2 percent]

Behavior is nothing more than an observation and someone's interpretation of that observation. Nothing more. It does not mean guilt. Nothing she did points to guilt. just oddness.

She was normal. She was never arrested, never charged with any crime. Never accused of child abuse, well except online.

That DNA proves it was not her there that night nor anyone she was related to.

Behavior means nothing. Really. Unless it is being observed burning clothes, or dumping bodies in a lake it means nothing.

Im sorry but in this case the only evidence against patsy comes from people not liking her. IMO

I have no feelings for her one way or another and I suspect her in this murder.
So we're back to DNA.
Or never left it :deadhorse:

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Evidence is not a dead horse. Evidence is not something that should be left out of the conversation.
DNA that points to someone other than an R should be something people take seriously.

 

[gramcracker]

behavior and/or demeanor most certainly are evidence. before, during and after an event. behavior/demeanor often reveal motive, truth and deception in ways that nothing else does

behavior = action(s) or lack of same
demeanor = affect, tone, manner