Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #8

[Tadpole12]

bolded by me.

What is "manslaughter for backlash"?

Hi C,

= crime of passion?

 

[legalmania]

ON
February 11, 2010 Father died from heart.
May 10th Money Wired from Alabama to Netherlands $15,000 this followed a cash payment of $10,000
May 14 Flew From Columbia to Peru
May 30th Death of Stephany 5 years after Natalee disappeared
June 2 body found
June 3 deported into Chile and apprehended, in a taxi
June 4 home in Netherlands raided
June 7 confessed
June 9 arrest

If I have it wrong please correct me it's a work in progress. I'm doing a timeline your input is more than welcomed.

 

[i.b.nora]

I am not 100% convinced now that Joran's confession is because of the computer. Now that it has come out that Beth's attorney set up this sting, and Joran found out about it, it's very possible that the murder of Stephany was pay back for "screwing" with Joran.

Joran was in Peru since May 14th and then on the 5th anniversay, another murder.

Link to the published information that Joran found out about the sting. please.

 

[epiphany]

However, Jane originally reported this morning that Joran went to the supermarket to get the coffee and Jane found out that the supermarket didn't open until 9:00 AM. I posted that video earlier today and when I heard the story about now it was the convenience store next to the gas station, I basically called Jane a few choice words. :banghead:

So it isn't me...I could see MikeB basically was setting the statement up for JeanC to correct/explain. LOL

 

[Chanler]

True, the extortion (sting) cetainly didn't drive him to kill, however the money made it easier to get to Peru!

Hi, Patty G. If one believes some reports, Joran was frequently seeking money. As one college friend of mine was fond of saying, "gamblers always want more money." It's difficult though to know whether he would have been able to finance his trip to the poker match in Peru or if he would have just gambled or done something else elsewhere.

I don't think of Joran as a systematic serial killer; I think of him as someone who nearing the end of his tether. Whatever happened on the beach in Aruba, he never showed himself cable of responding to his new notoriety in any healthy, responsible, or consistent way. Attempting to extort from Beth shows how weird and desperate he had become. Even ignoring its ghastly inhumanity, one must regard as a totally crazy, self-destructive plan.

 

[Tadpole12]

How will you keep the timeline from getting lost on a single thread type discussion? Could it be a daily sticky on the one thread we have?

Hi Texas.

yes a sticky for timeline, and a sticky for news links would make for better reference.

 

[nurselady]

Sitting down with a huge glass of Merlot,my laptop,gown, and slippers. Reading from way behind as usual,thanks to everyone for keeping us abreast with all the new developments.Can you believe they finally got him? Thank you..

 

[costalpilot]

bruising occurs premortem ie before the heart stops beating. This is why JVS story of giving her a karate chop doesn't fit what information we were given about the extent of Stephany's injuries. Her injuries sound more consistent with a brutal beating.. So I think his confession is a piece of BS. Blame the victim not yourself. Minimize your culpabilty in the crime. This case is murder plain and simple!!!!!

no kidding..i agree

 

[Nancy2441]

Here's what Jug Twitty had to say about JVDS godfather, Aruban Chief of Police Jan van der Straaten:

Twitty said, "We could have had the answers in the first couple of days down there had they done their job right. And this should have never happened what's happened in Peru. And I actually lay blame on the one person in particular, that's the (police commissioner, Jan van der Straten), in charge at that time. Because he knew what happened. And it just happened to be political connections and friendship that kind of let Joran slip off the hook."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/04/earlyshow/main6547535.shtml

 

[Chanler]

ON May 10th Money Wired from Alabama to Netherlands
May 14 Flew From Columbia to Peru
May 30th Death of Stephany 5 years after Natalee disappeared
June 2 body found
June 3 deported into Chile
June 4 home in Netherlands raided

If I have if wrong please correct me it's a work in progress. I'm doing a timeline your input is more than welcomed.

Hi, Legalmania, thanks. I think that June 3rd should read "deported from Chile to Peru."

 

[Patty G]

He didn't even know about the FBI sting operation until after he had killed Stephany.

Of course Joran knew it was a set up; THEY contacted Joran first. Joran is no dummy.

I can see Joran sitting there after being contacted by John Q. Kelly and what John Q offered. Joran is saying to himself; this is a setup.

 

[SoCalSleuth]

Do we know this for sure?

How would he have known? Apparently, he didn't know at the time or he would not have been sitting there accepting and counting the money. After he got the money, he took off to Columbia. Who would have told him? Plus, why would it even upset him? It's not an extradictable offense--he can look that up on the internet. Also, I don't think that Beth H., her attorney, or anyone, really believed he would tell the truth as promised. But once he contacted Kelly, a lawyer, Kelly knew this was a way to have him put in jail--for something. Maybe not for Natalee's disappearance, but for something.

 

[Patty G]

Hi, Patty G. If one believes some reports, Joran was frequently seeking money. As one college friend of mine was fond of saying, "gamblers always want more money." It's difficult though to know whether he would have been able to finance his trip to the poker match in Peru or if he would have just gambled or done something else elsewhere.

I don't think of Joran as a systematic serial killer; I think of him as someone who nearing the end of his tether. Whatever happened on the beach in Aruba, he never showed himself cable of responding to his new notoriety in any healthy, responsible, or consistent way. Attempting to extort from Beth shows how weird and desperate he had become. Even ignoring its ghastly inhumanity, one must regard as a totally crazy, self-destructive plan.

Just take one step backwards. It was Beth's attorney that contacted Joran. I could see your point If Joran contacted Beth, but it was the other way around.

If Beth's attorney didn't contact Joran and no money was exchanged, Joran would have had to find another way to get money or would not have been able to go to Peru. Joran won and loss basically in one poker game.

 

[Flow]

I found BH's lack of comment after the murder rather curious. Sadly this explained it. She must feel just terrible and partially responsible. I know I would feel that way. This is not a criticism of BH. I have nothing but admiration for her dogged pursuit of this monster and justice for her daughter.

Huh? I think I just now saw her on television. She looks somewhat different now but they said it was her.

I hope she did not take it upon herself to set up this sting.

I read up about T.Miller and Texas Equasearch this morning. He has a long-standing distrust of law enforcement according to what I read.

I'm sorry if I have offended anybody with my opinions. All of this is making me so uneasy that I feel sick to my stomach.

 

[RR0004]

WHAT? Shall we go back over all of Joran's stories about what happened to Natalie? I would think that is enough to know Joran wasn't working with a full deck. Another thought, Natalie last seen with Joran never to be seen again. BINGO!

Beth, John Q. Kelly, the FBI and even my dog knows Joran lied in all forms. Was everyone so stupid to think Joran was going to give them information regarding Natalie? Even though Joran basically lost because he murdered Stephany, he won the other way around as he got $25,000.00 and he didn't have to lift a pinky or utter a word.

Yes, they were messing with the wrong guy...but they thought (erroneously) at the time that money was his prime motivation...and it was. I find it hard to believe that they couldn't figure out that he'd take off. One look at his passport tells me that he'd hit the road with the money. But I can see how the Holloways and the FBI wanted to catch him on something...anything...and have him put away behind bars. But, and I don't know how this went down...but doesn't it sound a little like entrapment (don't hurt me!)?

 

[mosouri]

I need to think and type fast to catch up with these boards...this board is a fast mover..

I've been thinking about all the possible reasons she went with him to the hotel.

It was reported that when Eldin Garcia was interviewed by police, Garcia stated that he was with Joran and SF at the casino until the two left at 5 am. So I was wondering how was he "with" them...playing poker, drinking, etc. and what did they talk about. what plans of Joran and SF did Garcia know of? Did Garcia and Joran purposely pick SF out and got her drunk so she is coerced to leave with one of them? He said "we were going to have sex"..OH REALLY??

The reporter today said that Joran was well known in Peru through all the media hype about Natalie Holloway in Aruba. Did SF know about JVDS and Natalie Holloway and went with him out of curiosity? I'm sure these these travelling gamblers do their share of gossip and were fully aware of Joran's past as was Blades.

When Joran and SF stopped at the front desk, it looked like he had keys in his right hand and picked up the hotel key with his left. Did he drive Stephany to the hotel? Maybe he told her he would take her home because she had too much to drink and then stopped at the hotel instead and refused to give back the keys. Somewhat of a hostage situation. Was this to be a kidnapping situation gone out of hand?

And then she may have bought the laptop from Joran and went to the hotel to claim it. He collected the payment but decided not to hand over the laptop...(with all his personal info in the hard drive)....and as we know there are consequences for that.

I wouldn't be surprised if he was trying to secretly tape sex videos of her through the computer (webcam) (if possible), and she found out and freaked. I don't think they were arguing...they were fighting...her for her life.
That may sound far fetched but his game is sex, money, gambling.

If she tried to "escape" rather than "leave" and he broke her neck, she would have been paralyzed or close to it and not be able to defend herself...so did he break her neck and just beat her as she laid there defenseless. She could have been alive, or clinging to life when he left the hotel.

He is a pathological liar that we may never know what really happened.
And I can't imagine how he treats his mother...it seems in all the pictures I have seen of the two..she is literally clinging on to him. I wonder if she is codependent and is a victim of his abuse and lives in fear of him.

 

[Patty G]

Link to the published information that Joran found out about the sting. please.

I have no link to my thoughts.

 

[Patty G]

Yes, they were messing with the wrong guy...but they thought (erroneously) at the time that money was his prime motivation...and it was. I find it hard to believe that they couldn't figure out that he'd take off. One look at his passport tells me that he'd hit the road with the money. But I can see how the Holloways and the FBI wanted to catch him on something...anything...and have him put away behind bars. But, and I don't know how this went down...but doesn't it sound a little like entrapment (don't hurt me!)?

In the end, the good guys lost.

 

[RR0004]

Link to the published information that Joran found out about the sting. please.

It was just a "what if" scenario...IMO.

 

[Columbo]

Hi C,

= crime of passion?

Hi Tadpole,
Wow--sounds likely. That's one that really got lost in translation, for me anyway!
I wonder if "crime of passion" would fly in this case--I think of it as being something that happens with 2 people who are in a longer relationship and more involved.
Murder is murder and this guy's a sick puppy. (Hope that isn't considered name-calling)
Thanks!
C.